News & Views: Discussion and Announcements for the Survivorphile

[Svenskaflicka]

Hmmm... tough one. I'd say that if it's clear beyond any doubt that the author has intentionally cheated, then G, exclusion, would be the only right thing to do.

If the author on the other hand has used a public domain, royalty free image and manipulated it in a graphics program to make it different, would that then be a crime? If it is, then I vote C, as I think it's half-cheating, half-making-an-effort.

 

[Guest]

Svenska, the rules specifically prohibit the use of public domain pictures.

The use of royalty-free and/or public domain images will make a submission ineligible for points.

I should add that I think if someone does this and does not get excluded completely from the contest, then he/she should lose all illustrated points for any illustrated submissions and not be allowed to submit in those categories (must use immunities). If someone cheats once, who's to say they won't cheat again?

 

[Lauren Hynde]

Hmmm... tough one. I'd say that if it's clear beyond any doubt that the author has intentionally cheated, then G, exclusion, would be the only right thing to do.

If the author on the other hand has used a public domain, royalty free image and manipulated it in a graphics program to make it different, would that then be a crime? If it is, then I vote C, as I think it's half-cheating, half-making-an-effort.

Personally, I tend to agree with you, and that is why I decided to put this question to general discussion instead of simply following the current rule that says exclusion.

If an author uses copyrighted artwork and tries to pass it as his own, that is plagiarism pure and simple, and I would have no moral qualms with straight forward exclusion.

But if that author uses slightly altered royalty-free, public domain images, while clearly against the rules, I have to confess that I would probably consider exclusion an excessive action and would lean more toward something in the C to F spectrum.

Using royalty-free or public domain images and lying about it, though, would show a premeditation that could merit exclusion anyway.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

I should add that I think if someone does this and does not get excluded completely from the contest, then he/she should lose all illustrated points for any illustrated submissions and not be allowed to submit in those categories (must use immunities). If someone cheats once, who's to say they won't cheat again?

Well, technically, the only submissions that matter are the ones inscribed on a contestant's ScoreCard on January 5th, 2006.

Whatever happens before then, and as long as the submissions get past Literotica's filter, should be taken merely as an indication.

 

[petitelove]

I have to agree with the consensus on this one. The rules very clearly say any cheating or plagirism is grounds for being kicked out of the contest. Therefore, I agree that the offending contestant should be removed from the competition if contradictory proof to their attestment of authenticity can be found. Besides that, if this one instance is allowed to slip through, then the gates are open....


xoxoxo

 

[Guest]

Option A

No penalty; just a simple deduction of the points

 

[darkgoddess2478]

My vote is for exclusion from the contest. Plagarism in any form is completely inexcusible and pretty damned sad IMHO.

 

[msboy8]

In my humble opinion, I think that option g is the only way to deal with it. I also think they should be excluded from All future contests too. This is supposed to be fun, a way we can write more stoties.

 

[Boxlicker101]

Tentatively, I would say expulsion from the contest. However, I would want to know more about the violation. If somebody copied pics from some site, that would be a flagrant violation so expulsion from the contest would be proper. If somebody used photos provided by a friend, and this was considered illegal, than subtract the points but nothing else. It may have been a misunderstanding.

My understanding of the rule is none too clear. Last year I submitted an illustrated poem that included pics of me and my grandson. Obviously, I did not take the photo but I saw nothing wrong with using it and nobody complained.

 

[Guest]

Well this is where life gets fun....

Last years rules left it so that people if they wanted to have a story read by another person for the audio that they could.... if they wanted to use pictures that someone had made for them or taken for them they could.... if they wanted to have someone translate a story into another language for them they could.... all they had to do in any of those cases was to make sure that it was noted in the submission to Lit that this person read it or illustrated it or translated it for the author.... easy, simple....

Doesn't seem that way now.... the rules were changed modified to eliminate the possiblity of anyone choosing any of those options.... thereby in My opinion cutting down on the number of submissions that would come from some survivor members....

I took an immunity in the category of text with audio because I simply am not going to read a 5000 word story just for the contest, I didn't last year and I won't do it this year....

However, I know that SEVERAL people last year came to me and asked permission to have another read stuff for them... I denied NO one that right... not a single person got a no from me.

But thats not really what this about is it....

It's a witch hunt.
It's a way for one author to get rid of another author that they are competing with....
It's a way for someone to 'win' something by having someone disqualified because they don't like the way that they play the game....

Same thing that I dealt with last year... just a whole lot sooner.

My answer to the question....

