I bit it off, now I have to chew it.

[lil_slave_rose]

Threads like this makes me think how much are some sub's/slaves willing to take or do for their PYL's.

honestly, i think she has handled it very well. and he's said he will pay it back. they did make the decision to live their life this way and yea what he did was irresponsible but ya know it's something you deal with and that's whether you are D/s M/s or just plain 'ole nilla. life happens.

VelvetDarkness, i would feel the same as you do if this were to happen to me. it has to be confusing and a little hard to just bit the bullet and say oh "he's master, so he has every right to make me pay for his fuck up" though honestly, that is the life you chose. i wouldn't be able to do it. Master and i have talked about this and He says he would talk to me about it, not just make the decision to take my money without it being ok with me. he did say he'd pay it back, and that's the important thing here in my opinion. he didn't just take the money and say ah well, too bad so sad. ya know? good luck and i hope you have/had fun in NY despite all of this....

 

[catalina_francisco]

Ah the designating who should take my children thing . . .

NO ONE!

Both our familys are FUCKED UP, we don't want anyone to have them. That said, if we don't designate anyone my mom will probably end up with them - she'll fight the hardest to get them, and if necessary will fight dirty.

I had to make that decision when I was a single mum and decided if anything happened to me I wanted to leave my children to my neighbour who was also a great friend. She was shocked I would choose her over family, but after our day out a couple of days ago, I still know that if the worst had happened she would have been the best choice by miles.

Catalina

 

[dave's thing]

It's amazing to me how the thoughts of "what if" realities set in at the weirdest times. Be you vanilla, GLB, Master, sub ...... the bottom line is that all this needs discussion, agreement and resolution with those that are part of, and around, yourself. This is an absolute responsibilty of your own life, regardless of how you live it.

NOW.... having said that I wonder how Velvet's trip is going and when we might hear.

 

[dakotagirl]

Ah the designating who should take my children thing . . .

NO ONE!

Both our familys are FUCKED UP, we don't want anyone to have them. That said, if we don't designate anyone my mom will probably end up with them - she'll fight the hardest to get them, and if necessary will fight dirty.

I know that feeling there. My family is so messed up and DH and I have a hard time deciding who to choose. Ultimately when we did finally choose it pissed other off oh well.

 

[Mansa Musa]

Yesterday, for the first time since Master and I went TPE a little over 3 months ago, Master made the first decision that I am unhappy with. Of course, I knew that it would happen.

Master is self employed. He did his tax return and discovered that it is more than he had expected it to be. He has to pay 3 times the tax that he thought he would have to. Master does not have the money to cover this by the end of the month, when it has to be paid or he'll incur a fine.

He has therefore made the executive decision to take the money from my savings account and repay it later, when he can afford to. It will pretty much zero my account until I get it back, which he reckons will be in 2 months time. He has had the pincodes to my accounts since I became his slave. I'm useless at remembering the codes for my cards anyway. I have the cards and he doesn't have duplicates so I have handed over my card in order for him to withdraw the money.

I wouldn't be so bothered, but I'm taking a business trip to New York tomorrow and will now not have much cash with me. I have never been to New York, so I was hoping to be a bit of a tourist but tourist attractions cost money. I have enough to cover expenses such as meals etc and another company is paying for my flight and hotel.

I also don't like not having my savings as an emergency cash buffer. My current account has no spare cash sitting in it and it makes me feel vulnerable, not least because he is broke as well. I have always had at least £250 ($500) in case of dire emergency since I left home 10 years ago.

I must confess I'm selfish enough to be quite disappointed. He has had since April to do this tax return, I have been nagging him (as instructed) daily since Christmas. He chooses to fill in the forms online yesterday and the money is due by the end of this month. I understand that taxes are more important than spending money for a trip. I have no doubt that he will return the money to my account as soon as possible. I just feel as though I'm paying for his mistake and I don't like that feeling.

He has apologised and said that he was stupid to do the return last minute, assuming it would tally up with his own calculations. He has promised to ensure that it doesn't happen again. He now considers that the end of the matter.

I really don't know what my problem is but I've been quite resentful today. I have done my tasks and chores and all the while this has been in the back of my mind, souring everything. I really thought that I would handle stuff like this better than I am. It has really brought home to me how truly vulnerable my slavery has made me.

