Dear X:

[Que]

Jerk vs Nice Guy

Thanks for that! It's good to hear that I'm not alone on this.

I'd love to be able to wave a magic wand and transform into the type of unjustifiably self-confident (i.e. arrogant) person that I tend to despise, but I'm unable to contemplate that even though all of the evidence suggests that those personalities are valued more highly and regarded as more successful.
.

I, too, had problems with the whole concept of "the jerk" getting the girl seemingly so often. I put some thought and reading and observational analysis into it...mind If I share what I gleaned?

Girls like certain things that "Jerks" (as we see it) offer them...but it isn't mistreatment (although, sure...that happens at times when they fall for actual jerks).

They do like confidence and that isn't so hard to project when you genuinely like your own character. Obviously, we all have traits that give us pause, work on those.

The best advice I ever heard on the concept of the negative compliment is think of the woman you are talking to as your best friend's slightly bratty younger sister. Tease her a bit, but don't be hurtful. It's more fun for them if they have to work a little to get your attention. Especially true if they are very used to double takes and stares.

Why do I include this in a discussion on confidence? Because by NOT putting her on a pedestal (so you can look up her skirt -Steve Martin) you are implying without at all being rude that you are on equal footing. She is a person with needs and desires as are you. Being obsequious is not warranted with someone that you have no relationship with. You are talking to her to find out if your needs and desires intersect with hers.

The opposite of that is the "Nice Guy" routine. That used to be me til I decided to knock that the fuck off! Why did I change? because it was ineffective? sure...But also because I came to realize it is RUDE.

Seriously. You are putting a woman on the spot...she HATES having to reject people and the longer you give her to dread that, the WORSE it is. It starts with, "Oh, he seems nice, I hope I don't hurt his feelings.." before she has actually decided on rejecting you. By backing off, giving her space and NOT ladling on the compliments...(which she really hasn't earned in her mind, she looks beautiful from her genes and is charming from her upbringing)..you give her a chance to see you as a MAN worthy of HER pursuit, possibly.

It's a matter of changing your frame. I am not a big proponent of wholesale "fake it til you make it, because it generally comes across as fake (go figure.) That said, there's nothing wrong with squaring your shoulders, broadening your stance, lengthening your stride. Act as if you belong and you will.

 

[Mindfondler]

I didn't intend my original post in this thread to open up in this way!

At the risk of going slightly off-topic for a moment, I'd like to take the opportunity to reply to the above.

Oi, do I have to get the kipper out?
Both of you are lovely blokes.
I have the priviledge to get to know both of you and please let me say, I would not have spent so much time with you if you were the personality type that you both seem to be looking for.
Please be happy in your skin, you are both fun, articulate and good company.
I know nothing of your looks, Mal is a green hobbit and MF a pair of muddy legs, and in the schem of things they don't matter. Just keep on being you

Don't make me use the fish!

Please don't use the fish!

I really appreciate your kind words. Of course, I do believe what you say, and I'm very grateful to have your friendship. It's just that it's sometimes difficult to accept deep down that I'm worthy and not just incredibly lucky.

On second thoughts, maybe you'd better get the fish out!

Why would you ever become someone you despise?

I agree they seem to be valued as more successful amongst many, however, just because they are valued does not mean these people or those around them are happy. I know and have known people like this and many are on their second to fifth marriage with children who want to run as far away from them as possible.

Self confident does not have to be arrogant, it has more to do with self acceptance of whatever you are at that point. You are a nice man, trustworthy in a decades long sex filled marriage with a wife who takes pictures for you to post on lit, do you realize how unusual that is? You may have gotten a late start or not have as much experience with others as many here do, but you are a lucky one who found your match so all of the other stuff wasn't needed.

That you have a great body and all is just packaging, a combo of an accident of birth and running, which in some ways is probably another accident of birth because many people are not physically structured to run.

If I had a magic wand I could wave over you, I would do it so you could accept and be happy with yourself as you are and with what you have which is so much more than most people do.

What you say is logical and rational, but it doesn't address my deep fear that I've just been very fortunate and that I don't possess the intrinsic qualities to justify this.

I think the allure of outright arrogance, despite my deep distaste for it, is the sheer certainty that it brings. If your ego is the size of a minor planet, there's no room for indecision, self-doubt, or second thoughts. Bizarrely, that's often a recipe for success.

I, too, had problems with the whole concept of "the jerk" getting the girl seemingly so often. I put some thought and reading and observational analysis into it...mind If I share what I gleaned?

Girls like certain things that "Jerks" (as we see it) offer them...but it isn't mistreatment (although, sure...that happens at times when they fall for actual jerks).

