Parenting and Kink

[Evil_Geoff]

Been through the divorce thing once... ours was reasonably amicable in that we realized out lives had gone seperate directions a long time ago and had been pretty much roomates/FWB for sometime. The divorce was basically done to allow us both to move on and heal, to stop hurting one another.

My discovery of, and need to pursue, the BDSM lifestyle inorder to finally be true to myself was just the final nail in the coffin. Yes, my BDSM involvement was mentioned during the proceedings. Yes, I was told by the judge that if I exposed my children to this lifestyle my visitation rights would be rescinded in a heartbeat. But beyond that, my ex didn't make an issue of it.

And I know I was lucky.

*sighs* Hell, if my ex was a submissive or at least a masochist, or had been poly capable so I could have a sub/slave in our relationship, or if she had it in her to be open in the relationship so I could have a slave on the side, we'd still be together...

Unfortunately, if she was into the lifestyle she'd be a Domme all the way. And she's as monogamous as they get. *sighs* It just wasn't gonna work.

itw, coy, y'all have my sympathy and support during these difficult, trying times. {{{{{{{{{{{{{GROUPHUG}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

 

[HottieMama]

My discovery of, and need to pursue, the BDSM lifestyle inorder to finally be true to myself was just the final nail in the coffin. Yes, my BDSM involvement was mentioned during the proceedings. Yes, I was told by the judge that if I exposed my children to this lifestyle my visitation rights would be rescinded in a heartbeat. But beyond that, my ex didn't make an issue of it.

Geoff...just out of..umm..curiosity...Did the judge ever explain what they meant by "exposed?" Are we talking just "bedroom activities," or the daily life things of a D/s relationship?

ITW, Coy...i'm right there with the both of you....and always open to chatting.

 

[Evil_Geoff]

...Did the judge ever explain what they meant by "exposed?"

Nope... the judge never explicitely defined "exposed" in this sense. I took it to mean that if the kids ever came back home and said something like "Hey mom! Guess what we found at Dad's place? He's got the cooooolest cross and these leather handcuffs... and he had his girfriend over there on her knees, crawling around..." and she then went to the judge and complained I was going to be up the creek..

As it was, I was in an LDR at the time, did not have a dungeon set up in the home, kept my toys packed away and it wasn't until the boys were about to graduate highschool that I had a relatively local submissive, so it wasn't a major issue with me. It's not like I was going to drag them to a munch or play party... know what I mean? *chuckles*

I just kept a low profile and didn't rub my ex's nose in my relationships after the divorce. I paid my child support on time and did my best to be a good dad for my boys... It's worked out pretty well, my ex and I get a long pretty well now.

 

[intothewoods]

Just wanted to post an update, and thank you all for posting, and PMing me your support.

I'm still dealing with the "negotiation" on this, with a coparenting counselor at this time. We are both hoping to avoid court.

I see the past 6 or 7 months as a time in which I made a lot of discoveries about myself, and made some poor choices. For me, there were a lot of different issues at play. For my husband, I spend too much time on the internet, am too trusting of people I meet over the internet, am exploring a lifestyle which attracts some untrustworthy people, and am engaged in risky behavior. It's all part and parcel of the same package.

I'm trying to reframe the argument as a set of differnet issues. I'll feel better once I hire the lawyer, and get some advice about how much to agree to. I'm not planning on meeting anyone in the guise of a relationship right now, internet or otherwise. And I'm also not planning on meeting anyone to "hook up" with over the internet. It's not worth running a background check for a damn booty call.

I talked with my husband this morning about internet relationships, and actually told him about cat and bandit, those who did actually meet their current husbands online, and how much checking and verifying had gone on beforehand.

I see no reason not to pursue my interest in bdsm, but I also am aware that - big picture - I am and want to remain the primary parent, even if we have joint custody. There are then some things, like meeting a play partner online, that I just won't do. The risk isn't worth it. I'm really lucky to have a local group whose core members are really great, smart, responsible and safe people, so I'll just meet friends there.

Anyway, just speaking aloud here, but maybe this thread can be a support for people, like coy, for example, who are going through this situation. I will hopefully have some useful information once I meet with my lawyer. And actually, I may also call the lawyer that Cutie posted information for.

