Disinterested Partners: The Flip Side

[midwestyankee]

<snip>
I guess I just have to be patient.

Maybe you two need to get back to basics. You know, like playing doctor?

 

[SweetErika]

I was the disinterested partner for big chunks of time over a few years. Sex was traumatic for me, to the point where I'd burst out crying, panic, and feel nauseous. That kind of reaction doesn't make either partner want to keep trying, and I started to feel like I was making a very strong negative association with sex, so we stopped. There was a lot of stress, anxiety, and depression in my life at that point, and my libido was almost non-existent, so I didn't miss it at all. Birth control pills and anti-depressants didn't help the situation either. My husband missed the intimacy very much, though he never expressed that voluntarily because he didn't want to make me feel guilty. I felt enough guilt over this on my own, and that just added to the problem.

Eventually we figured out we needed to be intimate (for me) without having intercourse, so we settled on 'everything but intercourse.' I still kind of had to force myself to do that, but it seemed like the only solution. I made the mistake of believing if his physical needs were met, he'd be happy; I never considered men might like the emotional intimacy. Like others have said, the longer we didn't have sex, the easier/more comfortable and harder to change it got. We tried sex periodically in an effort to break that, but it never got better because I just couldn't control the reaction.

As some of the stress in my life decreased over the next year, we had sex on and off. Sometimes it was okay, at others it was disasterous. We tried to identify the problem(s) and figured out things like ensuring I had an orgasm first and different positions were helpful. It was better, but my fear it would seriously harm our marriage long-term pushed me to seek treatment/counseling. During that time, just trying sex was a huge deal because I was in so much emotional turmoil overall. But as some of the other problems started to ease, I wanted to keep trying and conquer the sexual issues. Eventually we tried enough times on those few and far between sex sessions to narrow the trigger of my freaking out down to feeling trapped and him making certain sounds during orgasm.

I was still apathetic toward sex, doing it more out of obligation to my husband and myself. I actually became one of those non-sexual people we hear about so much here. But then I found these boards, and reading about positive experiences and all of the possibilities sparked something in me. My passion for sex and libido came back, and I really wanted that to translate to our sex life. I started talking on here, and began conversations with my hubby. New ideas and talking changed him, too, and now our sex life is better than it's ever been (I still have an outburst once in awhile, but that's rare). It sounds stupid, but Lit really did make THAT much of a difference for me and us as a couple.

Making it through all of this required a lot of brutal honesty and communication with my husband. As hard as it was, I had to tell him what was going on and we had to work as a team to find solutions and make it work. The potential for resentment (on both of our parts) and destruction was definitely there, and I think it was only (narrowly) avoided because we had a strong relationship in the first place, communicated, worked hard to fix it, and refused to allow it to damage or define us.

So, I think I definetly qualified as "disinterested" but the difference may have been that I didn't want to be that way...I wanted to be better and make it work for both of us. I can easily see how not wanting to would have changed the outcome though.

 

[Eilan]

So, I think I definetly qualified as "disinterested" but the difference may have been that I didn't want to be that way...I wanted to be better and make it work for both of us. I can easily see how not wanting to would have changed the outcome though.

My problem was that while I didn't want to be that way, I didn't seem to want to change, either. I would promise my ex that we'd have sex and then break the promise, usually because I was too tired (and I WAS very tired--it wasn't a line that I used). Definitely not one of my finer moments.

What used to cause resentments for me was my ex's work schedule. He was working a couple of jobs--one full-time and one part-time, which meant that he'd be gone from 8:00 am to midnight four or five days a week, plus work on Saturdays. He also had a "hobby" that took up all of Sunday. I was teaching a full course load and then coming home and doing the housework and childcare and grading papers after the kids were settled into bed. We just lost that connection somehow.

 

[TBKahuna123]

Reminds of the old fake it 'til you feel it mantra. Back then I tried that method to get in the mood and work it, but it was VERY VERY difficult and I got a little resentful. But everyone responds in their own way. Finally, the dry spell ended when I got caught masturbating and he sort of got me back into the groove of things.

But at least you know it happens and people get past it.

I think you're missing my point. I'm not saying fake it at all. What I'm saying is that sometimes people may not feel aroused and want to initiate just because they suddenly feel aroused. If however, their partner comes on to them and tries to arouse them, they do become aroused. Does that make any sense? I mean there are times when I may not be in the mood on my own, but if my wife tries to arouse me, I become aroused, where I probably wouldn't have on my own.

