A serious discussion about BDSM and weight

[Recidiva]

I'm sure people are offended by my level of offendedness.

...can I use this as a sig quote?

I have a crush on you, I can't help it.

 

[castagnus]

I guess I'm not done quoting others yet, even when I said I wasn't gonna.

And it makes me want to just . . . I don't know. But I try to just walk away. Not worth the effort involved.

Cheer up BeachGurl - and thank you for starting this most instructive thread - a lot of what has been said here makes a lot of sense and I appreciate the insight and candor of its many contributors. But it took courage for you to iniate this.

The few little arrows slung at you remind me of ancient Chinese saying:

"Man who sticks head above crowd must expect brick in face".

Keep your head held high !

 

[Recidiva]

Cheer up BeachGurl - and thank you for starting this most instructive thread - a lot of what has been said here makes a lot of sense and I appreciate the insight and candor of its many contributors. But it took courage for you to iniate this.

The few little arrows slung at you remind me of ancient Chinese saying:

"Man who sticks head above crowd must expect brick in face".

Keep your head held high !

Yes, there is another one:

"If you speak the truth, have a foot in the stirrup." - Turkish Proverb

Fortunately the internet is really just one big stirrup.

 

[BeachGurl2]

Sorry, it's not up to the person making the statement, whatever it might be, as to whether or not they're offensive statements, offense is in the eye of the affected. I agree that you've done a pretty good job of trying not to be offensive, but a bunch of people have pointed out some fallcies. Fallacies that are rooted in their own personal experiences - I don't get it. Whatever cat, bb, or recidiva had to say about it it's like "yes, but, that's not what I meant, or I ackowledge that there may be other reasons that you might be big BUT that's not what I'm talking about..."


The way these things work is that people say something really offensive about a group of people who are already persecuted enough, those people explain their reality and then it's "gee you're all SO sensitive" turning the pity party back onto the person who made the comment in the first place.

It's not about you. You asked, you are hearing the reality and opinion of real live fat people and it's not jiving with the answers you must have been hoping for on some level. What exactly, are you hoping people tell you?

I'm sure people are offended by my level of offendedness. That's fine. I'm simply explaining how some of these statements strike me, as someone who's done fat/not/fat again, and liked herself OK though the changes and thinks there are other things in the world to worry about more.

Like why the poor don't have real food in their neighborhoods.

I actually didn't have preconceived notions about what people would say beyond expecting some level of offense from some people because it is a very touchy subject. And I'm not offended by your offendedness. Actually, I like how you say it like it is without couching it in a bunch of garbage. I have difficulty doing that and wish I were better at it.

I had hoped that since I've come at it from multiple angles personally myself that people might realize I have some valid questions and points. But I also realize that some of my comments have been taken to mean something I didn't intend. No worries. It's largely the medium. It's hard to understand what a person might mean when you can't hear their tone or see their expressions. And people don't really know me, so they don't know the personal struggles I've had beyond what I am able to express here. And I have a very strong feeling that there are those here who don't believe me anyway. That's okay, I expected that, too.

I knew when I posted this thread that it would bring to the forefront strong feelings. I have my own strong feelings about it when people make comments in the reverse, but since it's about thin people, it's okay. The same sort of stereotyping but in reverse. Just like the race arguments or the religion arguments. One group can be bashed, but if you say anything at all about the other group, whether positive or negative, it's not allowed. I get that. It's okay. And I'm not going to pretend that my thoughts are all altruistic because yes, there is some level of personal preference within it. But it's really not any different from the person who prefers to date redheads or atheletes. Everyone has their preferences and shouldn't be bashed for those preferences. But when the preference is expressed as being physically fit or a thinner body type, then people automatically jump on them as being shallow and unrealistic. So it does have validity within the discussion. Although that wasn't my point, it is still part of the whole. And people keep trying to bring it back to that as if that's the point, that it is what leads the thoughts in my head. And it's not. But no matter how many times I say that, people won't believe it. So it's okay. Just silly, in my opinion.

