Uncrossing The Rubicon.

[coati]

My post stands as written.

If you believe that the "new" regime in Iran is going to just forgive & forget the grievous insults & injuries inflicted by America (DonOld & the MAGAt republicans, really) and direct that $300 BILLION into purely peaceful endeavors, then my post was PARTIALLY written for you (there WERE / ARE less obvious points being made in the OP).

Keep thinking magical thoughts.





We. Told. Them. So.

Actually, you're the one thinking magical thoughts if you're still going for regime change and suddenly expecting that the USA is off the hook for reparations. The Pig has no cards. An old armchair poster on the porn board is not going to change that situation.

I have no illusions about the resentments caused by the mass assassinations and bombing attacks engineered by Netanyahu and the Pig.

Yes, there will be consequences. Nothing magical about that.

 

[Lazaran]

President Pig was following Netanyahu's lead. The Pig wanted to get in on what he thought was a slam dunk "victory". He wanted to get in on the glory.

Following Netanyahu's lead was a huge mistake. Netanyahu groomed the Pig, stiffed Obama, and played the GOP against the Democrats.

Like the Pig's other big mistakes, the USA will be dealing with the consequences for a long time.

When you're trapped in a hole, don't keep digging. The last thing we need right now is GOP hawks foolishly sinking us deeper in a quagmire

You are simultaneously right and wrong.

Yes, Netanyahu played DonOld - but one could easily argue that Netanyahu had good reason.

Netanyahu rightly recognized that Iran’s WAR strategy of “death by a thousand cuts (proxies, gray zone warfare, terror, etc)” was untenable for Israel’s survival.

Netanyahu saw an opportunity with DonOld’s stupidity / vanity / grandiosity / narcissism and wisely exploited that opportunity.

Netanyahu got DonOld to “cross the Rubicon”, and NOW it IS what it IS / HERE we ARE.

You obviously have the right to believe that stopping short of ACTUAL regime change in Iran is the best move, but I strongly disagree.

The other shoe WILL drop if this "new", enriched, MORE radical, MORE hardline Iranian regime is allowed to stay in power. And when that other shoe drops, it is going to make 9/11 & 10/7 look like non-events.

Of course, I have little doubt that Israel is going to end Iran decisively with or without U.S. assistance if Iran continues to fuck around. But the main problem under that scenario is the fact that Israel would probably have to employ nuclear strikes to achieve their goal. Meanwhile: The U.S., with a well thought out strategy, a strong coalition, and proper resources could probably liberate the freedom hungry Iranian people in fairly short order. And that is better than Israel going nuclear (imho). Bottom line: IF Iran (Hezbollah, Hamas, the Houthis, etc) keeps fucking around, then Israel WILL (imho) use nukes rather than succumb to Iran’s “death by a thousand cuts (proxies, gray zone warfare, terror, etc)”.

It IS what it IS…



WE. TOLD. THEM. SO.

 

[coati]

The U.S., with a well thought out strategy, a strong coalition, and proper resources could probably liberate the freedom hungry Iranian people in fairly short order.

Good luck with that. Maybe you could get hawks on this porn board to send a petition to Lindsey Graham or Mike Pence. Saint_Ann might sign the petition..

Or maybe Fetterman if you want a Democrat who denies reality.

Hell, the Pig and Netanyahu thought they could liberate Iran in short order (a few days or at most two weeks), so you've got that going for you.

 

[dmallord]

Giving Iran billions of dollars and control of the Strait of Hormuz was a loss. The brutal repression of the Iranian people continues apace. The war accomplished nothing.

Depends on the perspective. Oil companies are making a killing at the pumps. Fertilizer salesmen are doing better. Trump’s up a billion or so. Iran’s getting its assets unfrozen for the first time in years and gets a new source of revenue from ships in the strait. Other countries will get lower oil prices… eventually, because Iran opened the straits.

Munition companies got reorders, so that’s a plus.

On the flipside… every American got fucked. And some of them say they like it, and it was worth the price for not getting a promise to collect the nuclear-grade dust Trump just blew off in his signed agreement.

 

[Lazaran]

Good luck with that. Maybe you could get hawks on this porn board to send a petition to Lindsey Graham or Mike Pence. Saint_Ann might sign the petition..

Or maybe Fetterman if you want a Democrat who denies reality.

