Humiliation.

[silkee_A]

Re: Naive Question

Does anyone enjoy FEELING humiliated?

There are times I strongly desire to be humiliated by my Master. It is arousing for both of us. This is the type that I feel is healthy both physically and mentally for our relationship.

Then there are the days that I do not like it, but accept it if that is what he chooses to do. I will say though that my Master can read me very well, and he seems to know when it is the right time and when it isn't. If it isn't the "right" time for me, he rarely if ever continues. Not sure how others feel about safe words but that is an option that I can use and he respects that. Humiliation I believe should be exciting and arousing for both or one of us for it to be "right". My submitting to him during this time is very fulfilling even though I may not like the act. I definitely get enjoyment out of the submitting.

Does anyone enjoy FEELING humiliated?

Feeling less than worthy?

Feeling like trash, dirt, or whatever?

There are times when I only want to be humiliated by him because I have a low self-esteem and something is bothering me that particular day. This is when Master says... NO and it does not happen.

silkee_A

 

[Ebonyfire]

Whereas men seem to have an easier time shrugging off certain things.

I do not think it is that cut and dried. I can only speak for the males I dominate. They know their own limits, and they have the determination to honor their commitment to submit under certain conditions. They take things just as seriously, but they do things even when they would rather not. I have yet to meet a male sub who said humiliation was a hard limit.

I personally believe that male subs who are serious about being dominated have different issues and insecurities. They have to reconcile their needs before they submit or they run away. So if they do not run away, they are capable of releasing the control necessary to endure a lot of uncomfortable stuff.

They are not better subs, they are different subs.

Eb

 

[Pure]

Hi Freya 2:

Reading what you said (quoted below) lately and earlier, it occurs to me that maybe the humiliation side of bdsm is something you'd do well to go very easy on, or avoid. Given certain sensitivities.
If I may use an analogy, I wouldn't generally advise a person recovering from a bad knee to take up semi-pro basketball.


Freya 2:
I'm still mulling over exactly what it is in some cases that makes me feel less worthy - certain words in certain connotations seem to just nail me.

For example - being called someone's slut probably wouldn't bother me as they are calling me slut rather than "a slut", if that makes sense. But if you couple the slut word with demeaning tasks, it gets to me. Being told I'm a disappointment, or seeing reactions which make me feel as if I am, will knock me on my ass emotionally. Feeling objectified in certain ways would bother me - feeling like a piece of meat, or being made to feel less of a person.

I had an experience last night which really seemed to knock me down, and I'm trying to figure out exactly why, and what it was that did that to me. To be true to myself, and honest to another, I need to soul search a bit to find out what my triggers are. What made me do one thing, yet balk at another? How far will I go to please another, even if it means it takes a bit of me away? I think that's the part that scares me most of all. I lived many years of my life demeaning myself in the hopes that approval would be found from other people, but it chipped a little piece of self esteem away every time. I've finally started to tget some of that back, and I'm scared at how easily I might revert back to that person I used to be.

 

[Freya]

Hi Freya 2:

Reading what you said (quoted below) lately and earlier, it occurs to me that maybe the humiliation side of bdsm is something you'd do well to go very easy on, or avoid. Given certain sensitivities.
If I may use an analogy, I wouldn't generally advise a person recovering from a bad knee to take up semi-pro basketball.

But see, out of that list you posted, very few of those things would humiliate me.

To be done in front of dom/me and possibly others.

Taking a shower
Washing your pussy
Maturbating with anal penetration
Urinating

These wouldn't bother me a bit.

Things connoting childhood:

Having to "ask" (no words) to speak
Having to ask to go to the bathroom

Nor these for the most part.

Things connoting sluttiness:

Providing some sexual service to another--say a bj (with condom).

Being masturbated by a stranger, to orgasm, in front of ...

Having a woman make love to you in front of...

Licking the master's cum from a plate:

Having it transferred to your mouth by another woman who first receives it--e.g, by kissing.

These might, but not in the sense of being humiliated - just because being with another woman in any form is not something I'm interested in. The bj to another, or the orgasm by another would depend on circumstances.

Embarrassments:

Wearing no panties under skirt;

Doing that while dining or seated in a raised area or by stairs, your legs to be left apart and to provide a view;

Appearing in public or in front of others with obvious signs of just having sex (even though clothed).

Having to masturbate in a public place, say at a restaurant with tablecloths, without letting on.

Appearing in public while dressed in the manner of a hooker.

All of these, except for possibly the last, would tend to arouse me more than anything.

Objectification:

Serving as a chair or seat

A coat rack

Appearing as a servant in a French maid's outfit to guests.

Demeaning: taking your meals at a smaller low kiddie table.

Being a 'pony girl'; wearing a butt plug with a pony tail.

Now these I probably would object to.

So I guess it really depends on the situation and how things are handled for me.


Eb, do you think it's because there's more stigma attached to being a male sub, as compared to a female sub - so those that make that choice are maybe more prepared to tkae the bad with the good, in a sense? I'm not phrasing that very well, but I wonder if it's due to the fact that for a man, being submissive to a female is a much more difficult struggle internally, when you take history and societal perceptions into account, along with just the basic "Man is the stronger gender" idea. So making that choice, would seem to be already slightly humilating, depending on how they were raised, or how they are seen in their personal lives.

 

[rosco rathbone]

How would you feel about punitive hairstyling, ie having your head forcibly shaved?

 

[P. B. Walker]

or degrading, humiliating forced tattoos and/or brands.