I'm not suggesting anyone fake it, because that does breed resentment. I would never want my wife to have sex with me if she wasn't genuinely aroused. Not only does that breed resentment, it's not as good when she's not totally into it.

 

[TBKahuna123]

So, I think I definetly qualified as "disinterested" but the difference may have been that I didn't want to be that way...I wanted to be better and make it work for both of us. I can easily see how not wanting to would have changed the outcome though.

Wow, what a story and what an accomplishment turning that around. I think it's a definite that you wanting to fix it is what made it possible. Not to belittle your feelings but I would also suggest that part of your success was the fact that your husband wanted to change it. The fact that he was willing to work with you and help you work through all that is a pretty strong testament to how deeply he cared for you. I honestly believe that without that kind of commitment on the part of BOTH parties, it's impossible to break that cycle.

If you have that kind of commitment to each other I believe you can work through anything, I truly do. This takes hard work and a lot of love. I didn't think I could have any more respect for you Erika, but I was wrong. Both you and your husband just gained another level of respect in my eyes.

 

[cloakedlover]

TBK123 - 'I would never want my wife to have sex with me if she wasn't genuinely aroused. Not only does that breed resentment, it's not as good when she's not totally into it.'

I agree.

And I used the old adage as a means to communicate with others more of a notion to be in the moment or to be able to be caught in a moment whether it be sexual or nonsexual. Do you know what I mean? Sort of what you were mentioning with being able to become aroused versus give in to someone's wants. So I wasn't wanting to be completely literal. But there are times in our lives where if we can set everything aside and be there in whatever exists right then, women, and men (I think), can create the desire in our heads. Sometimes it works, other times not so much.

I should have made time to explain previously.

Now when I did try to "fake" arousal as I mentioned from the early years - I did not always get genuinely aroused. Sometimes I did. It just took coaxing - but coaxing isn't all that bad and sometimes he wouldn't even be willing to try to coax. So I just wanted to respond from experience to the idea that doing it to please your partner isn't going to help the situation.

Erika - one of my dearest girlfriends had the lowest libido on her depression meds. That in addition to stress from grad school and hubby working two jobs to help make ends meet - was a complete disaster. Your story was like deja vu. I'm glad you two were able to communicate and make it work.

 

[Bandit58]

Not PPD related, but having been a disinterested party before...

Looking back, I realize that I *had* to have felt connected to him at one point, and I *had* to have been attracted to him at one point, as well, but honestly, I can't remember it.

I spent so much time thinking the problem was me. *I* was the one who didn't like sex, therefore, I was the one who was broken. "Yucky" is the best word for it, the feeling of his trying to kiss me, touch me, whatever. It was downright creepy. He had threatened at one point, to have an affair, and I told him, "Are you kidding? I'd PAY someone to have sex with you at this point."

< Not one of my shining moments >

What an amazing surprise when the marriage ended, (I, of course, being a "frigid bitch,") and I realized in the subsuquent relationship, that it wasn't that I loathed sex, just that I loathed sex with him.

And that I was very, very much NOT broken.

You could be me.....I'm not broken either But I spent many years wondering if I was, because sex to me was a big bore, and sometimes painful because he'd get impatient and just go for it. He'd never touch me unless he wanted sex either. It's hard to stay emotionally connected to someone like that. Add the emotional abuse to the mix and no wonder I switched everything off and thought "why bother?"

 

[flamesofdesire]

I would never want my wife to have sex with me if she wasn't genuinely aroused. Not only does that breed resentment, it's not as good when she's not totally into it.

But what if she is NEVER aroused. A day or two, here and there, is one thing, but if you had to choose between never having sex again for the next year,(or more) or having sex occasionally although she's not as aroused as you would like, which would you choose?
Of course you would want to work on getting the problem solved, but in the meantime, wouldn't it be better then nothing? Wouldn't it be good to know she cares that much about your needs?

With me, I'm not sure when the disinterest really began. It wasn't something I ever thought about. Somewhere along the line, it came to a point where I would get aroused if he initiated sex, but I don't think I ever initiated it once in a 4 year span. That grew into me being relieved when he didn't initiate as much anymore. I got to the point where I just didn't care about it anymore, and felt I could live just fine never having sex again.