Hell, the Pig and Netanyahu thought they could liberate Iran in short order (a few days or at most two weeks), so you've got that going for you.

I’ll just say this:

This is NOT going to end well IF the current Iranian regime remains in power and gets $300 BILLION (plus whatever other money the "strait management fees" rake in…).

I expect the Iranians will develop a drone force with their new wealth that will make any attempt at curbing their malign acts impossible. And an accelerated clandestine nuclear weapons program will obviously be in the works.

A belated MAJOR terror attack is obviously also in the cards (probably 3-5 years from now) as "reprisal" for the MANY insults & injuries the "new" regime feels they (the "old" regime & their proxies) were unfairly subjected to.

And again: The Israelis WILL be making their own plans to counter the Iranians - which includes a nuclear option…



We. Told. Them. So.

 

[Saint_Ann]

I’ll just say this:

This is NOT going to end well IF the current Iranian regime remains in power and gets $300 BILLION (plus whatever other money the "strait management fees" rake in…).

I expect the Iranians will develop a drone force with their new wealth that will make any attempt at curbing their malign acts impossible. And an accelerated clandestine nuclear weapons program will obviously be in the works.

A belated MAJOR terror attack is obviously also in the cards (probably 3-5 years from now) as "reprisal" for the MANY insults & injuries the "new" regime feels they (the "old" regime & their proxies) were unfairly subjected to.

And again: The Israelis WILL be making their own plans to counter the Iranians - which includes a nuclear option…



We. Told. Them. So.

They were doing that already.

 

[Raazor]

When you're trapped in a hole, don't keep digging. The last thing we need right now is GOP hawks foolishly sinking us deeper in a quagmire

Yes, stop digging makes sense. Even better don’t dig a hole in the first place. But, handing Iran everything it wants (and more) is simply the US starting to dig a different hole.

 

[Buffalogurl]

You are simultaneously right and wrong.

Yes, Netanyahu played DonOld - but one could easily argue that Netanyahu had good reason.

Netanyahu rightly recognized that Iran’s WAR strategy of “death by a thousand cuts (proxies, gray zone warfare, terror, etc)” was untenable for Israel’s survival.

Netanyahu saw an opportunity with DonOld’s stupidity / vanity / grandiosity / narcissism and wisely exploited that opportunity.

Netanyahu got DonOld to “cross the Rubicon”, and NOW it IS what it IS / HERE we ARE.

You obviously have the right to believe that stopping short of ACTUAL regime change in Iran is the best move, but I strongly disagree.

The other shoe WILL drop if this "new", enriched, MORE radical, MORE hardline Iranian regime is allowed to stay in power. And when that other shoe drops, it is going to make 9/11 & 10/7 look like non-events.

Of course, I have little doubt that Israel is going to end Iran decisively with or without U.S. assistance if Iran continues to fuck around. But the main problem under that scenario is the fact that Israel would probably have to employ nuclear strikes to achieve their goal. Meanwhile: The U.S., with a well thought out strategy, a strong coalition, and proper resources could probably liberate the freedom hungry Iranian people in fairly short order. And that is better than Israel going nuclear (imho). Bottom line: IF Iran (Hezbollah, Hamas, the Houthis, etc) keeps fucking around, then Israel WILL (imho) use nukes rather than succumb to Iran’s “death by a thousand cuts (proxies, gray zone warfare, terror, etc)”.

It IS what it IS…



WE. TOLD. THEM. SO.

You believe the jews will employ nuclear weapons against Iran? Welp lazie, I'm inclined to agree with you....
However when the jews do as such they (the jews) will become an absolute pariah in the eyes of the world. Very similar to that fat fuck in North Korea, no one will do business of any sort with them ..... in fact north Korea has publicly stated that if the Israelis nuke Iran, that fat fuck in North Korea will nuke Israel. Also the North Koreans don't buy into "the chosen people" story.
So go ahead Israel, nuke Iran and F.A.F.O..... you (the Israelis) will discover that the entire world's population will quickly learn to despise you....

 

[Buffalogurl]

Depends on the perspective. Oil companies are making a killing at the pumps. Fertilizer salesmen are doing better. Trump’s up a billion or so. Iran’s getting its assets unfrozen for the first time in years and gets a new source of revenue from ships in the strait. Other countries will get lower oil prices… eventually, because Iran opened the straits.