 

[AnelizeDarkEyes]

indifference as humiliation

i had a thought...

your Master's complete and utter indifference to you. you are no more important than a speck of dirt under His shoe, lint in the pocket of His pants...you get the picture

THAT would humiliate me

but that's me

~a~

 

[Pure]

hi freya 2,

you said,

But see, out of that list you posted, very few of those things would humiliate me.

Ah, but that's the beginner/immediate list!

Best,

 

[Bondagebunni]

How would you feel about punitive hairstyling, ie having your head forcibly shaved?

that i don't think i could handle...i'm rather attached to my hair...

edit: empty your mailbox

 

[rosco rathbone]

or degrading, humiliating forced tattoos and/or brands.

Well, you roll the eyes, and I can't see myself ACTUALLY forcing someone to get a brand but.....tattoo along lines of THIS ASS BELONGS TO ROSCO....hm. That's bonerific to moi. Conceptually.

 

[rosco rathbone]

that i don't think i could handle...i'm rather attached to my hair...

Well Eggs Ackley. That's the point. It wouldn't be hyoomiliating if you weren't, eh.

 

[Freya]

hi freya 2,

you said,

But see, out of that list you posted, very few of those things would humiliate me.

Ah, but that's the beginner/immediate list!

Best,

But I am a beginner.

Nah Rosco, no hair shaving for me. I'd get a tattoo, but I wouldn't get a person's name put on myself, and the tattoo would have to be something I liked as well.

 

[Bondagebunni]

Well, you roll the eyes, and I can't see myself ACTUALLY forcing someone to get a brand but.....tattoo along lines of THIS ASS BELONGS TO ROSCO....hm. That's bonerific to moi. Conceptually.

i'd prefer having "property of (my Dom's name here)" on my ass...but in permanent marker so it can be changed to say things like "slut" and put in other colors.

 

[rosco rathbone]

i'd prefer having "property of (my Dom's name here)" on my ass...but in permanent marker so it can be changed to say things like "slut" and put in other colors.

I could only see doing something like this in a truelove situation.

 

[dankei]

People do what they are willing to do

I don't think that this should be a problem at all. If it is then the person shouldn't be involved in these activities. A sub's submission is a gift to their Dom and as such they are putting themselves in the situation. If the humiliation gets to be too much to handle, or any other part of their submission, then they simply exclude that aspect from their submission in the future until they believe that they can handle it.

 

[Bondagebunni]

I could only see doing something like this in a truelove situation.

yeah...although i would like to have a nice S tattooed on me...

 

[dankei]

I lived many years of my life demeaning myself in the hopes that approval would be found from other people, but it chipped a little piece of self esteem away every time. I've finally started to tget some of that back, and I'm scared at how easily I might revert back to that person I used to be.

Freya,

I remember reading many of your posts last summer and you seemed like a pretty strong person to me. Yes, you doubted yourself at times and mentioned other times in your past that you felt depressed or less worthy than others but that pretty much describes everyone at one time or another in their lives. The fact that you are questioning this at all shows that you are a strong person who is interested in allowing herself to submit to another.

Only a strong person can "give" their submission to another. And thus, they are ultimately in control by deciding to whom to give their submission, when they give it and to what degree they give their gift. You will find your level in this area just as you have in other areas of your life. It is your gift and you decide who is worthy to receive it.

 

[Pure]

Thoughts on a couple suggestions:


[RR:]
How would you feel about punitive hairstyling, ie having your head forcibly shaved?

[PBW:]
or degrading, humiliating forced tattoos and/or brands.

On the first, I think no force offers greater possibilities: Before going out for the evening give the sub a pair of non-sharp scissors, no mirror, and have them cut off as much of the head-hair as possible.

On the second: I don't see the object as just to do something forcible and nasty that proves ownership; if that were the goal, carving the master's initials on the forehead would do. A tattoo that is consented to, or even asked for, has, imo, greater possibilities. Temporary 'signs' have interesting possibilities, hung around the neck or waist: "bj's 25 cents" [from an anecdote by JB] or "finger this pussy [with arrow pointing]"

Just some thoughts.

 

[Freya]

Freya,

I remember reading many of your posts last summer and you seemed like a pretty strong person to me. Yes, you doubted yourself at times and mentioned other times in your past that you felt depressed or less worthy than others but that pretty much describes everyone at one time or another in their lives. The fact that you are questioning this at all shows that you are a strong person who is interested in allowing herself to submit to another.

Only a strong person can "give" their submission to another. And thus, they are ultimately in control by deciding to whom to give their submission, when they give it and to what degree they give their gift. You will find your level in this area just as you have in other areas of your life. It is your gift and you decide who is worthy to receive it.

Thanks dankei. I know you're right - sometimes I just feel the need to question certain things, and see other views on it, to help firm up my own feelings.

Thanks to everyone else who contributed, here and privately - you've been a lot of help.

 

[Ebonyfire]

Re: People do what they are willing to do

<Snip> then they simply exclude that aspect from their submission in the future until they believe that they can handle it.

Yep, that is why you identify hard limits. and I find over time, as the relationship grows, hard limits can change.

Eb

 

[Bondagebunni]

carving the master's initials on the forehead

that sounds painful....

 

[Ebonyfire]

that sounds painful....

I was thinking disfiguring.

Eb

 

[AnelizeDarkEyes]

i was thinking HARD LIMIT

 

[Pure]

i was thinking HARD LIMIT

The sentence was meant to suggest it's a NON-approved way to establish possession.

 

[Bondagebunni]

The sentence was meant to suggest it's a NON-approved way to establish possession.

no shit! *shudders*