I don't know how much of what I have posted here has been collected by my husband, and I thought about deleting my account. But I think it may be more helpful for me to continue in this forum. I've been pretty honest about my fuck-ups, and I think at the end of the day I still have a good head on my shoulders. Thanks for listening.

Edited to clarify a point...

 

[Shankara20]

Thanks for listening.

Thank you for trusting us enough to keep us posted our your process. I can only say two things right now. The first is a wish for you, your ex and family all the strength and clarity possible to find your way through this (I am encouraged that you are trying to discuss this as openly as possible with him.)

The second thing I want to say is to not worry about sending me those panties. I understand that there are other more pressing issues in your life right now - I reserve the right to remind you at some date in the future when the more rambunctious ITW returns.

 

[intothewoods]

In case this wasn't clear, I'm not implying that FM or anyone else I've met here isn't safe. And I'm not saying I wouldn't ever look online to meet someone for a relationship. What I am saying is that because you have to do so much checking to make sure a person you meet online is who they say they are, it ain't worth it for a booty call.

 

[intothewoods]

Thank you for trusting us enough to keep us posted our your process. I can only say two things right now. The first is a wish for you, your ex and family all the strength and clarity possible to find your way through this (I am encouraged that you are trying to discuss this as openly as possible with him.)

The second thing I want to say is to not worry about sending me those panties. I understand that there are other more pressing issues in your life right now - I reserve the right to remind you at some date in the future when the more rambunctious ITW returns.

Thank you.

 

[gingermango]

I'm coming late to this thread, but I wanted to tell you that I've been there and done that, gotten the divorce and lived to tell about it.

At first my ex- was just fine with her living her life and me living mine (including doing whatever exploration needed doing). That was about 7 years ago. About 4 years ago things went south, quickly. Our child has been living in both households equally and we have joint decision-making authority on all things, right down the line. At that time, however, she started insisting on making some important decisions (such as school selection, etc.) without talking to me at all, let alone making any kind of "joint" decisions. She started taking our child to a counselor, insisting there were "adjustment issues" and reporting behavior that I just never saw in my household: discipline matters, moodiness, etc. Frankly, when the child is my house we never saw those things: we saw a happy kid, glad to be step-siblings, laughing and playing. Not to mention being a straight-A student, despite whatever problems my ex- was cooking up.

Once I found out about the therapist, I called her, informed her that I had joint decision-making authority for every matter involving my child and told her I'd like to meet with her myself. She was shocked to learn my side of matters. Some of our discussions dealt with my sexual interests and how my ex- was recently starting to insinuate that she might be "forced" to bring out that information to show I was not a good parental figure and that she should be granted full-custody.

The therapist, when I explained my interests in alternative sexuality and gender role-play, merely said, "That's very common ..." and proceeded to basically pooh pooh my ex-'s threats. She was MUCH more interested in hearing of certain behaviors by my ex's new husband and her father, such as threatening and insulting me within earshot of the child, the unilateral decision-making, etc., none of which the therapist has heard about.

In short, this therapist, the most highly-regarded child and family therapist in our medium-sized southern town, didn't give a rat's ass that I was kinky. Once that became clear, my ex- suddenly decided that the child was doing much better and after another session or two decided that there was no longer any need for the therapist. Go figure.

Since my ex- learned that she cannot emotionally blackmail me with my kinks, she has become MUCH easier to deal with.

Anyway, just my experiences. I hope things turn out well for you in the end.

 

[coy_one]

I appreciate the support. I just can't expose anymore than that. I'm playing it low key until the bastard just leaves me the hell alone.

 

[gingermango]

I'm playing it low key until the bastard just leaves me the hell alone.

It might be a long time; remember, you're joined at the hip (whether you want to be or not) until the child reaches 18. Good luck.

 

[graceanne]

Ok, so I was reading this and DUH. Someone who might have more info than I do is esclave_pp. She recently divorced and had similar issues. Even now her ex occasionally threatens to try and take her son. Luckily she's got a very good lawyer.

 

[AndrewKay]

Hello

Like others have said here, an amicable split might be your most desired option (and his). Communication, cooperation, and a mutual sense that you are both not going to go all out with lawyers is important. Security (as mentioned before) can definately make a split more amicable.