Munition companies got reorders, so that’s a plus.

On the flipside… every American got fucked. And some of them say they like it, and it was worth the price for not getting a promise to collect the nuclear-grade dust Trump just blew off in his signed agreement.

Remember dmallord, exactly who embroiled the US in this shitfuckery what pissed me off is the the Don went along with this cluster fuck.
We as a nation should remove all of our assets from the middle east and let these insane people just "have at it" then concentrate our efforts domestically at building oil refineries that will process Texas sweet crude.. fuck'em...

 

[coati]

Yes, stop digging makes sense. Even better don’t dig a hole in the first place. But, handing Iran everything it wants (and more) is simply the US starting to dig a different hole.

Your last sentence sounds like you may be having a hard time accepting that Iran out-maneuvered the Pig because of their economic leverage in the Strait. Remember, the Pig has been desperate for a deal since early last March. This MOU is about his 40th attempt.

The art of the deal, indeed.

Americans and Israelis continue to have a hard time accepting that military shock and awe on its own does not constitute effective international policy.

 

[coati]

Depends on the perspective. Oil companies are making a killing at the pumps. Fertilizer salesmen are doing better. Trump’s up a billion or so. Iran’s getting its assets unfrozen for the first time in years and gets a new source of revenue from ships in the strait. Other countries will get lower oil prices… eventually, because Iran opened the straits.

Munition companies got reorders, so that’s a plus.

On the flipside… every American got fucked. And some of them say they like it, and it was worth the price for not getting a promise to collect the nuclear-grade dust Trump just blew off in his signed agreement.

Yes. Winners and losers. The Pig don't give a shit, as long as his portfolio increases in dollar value. Because when you die, the one with the most money wins, am-i-rite?

Despite this overt insanity, the greedy and cowardly GOP refuses to fire the bastard.

 

[Pad_Foot]

There are lines in this that promise that WE .. The U.S, ? Will reduce our insane WAR department budget ??

Maybe STOP before we invest in Trump Destroyers to fight EPIC battles from the last MILLENNIUM!!

Gee? I thought we were all eager to up that budget from one Trillion dollars to 1.5 Trillion as our new Trillionaire most likely gets PAID in lord corporate welfare than he has ever paid in taxes … all combined !!

The King loves his Oligarchs!! Our Oligarchs love USING him as their meat puppet in gang bangs.

 

[dmallord]

Remember dmallord, exactly who embroiled the US in this shitfuckery what pissed me off is the the Don went along with this cluster fuck.
We as a nation should remove all of our assets from the middle east and let these insane people just "have at it" then concentrate our efforts domestically at building oil refineries that will process Texas sweet crude.. fuck'em...

Unfortunately, isolationism is no longer the ’new norm’ that the Don would like to have. Our oil refineries would need billions in updates to handle our needs and address what you wish for. Oil companies are global conglomerates, not just prone to making America great again; profit drives their shareholders as well, so the idea that they would pour resources into becoming isolationists is a fantasy. A number of threads here have said that oil prices in America are driven by what goes on overseas, not because we have and use our own oil. It, I suspect, will get worse as the Fed has, on the Don’s orders, released millions of gallons of underground oil reserves to drive down our current gas pump prices. He’s manipulating the market to appease drivers. What does that tell you?

Somewhere down the line, those reserves have to be restored by another President. The new one will get the blame for adding that cost, most likely, as Trump is off in Scotland or somewhere playing with sub-eighteen-year-olds again. Seen any of those Epstein files released lately?

Trump owns the not-a-war war over there. Amazing that the greatest power in the world just ‘obliterated’ a fourth world country, and we are giving them everything they wanted while declaring we won, the war is over, we won biggly. Fuck’em as you noted. I’m in agreement.

 

[Buffalogurl]

Unfortunately, isolationism is no longer the ’new norm’ that the Don would like to have. Our oil refineries would need billions in updates to handle our needs and address what you wish for. Oil companies are global conglomerates, not just prone to making America great again; profit drives their shareholders as well, so the idea that they would pour resources into becoming isolationists is a fantasy. A number of threads here have said that oil prices in America are driven by what goes on overseas, not because we have and use our own oil. It, I suspect, will get worse as the Fed has, on the Don’s orders, released millions of gallons of underground oil reserves to drive down our current gas pump prices. He’s manipulating the market to appease drivers. What does that tell you?

