The Odyssey

[Voboy]

But if you don't care about Bluesky or know anything about it, why bring it up?

...you brought it up.

I replied generically, without realizing you wouldn't view it that way. Mea culpa.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

I meant "on Bluesky."

And I don't post on Bluesky... so this makes zero sense. I was observing what was being said in that cesspool and how it relates to this discussion.

 

[Voboy]

And I don't post on Bluesky... so this makes zero sense. I was observing what was being said in that cesspool and how it relates to this discussion.

LOL!

YOU mentioned "NPCs on Bluesky!" Not I.

We're talking in circles. Believe what you please. Seriously, enjoy your evening.

 

[Writer61]

Right, but other people called out people on Twitter but didnt mention anyone on Bluesky.

Other people. Not me.

So, either call out everyone, or drop your pretentious bullshit, and admit you are an intolerant bigot who can't handle people disagreeing with you.

I'm not "calling anyone out". Simply asking for people to judge the film on its own merits, as I have done. Can you do that?

 

[PennyThompson]

LOL!

YOU mentioned "NPCs on Bluesky!" Not I.

We're talking in circles. Believe what you please. Seriously, enjoy your evening.

this is exhausting you guys Kelliez has no intention of ever watching this movie or having a real opinion about it, they're just psychologically incapable of not getting the last reply in

 

[SimonDoom]

And yet we have Voboy and Writer61 trying to call me out... so here we are.

I don't think they are calling you out. They are responding to your unwarranted tetchiness. You're free to have your opinion. Some disagree with you. It's not personal. My recommendation: ease back a bit. Let's start over and not make it personal.

 

[Voboy]

this is exhausting you guys Kelliez has no intention of ever watching this movie or having a real opinion about it, they're just psychologically incapable of not getting the last reply in

So exhausting.

I'd suggest relaxing with a movie, but that might be taken the wrong way by those with fragile egos.

Anyway. I thought it was a good film.

 

[Writer61]

I'm out.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

Other people. Not me.

I'm not "calling anyone out". Simply asking for people to judge the film on its own merits, as I have done. Can you do that?

You are making bold claims about bias.
You claimed you called out both sides, but you keep avoiding providing any proof that you did.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

So exhausting.

I'd suggest relaxing with a movie, but that might be taken the wrong way by those with fragile egos.

Anyway. I thought it was a good film.

Yeah... someone might criticize casting, then the thin skinned will have to freak out and start name calling.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

I'm out.

Bye!

 

[ElectricBlue]

Just got the review from my mum (age 84) - "Looked pretty and was entertaining enough for 3 hours, but the actors didn't do much and it really needed some humour and a bit more sex in it." Which is a sentence I never thought I'd hear out of my mother's mouth, but I have to agree with her point that there's way more humour and sex in the source material than made it to screen. And that Damon was kinda a block of wood that stuff happened to. Given it's got that R rating, it is a bit surprising they didn't put any sex in at all.

I'm basically your mum, too. That was my take (my post above, only there to please @AwkwardlySet, but blanked so that poor old @SimonDoom can read only if he wants to).

What's the criteria for an R rating in the UK and US?

Here in Australian it's M, for violence, mature themes, and coarse language, which is a mild rating (parental guidance, really). We also have MA (technically, a 16 year old limit, add in sexual content or up the violence) and R (sexual content including full frontal nudity, extreme violence). Films aren't censored (except by the studio, if they want to target a lower rating), just the rating given on the film as presented to the Board.

M is typical of most releases these days. An R (which must be equivalent to Australia's MA) would seem excessive to me (especially given that it will stream in six months time).

She did start on a rant about the woke casting but was soon drowned out by my dad explaining that sailors in sea ports in the centre of known civilisations actually would have had the various skin colours shown in the film, and rare dark skin being seen as beautiful was hardly a stretch. He enjoyed it but would have liked a bigger screen.