I respect your right to be offended by the topic and the discussion. I respect your right to post your opposing views and I have no problem hearing what you and everyone else is saying. I don't believe that I'm backtracking on my point in any way. I've said more than once that it is partly asthetic for me as well. I would be lying if I said otherwise. So would everyone else.

 

[Netzach]

...can I use this as a sig quote?

I have a crush on you, I can't help it.

Of course, and it's mutual, if I've not said it before.

 

[Netzach]

I actually didn't have preconceived notions about what people would say beyond expecting some level of offense from some people because it is a very touchy subject. And I'm not offended by your offendedness. Actually, I like how you say it like it is without couching it in a bunch of garbage. I have difficulty doing that and wish I were better at it.

I had hoped that since I've come at it from multiple angles personally myself that people might realize I have some valid questions and points. But I also realize that some of my comments have been taken to mean something I didn't intend. No worries. It's largely the medium. It's hard to understand what a person might mean when you can't hear their tone or see their expressions. And people don't really know me, so they don't know the personal struggles I've had beyond what I am able to express here. And I have a very strong feeling that there are those here who don't believe me anyway. That's okay, I expected that, too.

I knew when I posted this thread that it would bring to the forefront strong feelings. I have my own strong feelings about it when people make comments in the reverse, but since it's about thin people, it's okay. The same sort of stereotyping but in reverse. Just like the race arguments or the religion arguments. One group can be bashed, but if you say anything at all about the other group, whether positive or negative, it's not allowed. I get that. It's okay. And I'm not going to pretend that my thoughts are all altruistic because yes, there is some level of personal preference within it. But it's really not any different from the person who prefers to date redheads or atheletes. Everyone has their preferences and shouldn't be bashed for those preferences. But when the preference is expressed as being physically fit or a thinner body type, then people automatically jump on them as being shallow and unrealistic. So it does have validity within the discussion. Although that wasn't my point, it is still part of the whole. And people keep trying to bring it back to that as if that's the point, that it is what leads the thoughts in my head. And it's not. But no matter how many times I say that, people won't believe it. So it's okay. Just silly, in my opinion.

I respect your right to be offended by the topic and the discussion. I respect your right to post your opposing views and I have no problem hearing what you and everyone else is saying. I don't believe that I'm backtracking on my point in any way. I've said more than once that it is partly asthetic for me as well. I would be lying if I said otherwise. So would everyone else.

There's something you bring up that I can't agree more with. The body hate has got to quit period. I'm sick of hearing how much happier skinny people have to be, or "eat a sandwich for crying out loud" or whatever or ripping people apart for eating whatever's out of the norm, whether that means lettuce and lemon or giant sized ribs. There's backlash and bullshit aimed at smaller/thinner people. I wish everyone could see it's all part of the same damn racket.

I have my own aesthetic preferences too, there's nothing wrong with that. Angelina Jolie is not in 'em. I can get into BBW's sexually, but I have my preferences too, and when the waist-hip ration goes away entirely, I'm out. It's arbitrary and mean as attraction is. Men of the size of the same women I find attractive are out too, it's unfair but it's life.

Then there's also another thing between "looking" and "not looking" people. M could grow another head and he's still M. Maybe the people who are partnered also have another set of hackles going up because the viewpoint's different.

I've never really seen mainstream personals ads people being bashed for something like "HWP, you be too"

But I've got over a decade of skimming over "No Bi's or druggies" in lesbian want ads. Thanks, thanks a lot.

 

[BeachGurl2]

Cheer up BeachGurl - and thank you for starting this most instructive thread - a lot of what has been said here makes a lot of sense and I appreciate the insight and candor of its many contributors. But it took courage for you to iniate this.

The few little arrows slung at you remind me of ancient Chinese saying:

"Man who sticks head above crowd must expect brick in face".

Keep your head held high !

I like both of those quotes.

I expected the arrows, so no worries. My frustration comes out of the idea that it's not okay to initiate this discussion in any form because it's about a group of persecuted people to begin with. I think with that mentality, the issues will never be addressed. It's okay. I expected to have the comments that it's all about being shallow and bigotted. I'm just glad the thread went 4 whole pages of really good discussion before it happened.