They do like confidence and that isn't so hard to project when you genuinely like your own character. Obviously, we all have traits that give us pause, work on those.

The best advice I ever heard on the concept of the negative compliment is think of the woman you are talking to as your best friend's slightly bratty younger sister. Tease her a bit, but don't be hurtful. It's more fun for them if they have to work a little to get your attention. Especially true if they are very used to double takes and stares.

Why do I include this in a discussion on confidence? Because by NOT putting her on a pedestal (so you can look up her skirt -Steve Martin) you are implying without at all being rude that you are on equal footing. She is a person with needs and desires as are you. Being obsequious is not warranted with someone that you have no relationship with. You are talking to her to find out if your needs and desires intersect with hers.

The opposite of that is the "Nice Guy" routine. That used to be me til I decided to knock that the fuck off! Why did I change? because it was ineffective? sure...But also because I came to realize it is RUDE.

Seriously. You are putting a woman on the spot...she HATES having to reject people and the longer you give her to dread that, the WORSE it is. It starts with, "Oh, he seems nice, I hope I don't hurt his feelings.." before she has actually decided on rejecting you. By backing off, giving her space and NOT ladling on the compliments...(which she really hasn't earned in her mind, she looks beautiful from her genes and is charming from her upbringing)..you give her a chance to see you as a MAN worthy of HER pursuit, possibly.

It's a matter of changing your frame. I am not a big proponent of wholesale "fake it til you make it, because it generally comes across as fake (go figure.) That said, there's nothing wrong with squaring your shoulders, broadening your stance, lengthening your stride. Act as if you belong and you will.

Despite what may have come across in my postings, the eternal "jerk versus nice guy" conundrum isn't really a hot button for me. In my younger days, it might have been a convenient excuse that I trotted out when I never seemed to get beyond the "friendship barrier" with a lady, but I don't think that I ever really believed it. In reality, I've always accepted that different types attract a diversity of people.

Your observations on chatting to women are interesting, though, because I noticed that they correspond very strongly to the way that I behave with my female friends -- and with my wife. I'll tease regularly, but always with positive intentions and a twinkle in my eye, and I expect to get teased back. Any lady who responds well to that gains my respect, because it shows that they don't take themselves too seriously.

Inevitably, this means that I don't tend to get on with women who are cold, harsh or poker-faced, even if they can score top marks for their looks in a lads magazine. This was a mistake that I made repeatedly whilst dating -- the assumption that I had to put the woman on a pedestal and play entirely to her tune in order to gain her affections. It didn't work for me -- ever!

Sorry to clog this thread with my ramblings! I hope that I've done justice to the responses that I received (and didn't expect!). Once again, many thanks for those.
.

 

[Sweetdaisymae]

Dear X,

I have been straight with you from the outset, you knew what my life entails, so please do not have the gall to use my personal circumstances as an excuse to distance yourself.
If you do not want my friendship, fine! I do not wish to know someone who plays games.
Goodbye!

 

[LallyH]

Dear X,

I have been straight with you from the outset, you knew what my life entails, so please do not have the gall to use my personal circumstances as an excuse to distance yourself.
If you do not want my friendship, fine! I do not wish to know someone who plays games.
Goodbye!

*lots of hugs*

 

[Malich]

Dear X,

I have been straight with you from the outset, you knew what my life entails, so please do not have the gall to use my personal circumstances as an excuse to distance yourself.
If you do not want my friendship, fine! I do not wish to know someone who plays games.
Goodbye!

*hugs also.

 

[Mindfondler]

Dear X,

I have been straight with you from the outset, you knew what my life entails, so please do not have the gall to use my personal circumstances as an excuse to distance yourself.
If you do not want my friendship, fine! I do not wish to know someone who plays games.
Goodbye!

*more hugs*

 

[Malich]

Dear B

Ok, you don't really know me but I wanted to thank you. You're the first person I've met in the last 3 months that has made both my mind and my body scream out "Oh my. I WANT her!"

You're also the first person I've not looked at and compared to K.

So, thank you for the chat and thank you for the sudden feeling of hope for the future.

Mal.

(Ha, bet some of you never expected to see a positive post from me in this thread!)

 

[Mindfondler]

Dear B

Ok, you don't really know me but I wanted to thank you. You're the first person I've met in the last 3 months that has made both my mind and my body scream out "Oh my. I WANT her!"

You're also the first person I've not looked at and compared to K.

So, thank you for the chat and thank you for the sudden feeling of hope for the future.

Mal.

(Ha, bet some of you never expected to see a positive post from me in this thread!)

Awww... that's lovely!
.

 

[Malich]

Awww... that's lovely!
.