Somewhere down the line, those reserves have to be restored by another President. The new one will get the blame for adding that cost, most likely, as Trump is off in Scotland or somewhere playing with sub-eighteen-year-olds again. Seen any of those Epstein files released lately?

Trump owns the not-a-war war over there. Amazing that the greatest power in the world just ‘obliterated’ a fourth world country, and we are giving them everything they wanted while declaring we won, the war is over, we won biggly. Fuck’em as you noted. I’m in agreement.

You've got a pretty fair assessment..... I believe you're correct about investing billions in refinery infrastructure, just not gonna happen here in the lower 48...

 

[RobDownSouth]

Is there a quote where Trump ever said regime change was the goal. If you can't come up with a direct quote then you're a lying piece of shit......................but we already knew that.

Here you go, Ishmael: Trump's long flip flops on "Regime Change", culminating with Trump advocating for the textbook definition of regime change in Iran on February 28th of this year, without actually mouthing the words "regime change".

Walks like a duck, etc.

See also: Israel/Genocide.

 

[Saint_Ann]

Here you go, Ishmael: Trump's long flip flops on "Regime Change", culminating with Trump advocating for the textbook definition of regime change in Iran on February 28th of this year, without actually mouthing the words "regime change".

Walks like a duck, etc.

See also: Israel/Genocide.

If he said it, great, because everyone would be ok with it, except you and your TDS addled brain.

 

[Raazor]

Your last sentence sounds like you may be having a hard time accepting that Iran out-maneuvered the Pig because of their economic leverage in the Strait. Remember, the Pig has been desperate for a deal since early last March. This MOU is about his 40th attempt.

The art of the deal, indeed.

Americans and Israelis continue to have a hard time accepting that military shock and awe on its own does not constitute effective international policy.

No, I’m pointing out that the foolish actions of the US have raised the status of Iran to a significant regional power and that will have major consequences for the region. What is more the US has not only emboldened Iran but is in effect financing the regime and by definition its terrorist proxies.

As I said, the US has begun digging another hole. Trump is an utter moron so no great surprise that it has a) turned out badly and b) is creating more problems further down the line.

 

[Saint_Ann]

No, I’m pointing out that the foolish actions of the US have raised the status of Iran to a significant regional power and that will have major consequences for the region. What is more the US has not only emboldened Iran but is in effect financing the regime and by definition its terrorist proxies.

As I said, the US has begun digging another hole. Trump is an utter moron so no great surprise that it has a) turned out badly and b) is creating more problems further down the line.

Too bad nobody tried to stop N.Korea. They have way better missiles (thanks to the Clinton's).

 

[ll74]

 

[stxjimmy]

Is there a quote where Trump ever said regime change was the goal. If you can't come up with a direct quote then you're a lying piece of shit......................but we already knew that.

• • 14 February 2026

US President Donald Trump says regime change in Iran is "the best thing that could happen", signifying one of his clearest endorsements for replacing the clerical establishment.
"For 47 years, they've been talking and talking and talking. In the meantime, we've lost a lot of lives," he said on Friday.
Trump declined to specify who he wanted to lead Iran, but noted "there are people" who could take over. bbc

 

[Lazaran]

No, I’m pointing out that the foolish actions of the US have raised the status of Iran to a significant regional power and that will have major consequences for the region. What is more the US has not only emboldened Iran but is in effect financing the regime and by definition its terrorist proxies.

As I said, the US has begun digging another hole. Trump is an utter moron so no great surprise that it has a) turned out badly and b) is creating more problems further down the line.

You got most of my point.



I would only add:

Remember (during his FIRST TERM) when Trump ASSASSINATED IRAN’S NATIONAL HERO, moved the American embassy in Israel into Jerusalem, excluded the "Palestinians" from the Abraham Accords, went full "MAXIMUM PRESSURE!!!" on Iran, and went full anti-Arab / anti-Islam xenophobe on immigration, etc, etc, etc???

Then remember when Iran & their proxies BELATEDLY retaliated on 10/7 and DonOld & the MAGAt republicans took ZERO responsibility for THEIR OWN actions (listed in the above paragraph) that DIRECTLY CONTRIBUTED to the BELATED retaliatory 10/7 attack by Hamas (Iran).