Has anyone else been through something similar?

Give him the money and chalk it up as a learning experience. You wanted to give up all of your power, so it´s your decision to surrender to his will. Is it necessarily fair? Hell no! Did you make that decision? Most definitely! And, sad but true, as an adult, you´re bound (I made a funny!) to follow through with your decisions.

IMHO, if TPE leads to this type of result, you may want to re-evaluate your relationship or get out while the getting is good. America, for example, is full of people who´ve found themselves living on the streets or in another relative´s house due to lack of mental foresight. And I´m not joking. American women (especially Southerners) are known to maintain a "secret stash", in case of this very eventuality. Being whipped and chained (for example, because I don´t know about the depths of your relatoinship) may be fun, but is it worth it if you´re trying to find some way to attach your implements to a cardboard box? Or trying to explain to your parents about your need to install a bondage cross to your bedroom?

 

[VelvetDarkness]

Which is why you DO have to designate somebody. It can be anybody, though...if you have friends that you trust who would be willing to take care of your kids just in case, put them down. Otherwise your family WILL get them.

I am in my best friend's will. If she dies suddenly while her 3 sons are still minors, I become an instant Mum. Scary but necessary because her family is just awful. Her mother and 2 siblings have all had kids removed from them by social services at one time or another, so it's unlikely they'd get them anyway, which would leave foster care or adoption. Not good whichever way you slice it.

I'm not planning a family and L has no interest in starting one. I have known all of her kids since birth though and there is absolutely no way I could watch them go into government care. The conversation came up and she joked that I was the only person she'd consider leaving them to. I said 'ok' and she nearly collapsed with shock.

I'm not really a kid oriented person but I know those kids very well and am good with them as a result. I'd do my best just as I'd do my best if I became pregnant unintentionally. L understands all this and has said that he would be supportive, but I'd hate to see his face if I ever have to keep my promise.

All that said, if she dies on me I will be so pissed off with her.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I don't think most 24 year olds are in a position to have anything in place in case they're in a plane that goes down, ergo putting back whatever you take out may be the best/only way to ensure that your cherished property is not totally fucked in the parlance.

Yeah, this is the main reason that the money is going back into my account. The law does not recognise M/s relationships and we are not married so the simplest resolution is for him to replace the cash.

Our finances are generally kept separate. We do not have a joint account, we just split outgoings down the middle. If we were married it might be different but Master has no intention of leaving me financially vulnerable so he will 'repay' the cash. I know that technically everything I have belongs to him, nothing changes that, but 'borrowing' and 'repaying' are the best words that I have for what's happening at the moment. The money remains at his disposal, whether or not he chooses to place it back under my name.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

It's amazing to me how the thoughts of "what if" realities set in at the weirdest times. Be you vanilla, GLB, Master, sub ...... the bottom line is that all this needs discussion, agreement and resolution with those that are part of, and around, yourself. This is an absolute responsibilty of your own life, regardless of how you live it.

NOW.... having said that I wonder how Velvet's trip is going and when we might hear.

Thanks for your comments dave's thing. As for the trip...

It was fucking fantastic!

I had meetings on the Friday and the Monday but other than that my time was my own. I went with my business partner, J, and he has been to NY before so we hung out a bit. We don't really have the same interests though. We took the ferry and saw the Statue of Liberty, way cool. We had a look round Macy's and Times Square. We went up the Empire State building (expensive but such a must) to the 86th floor and the views were amazing. We also had a look around Barnes and Noble.

We stayed in Brooklyn rather than Manhattan as it was much cheaper. I met an acquaintance from Lit for lunch, also a f slave, and got a little tour of the different neighbourhoods in Brooklyn. I am such a terrible people watcher, the snapshots I saw of thousands of people's lives as I wandered about for a few days were as fascinating as everything else.

I went everywhere on the Metro, which was fairly easy to navigate. J and I had a look around the natural history museum but it was so crowded that we gave up after about half an hour. We had a look around Central Park, where I saw the most bored, fed up horses. The Park was empty, the trees had no leaves and it was looking rather forlorn and yet there were still about 30 or more carriages parked up around it while a couple more took bemused tourists around the park.