If LIT does not get proof that the picture does not belong to the author of the story and thereby posts it... then the MODS of this contest have NO business penalizing the author in question WHAT SO EVER.

 

[Boxlicker101]

After reading over the rule changes, I have a question. Last year, there was a limit of ten for all poetry categories. Does this still apply? I believe there should be a limit because poems are much easier to write. I don't mean GOOD poems, I just mean poems. I could, if I were of a mind, which I never will be, churn out hundreds in a day. They would suck and I would actually be ashamed of myself, but I could do it.

 

[Guest]

Yes, there is still a 10 poem cap for each of the poetry categories.

 

[msboy8]

WTFO? I will resign from the Survivor contest if this BS continues. I really don't want to hear all this childish crap. What's the main prize, $200? If you have enough money for a computer, then $200 for a years work is chicken-feed.

Please grow up and just write, OK...

 

[sweetnpetite]

Personally, I tend to agree with you, and that is why I decided to put this question to general discussion instead of simply following the current rule that says exclusion.

If an author uses copyrighted artwork and tries to pass it as his own, that is plagiarism pure and simple, and I would have no moral qualms with straight forward exclusion.

But if that author uses slightly altered royalty-free, public domain images, while clearly against the rules, I have to confess that I would probably consider exclusion an excessive action and would lean more toward something in the C to F spectrum.

Using royalty-free or public domain images and lying about it, though, would show a premeditation that could merit exclusion anyway.

I have to admit that I would have thought that altering the pic would make it your own. (assuming that it's public domain) I mean, isn't it your illustration if you have created something with your computer out of free materials? So I'm not really sure if it's necessarily *that* clearly against the rules.

I'm fuzzy on that instance, bc I think that would make it your illustration. Brings to mind the saying "quote one person it's plagerism, quote many it's research." Seems as if there is some room for interpretation or honest misunderstanding.


Other than that, I would recomend:

1) exclusion from contest (do we really want to award a prize to an outright cheater?)

2) removal of story from site (obviously)

3) notification of original owner (assuming that this can be done without undue effort.)

4) Letting the person know that they are damn lucky not to be banned from Literotica altogether and/or having all of their stories pulled.

 

[Joseki Ko]

WTFO? I will resign from the Survivor contest if this BS continues. I really don't want to hear all this childish crap. What's the main prize, $200? If you have enough money for a computer, then $200 for a years work is chicken-feed.

Please grow up and just write, OK...

Your late,

When I found out who was moderating this year I just thought I'd avoind all the bickering whining and complaining. It seems from the rule changes they institute such as the Immunitues change on the scorecard for instance I just figured I'd save time and quit last month.

Soon as the quit whining about Velvet maybe the contest will improve. I doubt it but maybe.

Jo

 

[msboy8]

Thanks Jo. Now if I quit I get lumped in along with you, whom I know nothing about. I think I'll just unsubscribe from this thread. People know where they can find me, if I'm needed.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

Tentatively, I would say expulsion from the contest. However, I would want to know more about the violation. If somebody copied pics from some site, that would be a flagrant violation so expulsion from the contest would be proper. If somebody used photos provided by a friend, and this was considered illegal, than subtract the points but nothing else. It may have been a misunderstanding.

Hi, B-

In the hypothetical situation above, there are no misunderstandings. The focus of the situation should be the lying about the authorship after being confronted with it.

If it weren't for the lying about it (i.e. consciously cheating), that one submission would simply be invalidated and that would be the end of it.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

I have to admit that I would have thought that altering the pic would make it your own. (assuming that it's public domain) I mean, isn't it your illustration if you have created something with your computer out of free materials? So I'm not really sure if it's necessarily *that* clearly against the rules.

I'm fuzzy on that instance, bc I think that would make it your illustration. Brings to mind the saying "quote one person it's plagerism, quote many it's research." Seems as if there is some room for interpretation or honest misunderstanding.

Hi, SnP-

Again, let me say that the focus of the situation should be the lying about the authorship after being confronted with it. Otherwise, if it had simply been a misunderstanding, that submission would simply be invalidated and that would be the end of it.

And yes, of course. It all depends on the level of alteration.

If you alter an image beyond recognition, or if you sampled several images and worked them so that the focal point of the piece is not one of them but the entirety of the ensemble, then it would be your creation, whether the base images were public domain or not.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

WTFO? I will resign from the Survivor contest if this BS continues. I really don't want to hear all this childish crap. What's the main prize, $200? If you have enough money for a computer, then $200 for a years work is chicken-feed.

Please grow up and just write, OK...