Be prepared though. In terms of advice beyond just working the tact-angle, I would either prepare through talking to a divorce expert now, or be ready to take this step. It's up to you whether you want to take this step now or later. I say if the tact approach doesn't work, and things start slipping, get the best lawyer and do not try to handle things yourself. Get a lawyer who has worked on cases involving divorce, a child, and an unorthodox relationship/affair. This should not be so hard as it sounds because divorce due to one partner joining a sex-related forum is not that unusual (or divorce due to an online affair). The closer the lawyer has worked with cases similar to yours, the better (more important than general prestige of a law firm).

Good luck. Whoa I am late! Hopefully the kid is many years closer to 18, and things are going well.

 

[intothewoods]

Well, it's been a rocky road, though things have greatly improved.

My "ex" (we're separated - what do you call that?) and I are now living apart, and have worked out custody. We have resolved most of the kink-related issues by agreeing that romantic partners are not introduced to our kid. In general, he's been able to mellow out on these things, for lack of a better term.

Our one remaining issue relates to some great parents in the local community. One particular couple I really adore, and they have a kid a bit older than my son. We'd like the kids to play together, but I have been honest with my husband, and the truth is, I do "play" with the guy at parties (though we did play once privately). Nothing really sexual happened, so in my mind it's not a romantic partner. We really are just friends. I absolutely would not do anything remotely "romantic" or kink-related in front of my kid. He would be just another kid's dad.

My husband is still uncomfortable with the idea. We're supposed to discuss it with the coparenting counselor, but I'm starting to feel like, shit, this guy accepts kink - but is he going to really get that two people can have a scene and it's not particularly sexual? And can just be friends? It's really a bdsm thing that I don't think most people can wrap their heads around.

And then I think, wtf, am I just pushing too hard, too fast? And then I thought, I should just lie and tell him I don't scene with the guy anymore. But I don't want to lie. I am tired of shame and lies. Exhausted by it.

I guess - I really appreciate input but I have to say that keep in mind that my husband is a good guy actually, just trying to understand bdsm as an outsider, and also struggling to deal with his own hurt over our breakup. We're trying to do what's best for our kid, and he is also genuinely trying to be protective of his son.

Also, I do strongly agree that sexual partners should NOT be introduced to our kid right now. Frankly, I'm not introducing anyone that I'm romantically involved with to him unless I am thinking marriage. Period. End of story.

But I see someone this other guy as a friend. I'm friends with both him and his wife, and there is no romantic/emotional anything other than friendship.

I guess I'm just trying to make sure my thinking is okay, and how to explain it to the coparenting counselor and husband.

 

[graceanne]

I totally missed that this thread had been resurrected.

I don't have anything really to add, just a 'sorry you're in a sucky situation', and a *hugs*

 

[intothewoods]

I totally missed that this thread had been resurrected.

I don't have anything really to add, just a 'sorry you're in a sucky situation', and a *hugs*

Thank you, graceanne. One day at a time - I keep telling myself...

 

[Shankara20]

....

I guess I'm just trying to make sure my thinking is okay, and how to explain it to the coparenting counselor and husband.

Sounds like you just might outline it much like you did here.

I have no advice directly. My kids were all grown up when I came out. My wife-at-the-time (not my kids mom) and I had to work through the "I'm not into your kink" stuff, and we did. She accepts it for me, and is still a bit unsettled about it even after 10 years.

I'm glad to here it is smoothing out a little for you.

 

[graceanne]

Thank you, graceanne. One day at a time - I keep telling myself...

Yep. That's the best advice you're gonna get.

 

[intothewoods]

Sounds like you just might outline it much like you did here.

I have no advice directly. My kids were all grown up when I came out. My wife-at-the-time (not my kids mom) and I had to work through the "I'm not into your kink" stuff, and we did. She accepts it for me, and is still a bit unsettled about it even after 10 years.

I'm glad to here it is smoothing out a little for you.

Thank you. I'm getting there, slowly but surely. It's just hard to discuss these things with people - like the counselor, like my husband - who just don't understand bdsm. Hell, I am still struggling to understand it.

 

[Shankara20]

Thank you. I'm getting there, slowly but surely. It's just hard to discuss these things with people - like the counselor, like my husband - who just don't understand bdsm. Hell, I am still struggling to understand it.

me too

I've gotten better about accepting who I am without understanding it.

remember, you are not alone in all this, we care and are here

 

[Daddyslilpet]

And then I think, wtf, am I just pushing too hard, too fast? And then I thought, I should just lie and tell him I don't scene with the guy anymore. But I don't want to lie. I am tired of shame and lies. Exhausted by it.