The flight back, we had a lot of turbulence and an old lady managed to fall off the toilet during a sudden bit when the seatbelt signs were still off. I ended up steri-stripping her head and bandaging a skin tear on her shin. There were no doctors so they got an ex-nurse. The stewardesses were going to put steri-strips on her leg but you can't do that with skin tears in the elderly because you just cause a fresh tear when you try to remove the strips, so it's lucky I was there. We helped the woman to a hastily vacated row of seats so she could lie down but she was quite confused.

So that was my trip. The business side of things went very well and hopefully I'll get to go back at some point. As we're a fledgling company, we can only pay ourselves a basic wage at the moment but hopefully that'll improve a little in the next few months.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

but you really shoudl have told us earlier abotu the trip to nyc... I would have taken you out for bad tourist stuff... I love getting to expierence my city from a visitor's eyes.

That would have been so cool. I literally had about 3 days notice before I took this trip and a day after that I started this thread. If I have to travel back across the pond again any time soon I would totally take you up on that.

J is a great friend and a very good business partner but he is a committed Christian and celibate because he is also gay. (please don't even go there, those are his beliefs and his lifestyle is his choice.) He is also tea-total and even eschews caffeine so there's not much scope for naughtiness when hanging out with the guy.

 

[Rosie_Riveter]

I'm really glad you had a great trip VelvetD.

I hope you get to make another trip in warmer weather.
But the horses will still look bored.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

As I'm having a Netz quotathon today ~ anything that doesn't suck is a gift from L. That is indeed how it works.

that's a good one, think i'll have to post it on the bathroom mirror to help me keep perspective during those difficult times. Velvet, i'm so glad that you've overcome this little hurdle now, and so glad that you've brought some attention to the everyday realities of slavery that have nothing to do with kink or sex, things real folks living real lives have to deal with all the time.

i remember having a very similar reaction/feeling the first time my Master took a significant sum of "my" money. not that i was loaded or anything, i'd only been working menial jobs, but i've always been a good saver and through being thrifty i had built a fairly comfortable cushion for myself in both a checking and savings account. well one day he said he needed to take the money out...pretty much all of it...to take care of some pressing financial issue he'd been dealing with for several years. nothing irresponsible on his part, he'd been steadily paying down a debt. but with the money from my accounts he could pay these things off and never have to worry about them again. on the one hand i was happy that he wouldn't have that burden on his mind anymore, and on the other i was like omg! it took me years to save that little bit of money, now i'm dead broke! now of course the reality was i was a slave, and that money had ceased to be mine the moment i became his property. but i wasn't thinking about it like that at the time...just typical M/s growing pains. you get over it, see it for what it is, accept it, say "dang i was an idjit", move on.

It does hit home. This is the first thing he has done that has been to my detriment and I was unsure about it. When we decided to go TPE we knew these things would happen but you can never predict how you will initially react, even with agreements in place. I believe that your Master has total financial control at all times, which is different from our set up. If L were to decide he wanted that one day, I would step back and give him complete control.

He does always have complete authority over my life, it's just that he doesn't always choose to exercise it. L would see some of the control that your Master has as burdensome, especially when I'm capable of doing things for myself. Your Master wants you to be as dependent as possible and I understand that. There are many facets even to TPE, even when you've crossed the line that gives you up as property. It's so interesting to see how many ways people can live their lives through kink.

I know that I've wondered and worried about your lifestyle before now. I've since accepted that everything you do is your choice. You seem to be an intelligent, articulate woman who is getting what she wants from life and I am truly happy for that.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I'm really glad you had a great trip VelvetD.

I hope you get to make another trip in warmer weather.
But the horses will still look bored.

Yeah, I expect they would. I heard that Pink was doing a campaign about them for PETA a while ago and at the time I thought that there must be millions of animals in greater need than some horses who are required to pull carts. I knew they couldn't be malnourished or ill treated if they're an intrinsic part of the NY tourist industry.

Having seen them though, it really is a shitty life for a horse. For those who haven't visited central park; they are surrounded by traffic and smog all day and attached to the cart all day, even if they don't get to do a tour for hours. They have feed and water buckets slung under the cart next to their crap-sacks and the road around central park stinks of horse pee. It's really cold in NYC at the moment as well. According to Pink, they have cramped stalls in which they can't turn around or lie down.