Welp, get ready for the bigger, badder sequel. Because when the inevitable BELATED retaliation from Iran happens (likely via a terror proxy) as a BELATED response to DonOld & the MAGAt republicans’ RECENT actions (ASSASSINATING THE AYATOLLAH, KILLNG ALL THOSE SCHOOLGIRLS, sinking Irans Navy, destroying Iran’s Air Force, etc, etc), DonOld & the MAGAt republicans will likely be out of office AGAIN, and they will AGAIN accept ZERO responsibility / culpability for any BELATED terror attack (which will likely take place 3-5 years from now).

Bottom line:

DonOld & the MAGAt republicans are going to memory hole (or try to) all the fucked up things they did RECENTLY (listed in the above paragraph) that DIRECTLY CONTRIBUTED to the inevitable occurrence of the NEXT terror attack - just like they did when 10/7 occurred. And low-information, low-intelligence voters will likely be oblivious - AGAIN.



We. Told. Them. So.

 

[coati]

No, I’m pointing out that the foolish actions of the US have raised the status of Iran to a significant regional power and that will have major consequences for the region. What is more the US has not only emboldened Iran but is in effect financing the regime and by definition its terrorist proxies.

As I said, the US has begun digging another hole. Trump is an utter moron so no great surprise that it has a) turned out badly and b) is creating more problems further down the line.

Yes, following Netanyahu into a war of choice led to the Pig surrendering to Iran after failing for three months to get a better exit deal.

Yes, there will be extreme consequences for the USA.

 

[coati]

You got most of my point.



I would only add:

Remember (during his FIRST TERM) when Trump ASSASSINATED IRAN’S NATIONAL HERO, moved the American embassy in Israel into Jerusalem, excluded the "Palestinians" from the Abraham Accords, went full "MAXIMUM PRESSURE!!!" on Iran, and went full anti-Arab / anti-Islam xenophobe on immigration, etc, etc, etc???

Then remember when Iran & their proxies BELATEDLY retaliated on 10/7 and DonOld & the MAGAt republicans took ZERO responsibility for THEIR OWN actions (listed in the above paragraph) that DIRECTLY CONTRIBUTED to the BELATED retaliatory 10/7 attack by Hamas (Iran).

Welp, get ready for the bigger, badder sequel. Because when the inevitable BELATED retaliation from Iran happens (likely via a terror proxy) as a BELATED response to DonOld & the MAGAt republicans’ RECENT actions (ASSASSINATING THE AYATOLLAH, KILLNG ALL THOSE SCHOOLGIRLS, sinking Irans Navy, destroying Iran’s Air Force, etc, etc), DonOld & the MAGAt republicans will likely be out of office AGAIN, and they will AGAIN accept ZERO responsibility / culpability for any BELATED terror attack (which will likely take place 3-5 years from now).

Bottom line:

DonOld & the MAGAt republicans are going to memory hole (or try to) all the fucked up things they did RECENTLY (listed in the above paragraph) that DIRECTLY CONTRIBUTED to the inevitable occurrence of the NEXT terror attack - just like they did when 10/7 occurred. And low-information, low-intelligence voters will likely be oblivious - AGAIN.



We. Told. Them. So.

Yes, the Pig and Netanyahu formed an ego agreement against Obama's Middle Eastern policies and the JCPOA..

Yes, there were and will continue to be extreme consequences to the USA for the Pig following Netanyahu's strategy and tactics.

Effective international policy involves much more than aggressive military actions.

 

[Lazaran]

Yes, the Pig and Netanyahu formed an ego agreement against Obama's Middle Eastern policies and the JCPOA..

Yes, there were and will continue to be extreme consequences to the USA for the Pig following Netanyahu's strategy and tactics.

Effective international policy involves much more than aggressive military actions.

Yep.

And Iran (etc) sucks balls as well.

As long as Iran (etc) remains a terror threat and a destabilizing force in the region, corrupt leaders (Trump & Netanyahu) will be able to exploit the situation to distract from their own criminal acts and failing policies when it comes to domestic governance.



Ironically, Democratic policies (the JCPOA, diplomatic calls for freedom, sanctions, isolation, etc) had the Iranian regime on the brink of collapse - but the right AND "the left" "thought" DonOld & the MAGAt republicans could do better…

Oops…



We. Told. Them. So.

 

[stxjimmy]