 

[Recidiva]

Of course, and it's mutual, if I've not said it before.

Well, when I first got here you promised next life we'd be gay men together.

I have hopes.

 

[BeachGurl2]

There's something you bring up that I can't agree more with. The body hate has got to quit period. I'm sick of hearing how much happier skinny people have to be, or "eat a sandwich for crying out loud" or whatever or ripping people apart for eating whatever's out of the norm, whether that means lettuce and lemon or giant sized ribs. There's backlash and bullshit aimed at smaller/thinner people. I wish everyone could see it's all part of the same damn racket.

I have my own aesthetic preferences too, there's nothing wrong with that. Angelina Jolie is not in 'em.

I absolutely agree. And I believe that is a huge factor that contributes to the problem on both sides - those who gain too much and those who lose too much. Having done both - gained too much and lost too much - I know that issue played a huge factor for me. And I'm guessing for most others as well. So can we safely talk about that topic? Because I believe it's a big factor in the entire issue.

As to Angelina Jolie, not my type, either. I prefer my partner to have a little bulk, even though the people here don't think that's true.

 

[Harmony_1985]

I am how I am, accept it or get lost.

And if you judge me purely on my size, then you're not really worth the time.

 

[Netzach]

Well, when I first got here you promised next life we'd be gay men together.

I have hopes.

That would be so absurdly hot. I'm in.

 

[Netzach]

I absolutely agree. And I believe that is a huge factor that contributes to the problem on both sides - those who gain too much and those who lose too much. Having done both - gained too much and lost too much - I know that issue played a huge factor for me. And I'm guessing for most others as well. So can we safely talk about that topic? Because I believe it's a big factor in the entire issue.

As to Angelina Jolie, not my type, either. I prefer my partner to have a little bulk, even though the people here don't think that's true.

Well, you're not toeing the line if you aren't kind of in the middle of the pack weight wise and perpetually feeding the diet industry in the hopes of looking like angelina - not fully disordered one way or another, but never happy.

That's where you're SUPPOSED to be.

Because if people started paying as much attention to what you do as to how you look, the current systems would be under threat.

I can't stand being around FA types of people some of the time because their hatred of skinny people and their vicious taking apart of anyone who has changed her shape or her habits successfully is too painful. Some of them get it. Fat acceptance is body acceptance, period.

Acceptance and an unwillingness to be unhappy doesn't make me unable to restart my diet and lose 30 pounds, or walk 12 miles a week. Or doing those things *because* I like myself, not to like myself more.

 

[castagnus]

I like both of those quotes.

I expected the arrows, so no worries. My frustration comes out of the idea that it's not okay to initiate this discussion in any form because it's about a group of persecuted people to begin with. I think with that mentality, the issues will never be addressed. It's okay. I expected to have the comments that it's all about being shallow and bigotted. I'm just glad the thread went 4 whole pages of really good discussion before it happened.

Again, thanks for hanging in there. At the risk of sounding offensive, what's so bad about being "judgemental" ? Every waking moment is a series of making and acting on judgements. Right now I choose to answer your posting rather than that from someone else. In a few moments I'll probably choose to sit at the piano for a while rather than stay logged on. And so on ..

I believe that in order to chart a sensible life, one must continually be judgemental - that is not to say that one should purposely go out and unnecessarily hurt people's feelings - but certain things must be said for there to be progress. I believe you have gone out of your way to be tactful but if this is offensive to some, they have the same right to speak out.

To reach into my throve of worthwhile sayings once more, one of my Native American friends once told me :"White man speaks with forked tongue - but I shall defend to the death his right to speak with forked tongue"

and:

"The truth shall set you free - but first it will piss you off"

I learned a long time ago not to be offended by those criticising me - many of those who did often turned out to be very nice people.

 

[nh23]

So all of that said, if you’re still with me on this, I do have a few questions for the group.