There weren't many tourists about when I was there on a cold January weekday but there were 30 or more horses and carts. The horses and carts each have designated owners or handlers, rather than being part of a pool so if the handler wants the cash, the horse has to stand in the cold all day.

 

[sexycaz22]

Sounds like you have had some lovely times in NYC!

Awesome!

 

[JMohegan]

Yeah, I expect they would. I heard that Pink was doing a campaign about them for PETA a while ago and at the time I thought that there must be millions of animals in greater need than some horses who are required to pull carts. I knew they couldn't be malnourished or ill treated if they're an intrinsic part of the NY tourist industry.

Having seen them though, it really is a shitty life for a horse. For those who haven't visited central park; they are surrounded by traffic and smog all day and attached to the cart all day, even if they don't get to do a tour for hours. They have feed and water buckets slung under the cart next to their crap-sacks and the road around central park stinks of horse pee. It's really cold in NYC at the moment as well. According to Pink, they have cramped stalls in which they can't turn around or lie down.

There weren't many tourists about when I was there on a cold January weekday but there were 30 or more horses and carts. The horses and carts each have designated owners or handlers, rather than being part of a pool so if the handler wants the cash, the horse has to stand in the cold all day.

Yes, those horses have shitty lives. As do elephants in the circus, dolphins in aquariums, pets kept in cages, etc. And if you really want to know just how cruel people can be, check out a few photos of factory farms here in the U.S.

Is there a country in which humans' treatment of animals has moved beyond the Dark Ages? If so, hats off to them.

 

[Netzach]

Uh as most horsewomen will tell you, MOST horse stalls are made so that the horse cannot easily turn around and thus kill you when you go in to get them. They can lie down though.

Pink doesn't give a fuck if 899 people freeze to death to the steps of St. Pat's, I will bet money.

Call me insane, but while I'm not angling for reincarnation as a Columbus Circle pony, I can think of worse things to have to come back as. Like a person in Manhattan who sleeps on a grate.

Also they have a temp cutoff - the city imposed one on them. You can sleep on a grate if it goes below 15 but if you are a pony you don't have to work. It may be something like 20 or 10, I don't recall offhand.

As you spent time in Brooklyn (good for you) you really DID get to do some watching of people. I worry about the Disneyfication of Manhattan because so few native NYC'ers and recent immigrants, (the people who really make NYC NYC) can actually afford to live there that the look feel and priorities of the place have actually changed to something I don't entirely recognize.

God now I'm homesick. Homeless people and carriage ponies and all.

 

[JMohegan]

Pink doesn't give a fuck if 899 people freeze to death to the steps of St. Pat's, I will bet money.

Does compassion for one necessarily preclude compassion for the other? Is this commentary on the individual, or rock stars in general here?


Dear Mr. President
- Pink, 2006

Dear Mr. President
Come take a walk with me
Let's pretend we're just two people and
You're not better than me
I'd like to ask you some questions if we can speak honestly

What do you feel when you see all the homeless on the street
Who do you pray for at night before you go to sleep
What do you feel when you look in the mirror
Are you proud

How do you sleep while the rest of us cry
How do you dream when a mother has no chance to say goodbye
How do you walk with your head held high
Can you even look me in the eye
And tell me why

Dear Mr. President
Were you a lonely boy
Are you a lonely boy
Are you a lonely boy
How can you say
No child is left behind
We're not dumb and we're not blind
They're all sitting in your cells
While you pave the road to hell

What kind of father would take his own daughter's rights away
And what kind of father might hate his own daughter if she were gay
I can only imagine what the first lady has to say
You've come a long way from whiskey and cocaine

How do you sleep while the rest of us cry
How do you dream when a mother has no chance to say goodbye
How do you walk with your head held high
Can you even look me in the eye

Let me tell you bout hard work
Minimum wage with a baby on the way
Let me tell you bout hard work
Rebuilding your house after the bombs took them away
Let me tell you bout hard work
Building a bed out of a cardboard box
Let me tell you bout hard work
Hard work
Hard work
You don't know nothing bout hard work
Hard work
Hard work
Oh

How do you sleep at night
How do you walk with your head held high
Dear Mr. President
You'd never take a walk with me
Would you

 

[Netzach]

Does compassion for one necessarily preclude compassion for the other?