If someone had asked me why at the time, I wouldn't have had an answer.
I loved him, I wanted to be married to him, I loved going fishing with him, I loved watching Packer football with him,... we were best friends.

Looking back now, I can see several things that contributed to the demise of our sex life.
Sex got boring! When we first got married, it was really all physical. We didn't really need the emotional connection cause every kiss, every touch, started a fire. But after awhile, life gets more complicated, as children come and bills accumulate, the glow of love gets dampened.
( It's harder to start a fire with damp wood.)
But we kept doing things the same old way everytime. I mean it was practically a ritual.

We became to comfortable being friends, and the romantic lovey dovey emotional connection wasn't there. We were more like roommates.

I think I was also harboring a deep down resentment towards him because of things that had occurred during some hard financial times, and although he was sorry and made everything right again, I don't think it ever went away in my subconcious.

All these things just kinda occurred, with no one noticing it as it did.
Basically, I loved him, but I wasn't in love with him and looking back I don't think I ever really felt that "deep deep love" in our relationship. The strong emotional connection had never really blossomed. That total trust and surrender to eachother wasn't there. I think during the first 15 years of our marriage I was subconciously insecure about the stability of our relationship and never really surrendered to it. (does that make any sense?)

 

[cloakedlover]

I think it seems most everyone agrees it is important to determine whether the issue is physical or mental in nature.

With regard to physical reactions (or nonreactions as the case may be), Mr. G left some good information for anyone on the pill over in the Try this thread that I think more people should be aware of...and several women having taking different meds have posted their experience with waning or nonexistent libido.

If the issue is mental - is it a relationship issue or an individual issue? Then after getting to the root of the problem, communication (I think, IMHO, regardless of whether the issue is between both spouses or just one - there must be quality discussion) is paramount. It seems most everyone agrees that must take place to 'break down any barriers' so to speak.

Now if a partner isn't receptive to discussion - that can become another issue altogether. Perhaps the issue becomes a communication issue itself - how to communicate openly and effectively with each other. Which, is some situations, I think is an art. You know, those truly gifted public speakers that can pull an audience in and get them thinking. I wish people were better trained in communicating and reacting to others.

 

[kerkri04]

Your story.....

I was the disinterested partner for big chunks of time over a few years. Sex was traumatic for me, to the point where I'd burst out crying, panic, and feel nauseous. That kind of reaction doesn't make either partner want to keep trying, and I started to feel like I was making a very strong negative association with sex, so we stopped. There was a lot of stress, anxiety, and depression in my life at that point, and my libido was almost non-existent, so I didn't miss it at all. Birth control pills and anti-depressants didn't help the situation either. My husband missed the intimacy very much, though he never expressed that voluntarily because he didn't want to make me feel guilty. I felt enough guilt over this on my own, and that just added to the problem.

Eventually we figured out we needed to be intimate (for me) without having intercourse, so we settled on 'everything but intercourse.' I still kind of had to force myself to do that, but it seemed like the only solution. I made the mistake of believing if his physical needs were met, he'd be happy; I never considered men might like the emotional intimacy. Like others have said, the longer we didn't have sex, the easier/more comfortable and harder to change it got. We tried sex periodically in an effort to break that, but it never got better because I just couldn't control the reaction.

As some of the stress in my life decreased over the next year, we had sex on and off. Sometimes it was okay, at others it was disasterous. We tried to identify the problem(s) and figured out things like ensuring I had an orgasm first and different positions were helpful. It was better, but my fear it would seriously harm our marriage long-term pushed me to seek treatment/counseling. During that time, just trying sex was a huge deal because I was in so much emotional turmoil overall. But as some of the other problems started to ease, I wanted to keep trying and conquer the sexual issues. Eventually we tried enough times on those few and far between sex sessions to narrow the trigger of my freaking out down to feeling trapped and him making certain sounds during orgasm.

I was still apathetic toward sex, doing it more out of obligation to my husband and myself. I actually became one of those non-sexual people we hear about so much here. But then I found these boards, and reading about positive experiences and all of the possibilities sparked something in me. My passion for sex and libido came back, and I really wanted that to translate to our sex life. I started talking on here, and began conversations with my hubby. New ideas and talking changed him, too, and now our sex life is better than it's ever been (I still have an outburst once in awhile, but that's rare). It sounds stupid, but Lit really did make THAT much of a difference for me and us as a couple.