Is it just my own perception, or does this lifestyle seem to have an unusually high percentage of overweight individuals who are active within it? Or do you think that those within the lifestyle mirror those in society as a whole?

I don't think it's this lifestyle, just society in general. Like others have said we are bigger now as a society than we have ever been.

If you are in a D/s or M/s dynamic, is your partner in the same physical state (meaning physically fit or overweight) that you are in or are you physically opposites?

Yep. I'm 5'2 and about 220-230 lbs. I carry my weight funny because I'm really top heavy. I wear an I or J cup bra. I also have a hourglass shape where my waist dips in so it's harder than hell to buy jeans that don't gap at the waist and still fit my ass..LOL.

My previous Dom was 6'3 and about 190 pounds. Very muscular and in shape. He fights in UFC fighting matches, so he's very concerned about exercise, eating etc. My Master is about 5'9 and weighs around 185. He played hockey for many years and has the body to match.

As a Dominant/Master, do you encourage your submissive/slave to be health conscious? If not, is it because it is not important to you or because you are attracted to someone who is BBW?

The previous Dom never said a word to me about my weight or eating habits. Only that he thought I looked like a real woman in his opinion. He liked curves. Master and I have a bit of a different dynamic since we are 24/7 TPE and he gets to see everything I eat, my activity level etc. What he's on my ass the most about honestly is to eat more. It's his opinion that I'm heavy because I don't eat enough. I pick at my food and eat random things instead of eating meals.

I'm already very active. I have two children with ADHD, and I work full time as a pediatric nurse. I also maintain my household, the cooking, cleaning etc. So I'm moving the majority of the time.

If you are overweight, do you find that you have difficulty being as physically active as you would like to be? Are you comfortable being partially or fully unclothed if you play in public or at private parties with others?

I have no problem being as physically active as I want to be. I'm blessed with a lot of stamina and can usually outlast Master, who is by no means overweight. I'm also weirdly flexible for a fat chick. I'm as uncomfortable with public play as I assume all women are. It's been my experience that other women are far more judgmental of other women's bodies than men are. So I'm more comfortable nakie around men than I am most women.

Yes, as I said, this post has a point. I wonder how many in D/s or M/s relationships have Dominants who are in control enough and care enough to help motivate their submissive/slave to get and stay healthy. My post is not so much about weight (although I’m sure many here will think it is) but is about physical health. We do a lot of physically draining activities. If you aren’t in decent physical shape, how much enjoyment are you able to get out of them?

As the Dominant, shouldn’t the physical well-being of all parties be up to you? I’m curious as to how you may see your role in the physical well-being of not only yourself, but those under your care.

This kind of annoys me because it seems to imply that if a PYL is not regulating someones diet and exercise they don't care about them, or are not in control. Like others have stated the majority of people who thought I should lose weight was because I would be more attractive if I was thin. I'm also a smoker..oddly enough none of them cared about that.

I also saw a morbidly obese young woman in head to toe designer clothing, with a ridiculous amount of makeup and hair products, a very expensive pair of shoes on and a designer purse, carrying one of those tiny handbag dogs, which was also decked out in matching designer gear. I mean... why? What's the point of spending a small fortune on your appearance if you're not going to cosmetically enhance yourself by eating a bit less and doing a bit more? I have to say, that lady made me chuckle in an 'only in LA' fashion.

My best friends are thin women. They never make me feel like I'm an less attractive than they are, but they do yell at me about the way I dress. I wear baggy clothes like most bigger women do. They once took me on a shopping spree to buy me some clothes that fit my body. I have to agree I look really nice in these outfits. It makes me feel good to wear them. The reason I don't wear them often? Because I fear that people will make the kind of statements about me that you made here. She's a fatass anyway, why bother to try to look nice. I suppose I should dress like a fattie with my sweatpants and big tee's.