No, but I think it shifts the focus in a very questionable fashion. I'm against vivisection, but I think we need to start by eradicating the vivisection of humans. Animal shelters still outgross women's shelters.

And rock stars in general.

 

[JMohegan]

No, but I think it shifts the focus in a very questionable fashion. I'm against vivisection, but I think we need to start by eradicating the vivisection of humans. Animal shelters still outgross women's shelters.

And rock stars in general.

I see your point, though I personally see value in both battles, simultaneously fought.

I don't know anything about Pink as an individual. As for self-promoting rock stars in general, I'll take outspoken liberal over vacuous fluff. Everything's relative, no?

 

[dave's thing]

Hey Velvet:
Good to hear the trip went well and how excited you are about!!

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I'm not suggesting that Pink is some kind of paragon of selfless charity but she did speak publicly about the horses and I read about it recently so it was prescient when I saw them. I do think it's a thankless, boring life for them. Given Netz's insight on their sleeping stalls and working temperatures, they don't seem to be mistreated in any legal sense.

I always have time for celebrities who seek to promote causes they care about, simply because they are still very much in the minority. It may prove to be misguided on Pink's part to think the horses victims of cruelty, but I can give her kudos for giving a fuck about something other than herself.

 

[JMohegan]

I'm not suggesting that Pink is some kind of paragon of selfless charity but she did speak publicly about the horses and I read about it recently so it was prescient when I saw them. I do think it's a thankless, boring life for them. Given Netz's insight on their sleeping stalls and working temperatures, they don't seem to be mistreated in any legal sense.

I always have time for celebrities who seek to promote causes they care about, simply because they are still very much in the minority. It may prove to be misguided on Pink's part to think the horses victims of cruelty, but I can give her kudos for giving a fuck about something other than herself.

Cruelty is in the eye (soul) of the beholder, particularly when the victim has no voice. In my opinion, the treatment of those horses *is* cruel, most definitely. But my view on this subject is pretty far out on one end of the spectrum.

As for Pink, Wikipedia notes:

"Pink, who follows a strict vegetarian lifestyle, is a prominent campaigner for PETA, contributing her voice towards causes such as a protest against KFC. She sent a letter to Prince William criticizing him for fox hunting and one to Queen Elizabeth II protesting the use of real fur in the bearskins of the Foot Guards and the Honourable Artillery Company. In November 2006, Pink mentioned in the News of the World that she was disgusted with fellow singer Beyoncé for wearing fur. In conjunction with PETA, she criticized the Australian wool industry over its use of mulesing. In January 2007, she stated that she had been misled by PETA about mulesing and that she had not done enough research before lending her name to the campaign. Her campaigning led to a headlining concert in Cardiff, Wales on August 21, 2007 called PAW (Party for Animals Worldwide). This highlighted her involvement with animal cruelty problems."

This seems like tilting at windmills in some cases, but in general I say: Good for her.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

Cruelty is in the eye (soul) of the beholder, particularly when the victim has no voice. In my opinion, the treatment of those horses *is* cruel, most definitely. But my view on this subject is pretty far out on one end of the spectrum.

As for Pink...

This seems like tilting at windmills in some cases, but in general I say: Good for her.

I agree. You have to admire her spirit, even if her facts aren't always 100% straight.

 

[alexanna]

Wow....TPE just sounds a lot like marriage.

 

[rooky2]

I bit it off, now I have to chew it...how is the taste?

Do you enjoy being in this situation? The words don’t say so in your letter. Money or economics is the base of wars and break-ups...exceptions can be lil child for mum or may be parents...some times even siblings, even less partners. Assess where your relationship stand realistically; the choice of your words suggest it’s not like the exceptions mentioned above. If it is not, don’t try to make it an exception…for there is nothing easier, and also worse, then deceiving your own self.

I have lost a lot in lending to "friends" ... still have not learned to say "no". But have learn one thing - organize my finances, so the account which is my personal (not business, not mortgage) if it has the money, I see the demand made on it, if I can part away, I do, and when I do, I do not expect it back whether its $100 or $10,000. So, if it comes back, I am happy, if it does not, it doest not hurt much...!

 

[Etoile]

Do you enjoy being in this situation? The words don