Making it through all of this required a lot of brutal honesty and communication with my husband. As hard as it was, I had to tell him what was going on and we had to work as a team to find solutions and make it work. The potential for resentment (on both of our parts) and destruction was definitely there, and I think it was only (narrowly) avoided because we had a strong relationship in the first place, communicated, worked hard to fix it, and refused to allow it to damage or define us.

So, I think I definetly qualified as "disinterested" but the difference may have been that I didn't want to be that way...I wanted to be better and make it work for both of us. I can easily see how not wanting to would have changed the outcome though.

Your story is amazing. It offers hope that there really may be a solution out there. The complication is that the one who's disinterested has to want to find a solution.

Were you always freaked out by sex? Didn't that complicate things when you were dating? Or, did it start after you had been married a while? Do you know what caused it? Were you a rape victum? Its hard to understand how something like that would just start by itself.

 

[Rick Forbes]

Thanks for sharing, everybody!

This is an issue that has caused hardship in our marriage off and on, sometimes one partner, sometimes the other for a variety of reasons, many of which are beautifully articulated above.

Threads like this one and the responses many of you have shared make lit the best sex board on the web, where genuinely passionate, articulate, and kind people can explore sexuality in the fullness of their humanity - and that includes shame, fear, anger, guilt, and vulnerability.

Peace and blessings to all of my wonderful friends and aquaintances here on lit!

 

[TBKahuna123]

but what if she is NEVER aroused. A day or two, here and there, is one thing, but if you had to choose between never having sex again for the next year,(or more) or having sex occasionally although she's not as aroused as you would like, which would you choose?

Been there, done that. 2 years after we got married my wife developed complications from PCOS and wound up with a NASTY infection. Sex got tot he point where it was excrutiating for her, painful to the point of tears. She would beg me to not stop, to keep going til I was done because she felt she had to "fulfill her wifely duties." At first I didn't knwo what was wrong, but she kept tell me to keep going, so I did. Finally I couldn't do it anymore and she told me the kindof pain it caused her. Well I was devestated that I had been hurting her and the fact that she didn't want me to stop didn't help my guilt.

I didn't want her to do something she didn't want or that caused her pain just because i was horny. I would rather jerk off alone then cause her any pain. We didn't have sex for 7 months until she was recovered, and even then it took us a while to ease back in things. Certain positions, speeds, depths, stuff like that still hurt her, and we had to change the whole way we made love. There were a number of things I like that we couldn't do. I lived with that rather than make her do soemthing she wasn't interested in. That was my choice and one I'd make again.

That was also the point where we started communicating more and our relationship really went to a new level. If I hadn't pressed the issue though, she would have kept putting out to please me, regardless of the pain, and eventually it would have been too much and would have destroyed us.

 

[flamesofdesire]

I didn't want her to do something she didn't want or that caused her pain just because i was horny. I would rather jerk off alone then cause her any pain.

I'm sorry you guys went through that, and in that situation you definitely made the right choice. Alot of men wouldn't have been as loving as you.
My question wasn't aimed at painful situations, just when the woman wasn't really feeling that into it.

 

[SweetErika]

Wow, what a story and what an accomplishment turning that around. I think it's a definite that you wanting to fix it is what made it possible. Not to belittle your feelings but I would also suggest that part of your success was the fact that your husband wanted to change it. The fact that he was willing to work with you and help you work through all that is a pretty strong testament to how deeply he cared for you. I honestly believe that without that kind of commitment on the part of BOTH parties, it's impossible to break that cycle.

If you have that kind of commitment to each other I believe you can work through anything, I truly do. This takes hard work and a lot of love. I didn't think I could have any more respect for you Erika, but I was wrong. Both you and your husband just gained another level of respect in my eyes.

No, that doesn't belittle my feelings at all. I know what an amazing guy I have, and that he didn't have to stay and work through it...this started before (or shortly after) we were engaged, and continued through our first year of marriage. I doubt I would have blamed him for bailing before we got married, but you're right, not taking that option screams something about his character and personal strength.

I think being the disinterested party and having already dealt with the effects of little-no sex helped dramatically when the tables turned and HE was disinterested (not the right word...he was grieving and stressed and just didn't have anything to spare) in everything at times in the past few years. It's always going to happen at times, so I'm glad we've already figured out how to deal with it.

And thanks...that means a lot to me, and I hope you know I learn a lot and feel the same way about you and Mrs. Kahuna.