And Netzach made some good points. My children are thin. They are extremely active due in part to the ADHD. They adore fruits and veggies and will pick them over sweets. Thing is I'm on a very tight budget. Have you seen the price of fresh fruits lately? It costs a buck for a box of snack cakes, and upwards of three dollars for a small carton of strawberries. I still try to buy the healthiest things for them. But in the real world, thing that are less healthy are a hell of a lot easier on my budget. It's a sad fact.

 

[Etoile]

I also have a hourglass shape where my waist dips in so it's harder than hell to buy jeans that don't gap at the waist and still fit my ass..LOL.

My wife has this exact problem! What brands have you been successful with? What she really needs right now is a good pencil skirt for work...she bought one at Kiyonna but although the ass fit, it was way too big at the waist.

As for BDSM and weight being the topic of the thread because it's an "increasing trend"...you could say the same thing about gamers. Lord knows I know a lot of really fat gamers. I am a really fat gamer myself come to think of it! But wait, gamers can blame their weight on sitting on their asses playing games instead of getting up and out, right? So it's still all kinksters' fault for being fat. If they would just exercise/eat right/take care of themselves/have a little self respect/have a little self control/etc then they'd slim down and match everybody else's view of what size they should be.

 

[the captians wench]

Okay, I'll admit, Angilina, except for the fact she's a chick, is what I go for.

Gerold Buttler, deffo in a heart beat, but more the "P.S. I love you" look than the "300" look. I like tone, athletic, but not rippling muscles.

But then, I tend to go for the nerdy looking guys anyway. You know, tall and thin, glasses optional. If I get the hockey goalie, sweetness! Otherwize I'm in the gamer pool....but again *shallow moment* only the slimmer ones.

I used to feel bad about it, but now I don't let it bother me. I'm attracted to what I'm attracted to, and sexual attraction has a huge impact on whether you get a shot with me or not. I know what I like, sorry if that's offensive, but that's me.

 

[Recidiva]

Okay, I'll admit, Angilina, except for the fact she's a chick, is what I go for.

Gerold Buttler, deffo in a heart beat, but more the "P.S. I love you" look than the "300" look. I like tone, athletic, but not rippling muscles.

But then, I tend to go for the nerdy looking guys anyway. You know, tall and thin, glasses optional. If I get the hockey goalie, sweetness! Otherwize I'm in the gamer pool....but again *shallow moment* only the slimmer ones.

I used to feel bad about it, but now I don't let it bother me. I'm attracted to what I'm attracted to, and sexual attraction has a huge impact on whether you get a shot with me or not. I know what I like, sorry if that's offensive, but that's me.

Thumbs up on Gerard Butler.

Yeah, but I'd also go for Queen Latifah in a heartbeat. And I'm straight.

 

[Netzach]

And Netzach made some good points. My children are thin. They are extremely active due in part to the ADHD. They adore fruits and veggies and will pick them over sweets. Thing is I'm on a very tight budget. Have you seen the price of fresh fruits lately? It costs a buck for a box of snack cakes, and upwards of three dollars for a small carton of strawberries. I still try to buy the healthiest things for them. But in the real world, thing that are less healthy are a hell of a lot easier on my budget. It's a sad fact.

I hate to harp on this but I REALLY see a class component to this equation, a huge glaring one - the same people who can afford bypass surgeries, plastic surgeries and two hours per day at the gym because someone else watches the spawn are going to vilify the ones who can't even afford a half hour to cook and run the companies to *keep them that way*

someone else's lesiure time is because someone else is overworked.

Sorry, happy labor day everyone.

 

[BeachGurl2]

Okay, I'll admit, Angilina, except for the fact she's a chick, is what I go for.

Gerold Buttler, deffo in a heart beat, but more the "P.S. I love you" look than the "300" look. I like tone, athletic, but not rippling muscles.

But then, I tend to go for the nerdy looking guys anyway. You know, tall and thin, glasses optional. If I get the hockey goalie, sweetness! Otherwize I'm in the gamer pool....but again *shallow moment* only the slimmer ones.

I used to feel bad about it, but now I don't let it bother me. I'm attracted to what I'm attracted to, and sexual attraction has a huge impact on whether you get a shot with me or not. I know what I like, sorry if that's offensive, but that's me.