I guess - I really appreciate input but I have to say that keep in mind that my husband is a good guy actually, just trying to understand bdsm as an outsider, and also struggling to deal with his own hurt over our breakup. We're trying to do what's best for our kid, and he is also genuinely trying to be protective of his son.

My only advice is to be as open and honest with your husband as you can be. Don't lie, lies will only come back to bite you in the ass later.

 

[intothewoods]

Thank you, Papa Shank. Really and truly.

My only advice is to be as open and honest with your husband as you can be. Don't lie, lies will only come back to bite you in the ass later.

I know, and I won't. I think I am just tired of defending myself. I talked to him tonight and explained this to him. I think that the issue, and the situation has been framed in terms of - should itw be allowed to do x as a parent - and I'm tired of it. Now, this isn't all my husband's fault. Because I felt so guilty about lying, I ended up playing this part willingly. I'm going to try and explain this in our next session, and hope for the best.

You know, and then underlying this whole thing is the fact that my husband and I have so much unresolved shit. I just don't know if we're done or not.

 

[Daddyslilpet]

I know, and I won't. I think I am just tired of defending myself. I talked to him tonight and explained this to him. I think that the issue, and the situation has been framed in terms of - should itw be allowed to do x as a parent - and I'm tired of it. Now, this isn't all my husband's fault. Because I felt so guilty about lying, I ended up playing this part willingly. I'm going to try and explain this in our next session, and hope for the best.

You know, and then underlying this whole thing is the fact that my husband and I have so much unresolved shit. I just don't know if we're done or not.

Hang in there! Stay strong, it'll get better in time I swear!

 

[intothewoods]

Hang in there! Stay strong, it'll get better in time I swear!

This week and last week have been shit, I gotta say. I feel like my husband moved out and he's all relieved to be away from me, and I'm stuck dealing with stuff.

And my vanilla friends all go, wow, I'm worried about you. You've totally changed. And many of them are smart, perceptive people who just care. So I can't just dismiss them, you know? I'm trying to explain myself and yet maintain some privacy. Privacy without shame and secrecy, you know?

And then my scene friends - well, I'm still trying to figure out who I can trust. And most of them aren't parents, so I'm often having to explain...everything.

And my family wants to know why my husband and I aren't going to counseling, and how much do I say?

Don't worry. These questions need not be answered now. I'm seeing a therapist on Friday! Oy...lol...

 

[EmpressFi]

I remember when my first husband and I divorced. I did things all wrong... I cheated on him and hurt him... when I left him, I was so ashamed of HOW I was leaving that I didnt tell my family and/or friends anything other than "I'm leaving. We're getting divorced." Granted, I wasnt practicing BDSM... I didnt even know I was interested in it at the time, but I wish I'd told them something. Because guess who filled in all the blanks that my departure left in their minds... Some friends, never spoke to me again. For my family, it took me finally sitting them down and telling them exactly why I left, for them to welcome me back into the fold.

I can understand being cautious about how MUCH to tell them, but I fear that if left to him, the same thing may happen to you.

I wish you the best of luck in this most difficult of times.

if you need to talk, I'm a PM away

 

[graceanne]

This week and last week have been shit, I gotta say. I feel like my husband moved out and he's all relieved to be away from me, and I'm stuck dealing with stuff.

And my vanilla friends all go, wow, I'm worried about you. You've totally changed. And many of them are smart, perceptive people who just care. So I can't just dismiss them, you know? I'm trying to explain myself and yet maintain some privacy. Privacy without shame and secrecy, you know?

And then my scene friends - well, I'm still trying to figure out who I can trust. And most of them aren't parents, so I'm often having to explain...everything.

And my family wants to know why my husband and I aren't going to counseling, and how much do I say?

Don't worry. These questions need not be answered now. I'm seeing a therapist on Friday! Oy...lol...

To most of those people you can tell them it's private, and then stand by that. Their comes a point where you don't need to bare your whole life to anyone, family or friends.

I hesitate to suggest this, cause I hate shrinks, but have you considered doing a couple of sessions with a kink friendly therapist, on your own? Maybe s/he could help you with your shame issues.