Hi, Msboy (and everyone else)

Please pay no attention to what Elizabetht (who was last year's moderator) and/or Joseki say.

The contents of Elizabetht's and Joseki's posts about this year's Survivor Rules are entirely lies, with the only purpose of keeping possible competitors away.

• In 2004, if people wanted someone else to read their audio, they needed the previous permission of the moderator, and would only be entitled to half the points;
• In 2005, if people want someone else to read their audio, they can do it (as is explicitly stated in Literotica's submission guidelines!) without having to ask anyone's permission, and receiving full points.
  
  
• In 2004, if people wanted someone to translate their stories into another language, they needed the previous permission of the moderator, and would only be entitled to half the points;
• In 2005, if people want someone to translate their stories, they can. No questions asked, full points awarded.
  
  
• In 2004, if people wanted to use someone else's artwork, they needed the previous permission of the moderator, and would only be entitled to half the points;
• In 2005, this specific rule was corrected, because Literotica's Submission Guidelines specifically state that "all art within the story, like the story itself, must be your original work - i.e. photographs that you yourself took, or paintings or drawings that you yourself created," and no Survivor rule can supersede Literotica's guidelines.

Use your head.

If this were a witch-hunt, as Elizabetht puts it, why would we be asking your opinion on this and on every subject? If we wanted to eliminate someone, we could simply wait until the end of the year, and then, following what the rules say, do it!

Instead, we are here, discussing and explaining all the rules, unlike what happened last year, confirming all the changes with Laurel, unlike what happened last year, systematically eliminating every possibility of moderator bias, unlike what happened last year.

Elizabetht and Joseki are desperately looking for ways of destabilising the Contest, but when they see the new prize lists that we convinced Laurel to give us, when that see that the rules have become clearer and fairer, without any loopholes for cheating the spirit in which the contest was created, when they see that we are discussing everything with all the contestants without exception, taking our time to make the FAQ thread more user-friendly and complete, when they see that we are even warning everyone each time they win an immunity instead of sitting quietly in the hopes that no one would notice (as was common practice last year), when they see that we are simply trying to make every contestant's experience the most fun that is possible, without any hope of personal gain (because, unlike last year, the moderators are not contestants), all they have left is lies.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

It seems from the rule changes they institute such as the Immunitues change on the scorecard for instance...

There were no changes whatsoever made to immunities, but if you have any ideas, feel free to share.

 

[lindiana]

The rules say they will be kicked from the contest.
So I agree. Dismiss them.

 

[Joseki Ko]

Greetings and Salutations,

Always nice to hear from a fan Lauren.

Well lets do as Lauren has done and take this list point by point.

Hi, Msboy (and everyone else)

(waves Hi back)

Please pay no attention to what Elizabetht (who was last year's moderator) and/or Joseki say.

(I'm sure she would rather I was not around)

The contents of Elizabetht's and Joseki's posts about this year's Survivor Rules are entirely lies, with the only purpose of keeping possible competitors away.

(Interesting choice of words since I am not in this years contest because I have issues with both the Moderators. Which I believe I have been pretty public about)

• In 2004, if people wanted someone else to read their audio, they needed the previous permission of the moderator, and would only be entitled to half the points;
• In 2005, if people want someone else to read their audio, they can do it (as is explicitly stated in Literotica's submission guidelines!) without having to ask anyone's permission, and receiving full points.
  
  (In 2004 all you had to get the permission of the mod to have someone else read your submission. This did not carry any point penalty. Nor was Elizabetht the author of this rule. This was in effect in the beginning of the 2004 contest as anyone can go back and read. In 2005 the origional rule stated that only the author could read the submission. Has this changed?)
  
• In 2004, if people wanted someone to translate their stories into another language, they needed the previous permission of the moderator, and would only be entitled to half the points;
• In 2005, if people want someone to translate their stories, they can. No questions asked, full points awarded.
  
  (In 2005 there is not a non-english category. As we argued in earlier posts. So this point only sophistry at best)
  
• In 2004, if people wanted to use someone else's artwork, they needed the previous permission of the moderator, and would only be entitled to half the points;
• In 2005, this specific rule was corrected, because Literotica's Submission Guidelines specifically state that "all art within the story, like the story itself, must be your original work - i.e. photographs that you yourself took, or paintings or drawings that you yourself created," and no Survivor rule can supersede Literotica's guidelines.

(Again we see the half point thing. You may all go back and find that there were no half points awarded for posting a submission with artwork used by permission)


Use your head.