I don't think you should have to apologize for what you like. And I also don't think that because you like one, you're bigotted against the other on either side of things.

I personally like them the size of a linebacker. I just want them to be in decent physical shape and to enjoy being active. And I guess that's offensive as well. But that's life.

 

[Netzach]

The great thing about this is that there really is a lid for every pot. I like them shaved and willing to wear eyeliner. I think some of the issue is that when the mainstream enforces what you like as the only thing to like there's going to be some backlash among people who don't fit it, and feel like they finally have found a niche in which there's something other to like than a manly man with a washboard gut and someone trying to fit the Angelina mold.

Also, it's kind of neat when someone wants me to touch him purely because I'm capable of doing disgusting things to his balls that make us both happy, rather than because I look any particular way one way or the other. It's rare, but it can happen.

 

[Netzach]

I'm attracted to what I'm attracted to, and sexual attraction has a huge impact on whether you get a shot with me or not. I know what I like, sorry if that's offensive, but that's me.

I'm very shallow and physical about my fucking. I'm the first to admit it. T and H are "hot to me" hot, T probably more so to other people whereas M is hot, period. To most sentient humans. He confessed to me that he was always worried about people looking at him and feels really looked at and kind of upset about it, and I was like, honey - you are more attractive than 80 percent of ANY given room about the face, I know you may not see it but it's fact. They are *noticing* you.

I'm "fighting above my weight" in that regard, seriously. I like that. It got my attention, obviously other things have kept my attention since.

I really don't care what people I don't intend to fuck look like though, honestly, I can't think of anything more boring to worry about. I do worry about the "obesity epidemic" from an economic, distribution, class, and social standpoint. But the visual of it isn't the part that alarms me.

 

[BeachGurl2]

This kind of annoys me because it seems to imply that if a PYL is not regulating someones diet and exercise they don't care about them, or are not in control. Like others have stated the majority of people who thought I should lose weight was because I would be more attractive if I was thin. I'm also a smoker..oddly enough none of them cared about that.

I can understand why reading the way I wrote that would suggest that I meant the PYL should be able to control it. I didn't word it very well, I don't think. Really what I was getting at was that the PYL is in a position to influence. And unlikely enough, if the pyl is the one largely in charge of meals, then I'm guessing the influence comes from both directions. Some PYLs control the menu, some don't. Some influence, some don't. My question was largely asking is that the kind of influence you have or desire.

I guess I think of it like this. For me, pleasing my PYL is of utmost importance. So just about any area of my life could easily be influenced by his desires. If he wanted me to behave in certain ways, I would give it my all to do so. So my question wasn't meant to sound like he had the ability to control it, but to influence it. I just worded it badly, like I seem to have worded others things badly as well.

As to the control question, I haven't really addressed that, have I? I think that when you're already in a long term relationship, you look at each other a little differently than when you are single and searching. You've grown together, shared both good and bad together. It's a give and take. That give and take comes with time and knowledge of each other. When you are searching for a partner, a lifemate, you look at potential partners a little differently, I think. It's much easier to see the 'whole' of a person you've spent lots of time getting to know. It's much more difficult to see the 'whole' of a person you're just getting to know. You only see what that person presents to you. And because of that, it's a judgment call - is this a person I want to know more about?

It works both ways. I've had many men walk away when viewing my picture because I wasn't attractive enough or young enough or whatever enough. If I took it personally every time, I'd be a basket case of insecurity. I don't walk away because someone is overweight - unless he's lied about his appearance. Then I walk away because he lied to me. If I've exchanged enough communications with someone to suggest that we have enough in common to meet, I want to explore that. So unless it's that instant 'turn off' chemistry that you have with some people, I'm going to spend time getting to know someone. That's just who I am. But more often than not, I'm not the one walking away. And every time, it's been for superficial reasons. It's very hard not to be jaded by that.