Were you always freaked out by sex? Didn't that complicate things when you were dating? Or, did it start after you had been married a while? Do you know what caused it? Were you a rape victum? Its hard to understand how something like that would just start by itself.

I probably should have clarified for those who don't know that the problems and freaking out were from being raped and the resulting PTSD. That happened about a year into our relationship while my hubby was abroad and we'd agreed to date others if we felt like it. I was able to hold it in or dissociate during sex for awhile, but eventually it started to rear its ugly head, and that's when I started freaking out on a regular basis. Before I was raped, I was passionate about sex and had a healthy sex life with no problems. I'll never get back to that point, but I'm probably as close as I'm going to get right now, and I can live with that.

I posted mainly because disinterest and bad reactions to sex are all too common for assault and abuse survivors, and perhaps my story will help others consider, understand, and work through it.

 

[TBKahuna123]

It's always going to happen at times, so I'm glad we've already figured out how to deal with it.

Now THAT is a very true statement. I firmly believe that there is no way you can live with someone for 30 years and not have a period or two where oneof you is disinterested in sex. Real life stresses, children, medical problems, emotional problesm, you'll experience all sorts of things during the course of a long marriage. It seems to me that if you keep the intimacy there, even if the "sex" isn't, the sex will always come back around. That and talking about it, understanding your spouses issue, and supporting them are the keys.

I posted mainly because disinterest and bad reactions to sex are all too common for assault and abuse survivors, and perhaps my story will help others consider, understand, and work through it.

Not only is this true, but it is common. I have never dated a woman who wasn't sexually abused or assaulted in some form or another, and they've run the gambit. Everyone of them reacted differently to the trauma of it and everyone was affected somehow in their reaction to sex. One girl I dated in high school freaked out when she found a porn mag I had because her step father had made her watch pornography with him will he molested her and her sisters. Sick shit to be sure, but even that little thing like finding a magazine brought it all back. Another girl I dated, the one I lost my virginity too actually, tried to get me to have rough sex with her by actually asking me to "rape" her. Well I was the one that freaked out here, and later I found out that she was raped her first time, so that's how she had mentally equated pleasure.

Not everyone reacts the same of course. My little sister was raped and she channelled that anger into a positive manner and it has shaped her life in a good way. I'll be honest I'm not sure how it affected her sexually because, well, I've never asked. The point is that there is no formula for how a woman will or won't deal with this, except that it is a traumatic experience that most men will never know. Sure we could be raped by another guy, but when was the last time you heard of an unwilling guy being gang raped by a group of drunked sorority girls? Well other than in a porno I mean.

The point is, most of us guys don't know the signs and aren't smart enough to now when something is wrong. This causes more grief for a woman already dealing with the trauma because we may not understand why they can't just put it behind them. I mean, we weren't the ones that raped them, right? The fact is that even the most sensitive guys don't get it unless it is explained to them, and no one ever does. At least not until they find out the hard way.

I just have one more thing to say on this issue, then I'll shut up. What concerns me the most about victims of rape is not that they'll be forgotten, but that they'll become normal. As accounts of rape and sexual assault skyrocket we run the eisk of these reports becomign so common place that the victims are labelled as just another statistic. We can't allow that to happen or we will reach a point where rape becomes a fact of life. Hell I didn't even know that Feb. was a month for stopping violence against women until today. I guess that makes this whole discussion more appropriate.

 

[kerkri04]

Erika

Congratulations for what you've accomplished. Don't say I'll probably never get back to that point.Think positive.

 

[SweetErika]

Congratulations for what you've accomplished. Don't say I'll probably never get back to that point.Think positive.

I am positive, but I'm also realistic. The reality is that I'll never get back to the point where there aren't any negative thoughts or feelings associated with people and sex. I'll never be as carefree, and there will always be reminders and some things that bother me.

It'll always be a loss I'll grieve (just like my husband will always feel and think about the loss of his mom...it'd be cold for me to tell him to be positive about that, don't you think?), but I don't dwell on it, am grateful for what I have, and move forward as best I can.

 

[cloakedlover]

I just have one more thing to say on this issue, then I'll shut up. What concerns me the most about victims of rape is not that they'll be forgotten, but that they'll become normal. As accounts of rape and sexual assault skyrocket we run the eisk of these reports becomign so common place that the victims are labelled as just another statistic. We can't allow that to happen or we will reach a point where rape becomes a fact of life.