If this were a witch-hunt, as Elizabetht puts it, why would we be asking your opinion on this and on every subject?

(I haven't found this to be the case as I've pointed out in several previous posts that you may all go back and see, but then again according to lauren I'm lying)

If we wanted to eliminate someone, we could simply wait until the end of the year, and then, following what the rules say, do it!
Instead, we are here, discussing and explaining all the rules, unlike what happened last year, confirming all the changes with Laurel, unlike what happened last year, systematically eliminating every possibility of moderator bias, unlike what happened last year.

(This statement is so mind boggling I don't know where to begin. The only truly Major issue I recall from last year was the non-english story translations for points. There may be more but this is the only Major one I recall. If you all go back and look in the 2004 thread it is there again for you all to see. The rule change was discussed and a decision was made. And like all fair decisions are it upset both sides of the argument. I read through the threads now and I see one attack after another on Velvet as lauren says UNLIKE WHAT HAPPEND LAST YEAR)

Elizabetht and Joseki are desperately looking for ways of destabilising the Contest,

(Why)

)but when they see the new prize lists that we convinced Laurel to give us,

(Since I'm not a contestant I don't see that as much of an argument)

when that see that the rules have become clearer and fairer, without any loopholes for cheating the spirit in which the contest was created,

(In any contest or club the rules change from year to year to cover the events of the previous year)

when they see that we are discussing everything with all the contestants without exception,

(I believe I have disputed that before)

taking our time to make the FAQ thread more user-friendly and complete, when they see that we are even warning everyone each time they win an immunity instead of sitting quietly in the hopes that no one would notice (as was common practice last year),

(Last year I hoped everyone would take as many immunities as they could get. Meant they scored less points overall)

when they see that we are simply trying to make every contestant's experience the most fun that is possible, without any hope of personal gain (because, unlike last year, the moderators are not contestants),

(Elizabetht became the moderator last year when we had none. She stepped up to the plate when no one else would do it. She basically stopped writing when she did that. Again this may be verified by checking the 2004 threads and Elizabethts submission dates. So again this argument is nothing but sophistry)


all they have left is lies.

(I have provided directions for you to ascertain the basis of the situation for yourself)


Ok now that we have gone over that You should ask yourself if any if this really matters to you. I for one hope it doesn't. I hope you continue to write and submit. For this at the best is a very personal contest where you strive to be the best. (Unlike last year) Last year both jim and I took Major short cuts. We would write a 3000 word story and then brake it up into 750 word chunks so we could post more stories. I believe that loophole is still available. I know most of the major players last year knew this was done as was alluded to earlier in this thread. Neither one of us cared it was all about the points.

Lets add a little more history to the mix. lauren, jim, Elizabethet and I have some Major history. We have fought like cats and dogs over several issues. Fact of the matter is we just don't like each other. I felt that the two of them did nothing but whine to Laurel in order to become the moderators this year. I have rather enjoyed hoistng them by thier own petards when they violate a protocal that they were so against before. The rule changes being the most enjoyable. This post has by far been the most fun as everything i have said is open to verifacation if you wish to put in the time to check it out.

And I'll add a little of the line they have used so eloquently this year.

I'm not a contestant so of course I must have an objevtive opinion for I gain nothing either way.

(Gotta love that B.S,) Jo

 

[cloudy]

C'mon!!!

Isn't this getting just a little ridiculous??

Please.

 

[Boxlicker101]

C'mon!!!

Isn't this getting just a little ridiculous??

Please.

I have to agree with Cloudy. This contest is supposed to be fun. I can't imagine anybody competing here for the money, even though it would be nice. I don't expect to win anything; I just like to write smutty stories and be recognized as a prolific producer of smut. That's not to say I would turn down the prize if I do win.

Can't everybody just agree tlo be reasonable? Obviously, we can't post copyrighted photos or drawings any more than we can post copyrighted stories and pass them off as our own. At the same time, I believe photos should be eligible as long as they were taken for the writer to post with a story. Sometimes I write a story about one of my readers and I might ask her to provide me with pics to use with it. As I said earlier, obviously I was not the photographer of the pic taken of me and my grandson and included in an illustrated poem last year.

I wonder about something else, also. The rule about photos is that they cannot be of nudes. Why is that? If I write a pornographic illustrated story, why can the illustrations accompanying it not also be pornographic? That rule apparently does not apply to drawings.

 

[Lauren Hynde]

C'mon!!!

Isn't this getting just a little ridiculous??

Please.

Yes, but what can we do, Cloudy? I can only ask the new and possible future contestants out there to think for themselves...