And Netzach made some good points. My children are thin. They are extremely active due in part to the ADHD. They adore fruits and veggies and will pick them over sweets. Thing is I'm on a very tight budget. Have you seen the price of fresh fruits lately? It costs a buck for a box of snack cakes, and upwards of three dollars for a small carton of strawberries. I still try to buy the healthiest things for them. But in the real world, thing that are less healthy are a hell of a lot easier on my budget. It's a sad fact.

My oldest, who is 21, is in excellent shape. She has that naturally thin body type, but with curves. My youngest, who is almost 14, has more rounded body type, and is closer to the top end of her healthy weight range, but still healthy within it. Both are very physically active, neither has a sedentary lifestyle. And they've both always been that way. They both have normal eating habits, I think, for their age group - if there's pizza or burgers around, they'll eat them, but they choose fruits and veggies more often than not. I buy both healthy and unhealthy snack food, but try to have more of the healthy available when I can afford it. It's a sad fact that it's much cheaper to provide junk food than healthy food. But we try to watch it as much as possible.

It's frustrating to note that schools feed them the most atrocious foods. The school lunch at the high school is $2.50 and consists of chicken nuggets, pizza, tacos, fries, or mystery meat in gravy. But they have a salad and sandwich bar that is $4. So Bratgirl gets $5 a day for lunch - $4 for the salad/sandwich bar and $1 for a can of Arizona tea. She refuses to eat the other food and if she forgets her money or doesn't have enough, she doesn't eat rather than eat the stuff she doesn't much like. I'd rather give her the $5 a day than have her not eat.

 

[midwestyankee]

I've been following this thread from the beginning but haven't posted before this because I don't have a whole lot to say that has much authority behind it. My own history with weight gain and loss is minimal so I don't have much personal history from which to speak. My experience out and about among folks in the lifestyle is also somewhat limited so I would never consider making an observation based on so little empirical evidence.

That said, I do want to spend my tuppence here. I have noticed that as a society we in the U. S. seem to have adopted the belief that thin is the new moral. Thin is not necessarily healthy but we are a superficial bunch and so we've settled on the "thin is good" line of belief. I don't quite get it, but then I don't get the insane market for new golf clubs every year. It's not the clubs, guys, it's your golf swings.

Anyway, so much of our cultural beliefs these days are fashioned from marketing plans it's more than a little scary.

Those who struggle to eat wisely and to feed their children non-fattening foods on a limited budget are real heroes of parenting. They get it and it's a damn shame that the development of our industrial food chain has led to such a disheartening and dangerous situation.

 

[nh23]

My wife has this exact problem! What brands have you been successful with? What she really needs right now is a good pencil skirt for work...she bought one at Kiyonna but although the ass fit, it was way too big at the waist.

I have yet to find anything that fits well. I live in a smaller area though and don't have a lot of choices as a bigger person. I have a couple pair of lower cut Levi's that fit me pretty well, otherwise I'm pretty much looking at wearing a belt.

 

[nh23]

I hate to harp on this but I REALLY see a class component to this equation, a huge glaring one - the same people who can afford bypass surgeries, plastic surgeries and two hours per day at the gym because someone else watches the spawn are going to vilify the ones who can't even afford a half hour to cook and run the companies to *keep them that way*

someone else's lesiure time is because someone else is overworked.

Sorry, happy labor day everyone.

*nods* I totally agree. What I was thinking about today to is the price of prepared foods. Four days a week I leave my house at 6am and don't get home until almost 8p. I can run through McDonalds and get them a burger and fries for a couple of dollars. A six inch sub with fresh veggies at subway is $5 or better. They do love those apple dippers at McDonalds so I'll get those for them. And when I have the funds to get something better I do. But the truth of the matter is some days I just don't have the money to buy better. Sometimes I'm at my last $20 for the week and have to get what I can afford.

My little one's are lucky not to have my body type though..LOL. They are both thin and tall for their age. I do make a constant effort to try to teach them what is best to eat and what is not. My daughter is also really good about telling me..(she's 7..lol) Life would just be so much easier if things that were better for them were cheaper.