So true. I feel that society is just becoming more and more desensitized to violent acts. And consider those people that have become desensitized - can you imagine how difficult it could be for them to relate to a victim/survivor?

I realized after starting to put some of my thoughts down on this board that though I am pleasantly married there has been an intimacy issue in our marriage, plus the bedroom satisfaction issue that I'm working on to obtain happily married status .

I think, as a woman, the hardest thing is to decide how to explain what I'm missing from him. I've thought of the whole teach by example thing. But it can take awhile sometimes for him to get the hint. Guys, I will do everything I can to make the proper I statements - I would like, I feel , etc. If I say, "Honey I feel like we are not connecting intimately/emotionally outside of the bedroom and our lovemaking I think could use improvement as well. How do you feel about that?" and it's a good lead-in for conversation (though a bit blunt - I could sugar coat it a bit). But I would bet that he will be silent and say I don't know - I don't think it's that bad. He is not a talker. I don't know how to help him foster that. Do all men crave intimacy? Can it be nurtured? And how can I show/explain the incredible benefits of it, if he doesn't seem to understand. I mean beyond suddenly thinking oh no my wife's not happy....

It feels like suddenly it becomes a list of how I'd like him to respond on a daily basis - ideas for loving nonsexual touches. The general kindness factor that has gone out the window b/c our lives are so busy. The fact that people in relationships begin to take each for granted. I don't want to come across that way. I have a penchant for not only being analytical but also for being very -not sure {insert word here} I don't think diehard romantic or emotional is it... I'm always looking for the right words......anyway I hope someone gets my drift.

And woohoo - it's finally raining hard here in Austin!!!!! We need it desperately.

Edited: DH and I talked today about the intimacy issue and it went very well. He wasn't phased by it one bit. Obviously I underestimated his ability to understand my needs. We tried to nail down some things that would help immediately and also others that will encourage a metamorphisis of some of the less desireable behaviour patterns.

 

[Eilan]

Edited: DH and I talked today about the intimacy issue and it went very well. He wasn't phased by it one bit. Obviously I underestimated his able to understand my needs. We tried to nail down some things that would help immediately and also others that will encourage a metamorphisis of some of the less desireable behaviour patterns.

Sounds like a good start.

 

[TBKahuna123]

Edited: DH and I talked today about the intimacy issue and it went very well. He wasn't phased by it one bit. Obviously I underestimated his able to understand my needs. We tried to nail down some things that would help immediately and also others that will encourage a metamorphisis of some of the less desireable behaviour patterns.

You know, I was going to say that we guys get underestimated a lot, but recent posts on another thread just keep proving the stereotype! Sheesh!

This is great news cloakedlover. As I've said before, I love a happy ending.

 

[kerkri04]

Question?

What sort of things did you "nail down" that you feel will be helpful?

So true. I feel that society is just becoming more and more desensitized to violent acts. And consider those people that have become desensitized - can you imagine how difficult it could be for them to relate to a victim/survivor?

I realized after starting to put some of my thoughts down on this board that though I am pleasantly married there has been an intimacy issue in our marriage, plus the bedroom satisfaction issue that I'm working on to obtain happily married status .

I think, as a woman, the hardest thing is to decide how to explain what I'm missing from him. I've thought of the whole teach by example thing. But it can take awhile sometimes for him to get the hint. Guys, I will do everything I can to make the proper I statements - I would like, I feel , etc. If I say, "Honey I feel like we are not connecting intimately/emotionally outside of the bedroom and our lovemaking I think could use improvement as well. How do you feel about that?" and it's a good lead-in for conversation (though a bit blunt - I could sugar coat it a bit). But I would bet that he will be silent and say I don't know - I don't think it's that bad. He is not a talker. I don't know how to help him foster that. Do all men crave intimacy? Can it be nurtured? And how can I show/explain the incredible benefits of it, if he doesn't seem to understand. I mean beyond suddenly thinking oh no my wife's not happy....

It feels like suddenly it becomes a list of how I'd like him to respond on a daily basis - ideas for loving nonsexual touches. The general kindness factor that has gone out the window b/c our lives are so busy. The fact that people in relationships begin to take each for granted. I don't want to come across that way. I have a penchant for not only being analytical but also for being very -not sure {insert word here} I don't think diehard romantic or emotional is it... I'm always looking for the right words......anyway I hope someone gets my drift.