Thanks. It's not going anywhere, but was nice to feel that desire for someone again without any real guilt

 

[Sweetdaisymae]

Thanks. It's not going anywhere, but was nice to feel that desire for someone again without any real guilt

Yippeeeeeee!!

 

[Malich]

Yippeeeeeee!!

Thankee

 

[BiBunny]

Dear Underage Boys "Borrowing" Your Parents' Credit Cards To Call Phone Sex,

The only way you're going to get away with doing this is to make me believe that you really are older than 18, and you have to do it so well that I don't even question for a moment that you're the actual holder of the credit card.

Blurting out "I WANNA HAVE PHONE SEX!!!!!!" when I answer the phone is so totally not the way to do it.

Dumbasses.

~Your (Un)friendly Neighborhood Dispatcher

 

[onlydreams]

Dear X,
Yesterday was a horrible day, everything that could go wrong most certainly did.
The worst by far was your thinking you didn't matter, that all your gentle, kind thoughts and words were being ignored once and for all. Please know the time you spent was not a waste but a delicious beginning of what could be...

 

[sheablue]

Dear X:


Sonnet XVII

I do not love you as if you were salt-rose, or topaz,
or the arrow of carnations the fire shoots off.
I love you as certain dark things are to be loved,
in secret, between the shadow and the soul.

I love you as the plant that never blooms
but carries in itself the light of hidden flowers;
thanks to your love a certain solid fragrance,
risen from the earth, lives darkly in my body.

I love you without knowing how, or when, or from where.
I love you straightforwardly, without complexities or pride;
so I love you because I know no other way than this:

where I does not exist, nor you,
so close that your hand on my chest is my hand,
so close that your eyes close as I fall asleep.


― Pablo Neruda

 

[Kajira Callista]

Dear X on lit,
The daddies would tear your head off and piss down your throat without ever even thinking twice if you ever spoke to me in real life the way you do here.
(well that is a bit extreme but the point was made)
I guess anonymous has its advantages for you.
Hugs n kisses,
babygirl

 

[kimuk]

My darling Sir
We made such beautiful memories on friday. I think it was a very special time for us. We lived our fantasy. We talked for hours. We had time to ourselves. You made me feel loved , desired and cherished.
Always in my heart Sir. My truely amazing, gentle, dominant , sexy, wonderful man.
Yours again x

 

[knot_sweet]

Dear Douchebag

Ok, I know we aren't exactly friends, and you're doing me a favour by pretending to let me exercise my design skill on your build (which you will ignore), but I'm going to say this anyway.

Thanks for fucking up my long weekend. I spent saturday getting samples and wrote off any plans for today because of you.

So yeah, right now I'm pretty pissed at you.

You don't have the right to abuse my time.

If this is how you plan to treat me as someone you claim to want as a friend, or in any other capacity, then you can fuck right off.

C.

 

[Malich]

Dear Fate

Ok, I have my answer now. I am free even if that isn't exactly the answer I was looking for.

I hope this means you have something positive planned for me in the future. I am putting my trust in you that this is for the best and not just another joke at my expense.

Mal

 

[Ulfsmouse]

Rant on- tap, tap, tap, testing...

Dear X,

No need to sound so disappointed that we're all okay after the latest storm. Telling me Y died the day before once you'd discovered we were okay is just more of your typical douchebaggery. Waiting until there's only 17 hours to go to tell me when and where the 10 hours journey away funeral would be was a new low, even for you. This. This is why the kid hates you so much. This is why she's getting her last name changed. I usually try to see the best in everyone, but sometimes I can't help hoping something really bad happens to you. You have a hell of a lot of nerve to add the "if I even care" bit. Y and I talked more often and more recently than you even THOUGHT about calling. Scumbucket.

Rant off. Sorry guys, had to get it out somehow.

 

[Sweetdaisymae]

Dear X

You are confusing me, you blow hot and cold, you make demands then backtrack when I pull you on them.
Please just be clear and straight with me, it is not so difficult. Honest.
Communicate!

 

[Malich]

Yeah, these are not the droids you are looking for. Nothing to see here. Move along.... move along.

 

[LallyH]

Dear X

You know this game we play every year - the one where you call me, ask me to call to see you at a particular time, keep me waiting for half an hour, and then tell me that you're not ready and will I come back again next week?

It's tedious and predictable. Change it please.

L

 

[Malich]

Dear X

You know this game we play every year - the one where you call me, ask me to call to see you at a particular time, keep me waiting for half an hour, and then tell me that you're not ready and will I come back again next week?

It's tedious and predictable. Change it please.

L

*hugs

 

[LallyH]

Public sector - could you guess?

 

[Malich]

Public sector - could you guess?

Far be it for me to comment