The whole woke debate seems to be American bullshit, from what I can see. Black girl, so what? Trans actor, so fucking what (too short to be a soldier, but really?). It didn't strike me as A Movie With an Agenda, more a filmmaker trying to find a source for new content, having too many things to squeeze in, and needing a much more aggressive editor who would say no. Or two movies, paced much much better, with some human drama, not just looking good.

It's Cecil B DeMille for the twenty-first century. Remake Cleopatra next, and cast an Egyptian actress to really fuck the squealing "critics" minds up.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

this is exhausting you guys Kelliez has no intention of ever watching this movie or having a real opinion about it, they're just psychologically incapable of not getting the last reply in

Look at you, still full of unfounded assumptions! At least you are consistent.
I've seen the movie.
It was typical mid-tier Nolan.
The cinematography was great, the story scatterbrained. No one will be talking about it in 5 years.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

I'm basically your mum, too. That was my take (my post above, only there to please @AwkwardlySet, but blanked so that poor old @SimonDoom can read only if he wants to).


It's Cecil B DeMille for the twenty-first century. Remake Cleopatra next, and cast an Egyptian actress to really fuck the squealing "critics" minds up.

We already had the fight over Cleopatra....
https://www.newarab.com/features/netflixs-cleopatra-and-hollywoods-problem-colourism

 

[Voboy]

The whole woke debate seems to be American bullshit, from what I can see. Black girl, so what? Trans actor, so fucking what (too short to be a soldier, but really?). It didn't strike me as A Movie With an Agenda

I agree. I think Americans who want there to be an agenda are seeing an agenda. They are then finding a soapbox and loudly complaining about their perception.

Truthfully? I bet 90% or more of the Americans seeing this film are showing up, having some popcorn, and then leaving to go shop the mall. They're pondering how cheesy the collapsing-tower effects look and marveling that Hathaway is still so attractive.

My perception (and it is just my perception) is that 21st century America is a place where a loud minority, on all sides, tends to dominate debate about a whole host of issues. The majority doesn't really care. They're more concerned about how much the popcorn costs.

"Culture wars" say a lot about the people fighting them. To wit, people who want there to be culture wars will perceive evidence of them. Most of the rest of America probably doesn't care much about all that.

 

[GuiltyCowboy]

My perception (and it is just my perception) is that 21st century America is a place where a loud minority, on all sides, tends to dominate debate about a whole host of issues.

To be fair, there's a very long history in the USA of interest groups using films to promote their agenda, the Legion of Decency being the most notable one.

And I can see why: you often hear people dismissing cinema as, well, 'just a film' but films are story-telling for huge, huge audiences - and those stories can have an awful of lot of sway in the world. Who is on the big screen, and how they're portrayed, is pretty significant.

 

[ElectricBlue]

My perception (and it is just my perception) is that 21st century America is a place where a loud minority, on all sides, tends to dominate debate about a whole host of issues. The majority doesn't really care. They're more concerned about how much the popcorn costs.

"Culture wars" say a lot about the people fighting them. To wit, people who want there to be culture wars will perceive evidence of them. Most of the rest of America probably doesn't care much about all that.

From the outside looking in, the culture wars seem to be a product of the current US political and moral climate these last ten years, and a major distraction from the first world problem that we've actually got.

My conclusion, being a film addict for more decades than many of the noisy posters here have been alive, is that it's not Nolan's worst movie, but a long way from his best.

I read something the other day that said he looked towards Tarkovsky's Andrei Roublev and Kurosawa's Ran for inspiration. That's the most blatant grab for cinematic artistry I've seen in a very long while, a critic going for a really big stretch. I doubt Odyssey will be on Best Film lists in fifty years time, but I'd put my money on those two still.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

To be fair, there's a very long history in the USA of interest groups using films to promote their agenda, the Legion of Decency being the most notable one.

And I can see why: you often hear people dismissing cinema as, well, 'just a film' but films are story-telling for huge, huge audiences - and those stories can have an awful of lot of sway in the world. Who is on the big screen, and how they're portrayed, is pretty significant.