And woohoo - it's finally raining hard here in Austin!!!!! We need it desperately.

Edited: DH and I talked today about the intimacy issue and it went very well. He wasn't phased by it one bit. Obviously I underestimated his ability to understand my needs. We tried to nail down some things that would help immediately and also others that will encourage a metamorphisis of some of the less desireable behaviour patterns.

 

[cloakedlover]

What sort of things did you "nail down" that you feel will be helpful?

In this current stage of our relationship there really has been a sense of both of us taking the other for granted. Now, giving credit, it wasn't always this way - we would do nice things/house stuff/whatever without being asked. There used to be sweet messages/notes/weekend getaways, etc. and then we let life take a toll on our relationship, it seems. And quite honestly, we stopped fighting fairly with each other. At some point, probably borne from outside frustrations (work, family,etc.) - we just let loose with the whole verbal abuse.

So, I've asked for both of us to be more cognisant of touching more often -closeness I've really missed - and to get back where we were before. He admitted he missed all the cuddling and kidding we used to do. And I don't know if other people have had this experience, but when we first married we would talk about our hopes and dreams of the future, but not so much anymore. Almost like, we're so busy working on making those things a reality, we've "checked out" of the relationship. So that's another request - just more meaningful conversation and to maintain good communication. Also, an immediate cease and desist of bringing up those negative comments spoken in anger from the past. In addition, (I know some people are going to think this is so unromantic - but for us right now, timewise, it's almost necessary) schedule some date nights - even the stay at home kind where we cook delicious food together. I'll let you know how it goes. But so far, so good.

 

[Eilan]

In addition, (I know some people are going to think this is so unromantic - but for us right now, timewise, it's almost necessary) schedule some date nights - even the stay at home kind where we cook delicious food together.

I don't think that's unromantic at all; it gives you something to look forward to.

My hubby and I try to do something like this, even if it's only once a month, though we haven't been as successful at this lately.

 

[TBKahuna123]

In this current stage of our relationship there really has been a sense of both of us taking the other for granted. Now, giving credit, it wasn't always this way - we would do nice things/house stuff/whatever without being asked. There used to be sweet messages/notes/weekend getaways, etc. and then we let life take a toll on our relationship, it seems. And quite honestly, we stopped fighting fairly with each other. At some point, probably borne from outside frustrations (work, family,etc.) - we just let loose with the whole verbal abuse.

So, I've asked for both of us to be more cognisant of touching more often -closeness I've really missed - and to get back where we were before. He admitted he missed all the cuddling and kidding we used to do. And I don't know if other people have had this experience, but when we first married we would talk about our hopes and dreams of the future, but not so much anymore. Almost like, we're so busy working on making those things a reality, we've "checked out" of the relationship. So that's another request - just more meaningful conversation and to maintain good communication. Also, an immediate cease and desist of bringing up those negative comments spoken in anger from the past. In addition, (I know some people are going to think this is so unromantic - but for us right now, timewise, it's almost necessary) schedule some date nights - even the stay at home kind where we cook delicious food together. I'll let you know how it goes. But so far, so good.

Wow sounds like the reality of my life too! Luckily my wife and I never let it get to that point of verbal abuse, but I see stresses of life and work take their toll on our relationship constantly! The effects that you described are identical to what we wind up doing from time to time. You do take your partner for granted, even though you don't know you're doing it, you do stop the physical yet non-sexual affection because you're too busy or stressed. It's a battle that I think every married couple has to fight, and big props to you for seeing it and taking steps to fix it. Keep in mind though that if you catch yourself backsliding a bit down the road, it doesn't mean your fixes didn't work. I think a successful marriage needs constant reflection and rededication, and that's where communication comes in. You can't let comfort lead you to stop working at your relationship, ever.

What you said about not talkinga bout your hopes and dreams is something that really struck me. I hadn't thought about that but I think it's true. You reach a certain point and say well I'm an adult now, so dreams are silly and I'll keep them to myself. On the contrary, who better to share them with than your lifetime mate?

 

[cloakedlover]

Keep in mind though that if you catch yourself backsliding a bit down the road, it doesn't mean your fixes didn't work. I think a successful marriage needs constant reflection and rededication, and that's where communication comes in. You can't let comfort lead you to stop working at your relationship, ever.

Thank you for that. I needed a gentle reminder.