Should men write lesbian erotica!

[BlackSnake]

When I see stories about lesbians, I don't give a shit if they love or hate each other, as long as it gets my dick hard. When I'm looking for something with substance, it's not erotica.

Poll your readers. The more taboo, the better. For instance, incest stories. If the story is dry, it will get bad votes if any at all. I haven't been here that long and I've noticed that.

Like I wrote before, this thread was just curiosity.

 

[BigTexan]

Actually, Ms. M was quoting me, Madame Manga, and didn't put the quote in bold, so the line about "men with tits' looked like her words. The resemblance in our initials probably confused a few people as well. Check the fifth post in this thread for my full remarks.

Oops, my bad.

As a writer who is both good and seeking to improve, you are unusual, IMO.
MM

I hope that you are wrong here. I'm not sure of it, but I sincerely hope that you are.

Okay, I've cooled down some. I apologize to anyone offended by my remarks. I suppose I'm too touchy about this and many other subjects, eh?

BigTexan

 

[Diane Marie]

Dean Koontz wrote a few romance novels early in his career. He wrote them under a female pen name so that the publisher would publish them. In his "Companion" book, he talks about the many female fans who wrote telling him how wonderful they were.

Personally I find this very sexist. Granted there was a time when all women had to use a male name to be published but romance written by a man is sellable. Could it really be that Dean Koontz felt writing romance was beneath him?

As strange as some of you may think this is, I like reading first person stories written by men, as if they were women. I think it provides so much insight into a man’s psyche. What I just hate is a man writing as a woman, then claiming to be a woman, and in most cases that is easy to spot. I’m sure that some men pull that off nicely, just as BigTexan claims he can, but that doesn’t mean I have to like the idea.

 

[TheEarl]

DM: I rarely make a decision of who I dislike on one or two comments. I am not enamoured of you mainly due to your noising up of KillerMuffin, but I don't actively dislike you, so my comments aren't coloured by that.

Romance is often a very sexist business. I dare say that Koontz may have been unable to get published if he presented himself as a man. Take a look at the Black Lace submissions guidelines: Stories written by men will not be considered, without any exceptions. This means that I'm considered inferior to anyone with two X chromosomes who can pick up a pen.

In a way, male cheap porn writers have pissed in the tank we all have to drink from. If I say I'm an erotica writer, people wouldn't think of them of being anywhere near the quality of my other writing, they'd consider me a stroke writer (part of the reason why I don't tell anyone). If a woman said that, they'd be more likely to have it viewed as one step above romance; something with class.

The Earl

 

[NoJo]

Cat fight!!!!

Diane Marie, please read A Romance:Shutdown and Restart. I'd be interested to know what your comments are; how much of a male viwepoint do you think there was, particularly during the sexual encounters (which are not really the main part of story --it IS a romance).

 

[Guest]

Cat fight?

I always thought a good cat fight involved two women........

Am I missing something? LOL......

Then again........that could start a whole new argument I suppose.


I remain,

 

[jfinn]

DM: Romance is often a very sexist business. I dare say that Koontz may have been unable to get published if he presented himself as a man. Take a look at the Black Lace submissions guidelines: Stories written by men will not be considered, without any exceptions. This means that I'm considered inferior to anyone with two X chromosomes who can pick up a pen.
The Earl

Actually, I'm pretty sure you're right. If my memory isn't off, I read an interview with Koontz where he came out and said it was the publishers criterium that forced him into using a pseudonym not his own fear of being seen as a romance writer.

Also, Lawrence Block, the mystery writer, got his start writing lesbian pulp romance in the early sixties. He was so convincing that his editor, a man he only knew through correspondence, flirted with him constantly. Block did an NPR interview a couple of years ago about this and trust me he wasn't embarrassed by his past.

Now I'm probably prejudiced since I'm a straight woman writing mainly about mm relationships, but I guess I don't really see the what the issue is with writing about something I'm personally not experienced with. It's my time after all and if I write something that stinks, then that's my problem and your perogative to not read it. The same I think would apply to a man writing about lesbians. Or lesbians writing about heterosexuals or... Well you get the picture.


Jayne

 

[Whispersecret]

I'm very familiar with the romance genre, and I think that the mainly female audience would read a romance with a man's name on it with a prejudice, conscious or not. Why take that risk as a publisher?

Besides, there's that male romance writer...I can't think of his name. The guy who wrote The Locket, etc. Blech. Call me chauvinistic, but I can't help but feel that a man who writes sensitive like that is way too effeminate. Other so-called male romance writers often end their books unhappily, which is NOT romantic at all. (Message in a Bottle, for instance.)

There. I'm done.

 

[BlackSnake]

Re: Cat fight?

I always thought a good cat fight involved two women........

Am I missing something? LOL......

Then again........that could start a whole new argument I suppose.


I remain,

A gay man and a lesbian fighting over writing styles, who's is better...

 

[Diane Marie]

DM: noising up of KillerMuffin

Romance is often a very sexist business. I dare say that Koontz may have been unable to get published if he presented himself as a man. Take a look at the Black Lace submissions guidelines: Stories written by men will not be considered, without any exceptions. This means that I'm considered inferior to anyone with two X chromosomes who can pick up a pen.

As far as my offending KillerMuffin, I do regret doing that. At the time I though she was a he. I tend to react negatively when I feel a man is being pretentious. That really has very little to do with gender preference, but a lot to do with spending most of my adult life in a male dominated profession. Perhaps not a good excuse but it’s the only one I have. Some may feel I should have know by her nick, but surprisingly many of the male writers here use nicks that are certainly feminine.

I have to admit that on face value Black Lace’s guidelines do seem sexist. On a practical note, I base this on how men seem to write here, it would be a really big job to weed out the bad male erotica, I’m assuming it is a big enough job just weeding out the bad female erotica. Black Lace appeals to women, an awful lot of what, maybe more so how, men write does not. Not really fair in that it also weeds out the good male authors.

One final note, it is also surprising to me that in a world which is decidedly dominated by men, being denied one small source to publish your work is so upsetting to you men. Not a lot of fun when the shoe’s on the other foot now is it!

 

[TheEarl]

Diane Marie: I'd say about 60% of the authors on Lit are just looking to write a stroke story. They have no interest in plot or any literary traits, just in writing a story that they like. Most of these I would guess are men.

Women on the other hand don't tend to write the stupidly simple story (although this is a generalisation, it is statistically correct). There are less female writers than men, but there are more who take the art seriously.

I take my story writing seriously. I never expect to get paid for anything, but I think my stories are technically well written and I'm always looking to improve.

Taking a generalisation, such as 'more men write stupidly simple porn stories than women' is fine, as it's true. Banning men from writing erotica for your books on this generalisation is stupid. I'm not the best, but I'm a very good author in my own right.

This is actually a female dominated world, simply because of the wonder that is Political Correctness. Positive discrimination results in some people getting an easier ride than others. Sexism doesn't seem to work the other way. I don't believe in positive discrimination at all, simply because the best will usually rise to the top and putting in artificial helpers for so-called 'weaker social groups' is patronising and unfair.

Apart from the armed forces, there is very little that is 'dominated by men' nowadays. There will be sexist arseholes who will make demeaning comments, but litigation in the US and the ridiculous number of EU guidelines in England means that no matter how sexist your boss is, there's very little he can do to you.

BTW Which profession are you in DM?

The Earl