There is a rather strong case to be made that Birth of a Nation led to a resurgence of the Klan in the US.
Films can be powerful things.

 

[Kelliezgirl]

From the outside looking in, the culture wars seem to be a product of the current US political and moral climate these last ten years, and a major distraction from the first world problem that we've actually got.

My conclusion, being a film addict for more decades than many of the noisy posters here have been alive, is that it's not Nolan's worst movie, but a long way from his best.

I read something the other day that said he looked towards Tarkovsky's Andrei Roublev and Kurosawa's Ran for inspiration. That's the most blatant grab for cinematic artistry I've seen in a very long while, a critic going for a really big stretch. I doubt Odyssey will be on Best Film lists in fifty years time, but I'd put my money on those two still.

The culture wars in the US go much further back than the last 10 years.
Tipper Gore (wife of former Democratic VP Al Gore) spearheaded the Parent's Musical Resource Committee to get warning labels on CDs to "save the children" almost 40 years ago.

 

[GuiltyCowboy]

I read something the other day that said he looked towards Tarkovsky's Andrei Roublev and Kurosawa's Ran for inspiration.

My word. Was that a critic making that claim for him or did Nolan actually say that himself?

 

[Voboy]

I doubt Odyssey will be on Best Film lists in fifty years time, but I'd put my money on those two still.

I don't really disagree. I think it'll end up being a bottom-half Nolan movie, but I do believe that Nolan's 49th percentile is a FAR higher standard than maybe 90% of the total output of the English-speaking film industry. I think he's been that transformational as a filmmaker in this century.

I'm old enough to have been paying attention when Memento came out. EVERYONE at the time was talking about what a revelation it was, and it still holds up.

 

[ElectricBlue]

My word. Was that a critic making that claim for him or did Nolan actually say that himself?

I can't recall, to be honest. Something I read on the Oz ABC newsfeed, but I don't know if Nolan said it, or the reviewer said it for him.

 

[ElectricBlue]

The culture wars in the US go much further back than the last 10 years.
Tipper Gore (wife of former Democratic VP Al Gore) spearheaded the Parent's Musical Resource Committee to get warning labels on CDs to "save the children" almost 40 years ago.

Yes, I know that, but it's far worse this last decade than it was prior. It's a self-feeding beast nowadays because of social media and less critical thinking from the consumers.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I don't really disagree. I think it'll end up being a bottom-half Nolan movie, but I do believe that Nolan's 49th percentile is a FAR higher standard than maybe 90% of the total output of the English-speaking film industry. I think he's been that transformational as a filmmaker in this century.

True that. He's set a high bar for himself, and is the number one innovator these days, for sure.

I'm old enough to have been paying attention when Memento came out. EVERYONE at the time was talking about what a revelation it was, and it still holds up.

Indeed. Like many of the best directors' early movies do. Ridley Scott is the other supremo example of that, with a mixed body of work because he's so productive. Alien and Bladerunner? The essence of brilliant cinema.

After Kubrick died, I wondered for a long while who would inherit the World's Greatest Living Director title, and for me it always came down to Scott or Nolan. I'm personally inclined towards Nolan, probably because he handled the 50th anniversary restoration of 2001 A Space Odyssey extremely well (from the original master negative), so kudos for that.

That's why, for me, this one was disappointing, after Oppenheimer, which I thought was exceptional.

 

[Voboy]

Indeed. Like many of the best directors' early movies do. Ridley Scott is the other supremo example of that, with a mixed body of work because he's so productive. Alien and Bladerunner? The essence of brilliant cinema.

Have you seen The Duellists? His first picture?

It's slightly uneven, but overall it's amazing. The composition of each scene is something he paid clear attention to, and stills from that movie look like Romantic paintings. It was the first movie I ever saw where I said to myself, "wow. That shot looks fuckin' beautiful."

The acting... well. Occasionally it's suspect. But Scott storyboarded and directed like a pro.

Alien is breathtaking.