Silent Treatment? Do you belive in it ?

[lil_slave_rose]

As a matter of fact, I did read. I pointed out that things happen. What do you people who have to talk to your Doms all the time do when things happen? Run around like chickens with their heads cut off until you get your Dom fix? I also pointed out that when tempers are high, some people need space to cool off. In my mind, the kindest thing for him to do is to go away for awhile. Otherwise, I'm pretty sure he'd have said something really hurtful. I don't about you, but I'd rather have several hours of nothingness than ten minutes of diatribe.

And you can bring my relationship with B. into question if you like. You won't be the first person to do so. It's taken me a long time, but I've realized that if you really to be owned by another, then you have two options when that person does something you dislike/disagree with/whatever. You can either suck it up and deal with it, or you can rethink the nature of your association with that person. I chose to deal with it because I love him despite his screw-ups. I'm often told I'm not *really* a submissive, but I do know this. Submission is NOT an easy road, and it's NOT about what the submissive wants, no matter how much people like to believe otherwise.

Nobody, SKL included, really knows what's in her Dom's head right now. To brand him as cruel when we don't know what's in his heart is jumping the gun. Sorry to burst everyone's bubbles, but it seems to me that he's human and having a perfectly human reaction to a shitty situation. The reality of D/s is that it's not some storybook fantasy with god-like characters. Subs screw up; Doms screw up. Relationships get rocky. But...submissives submit. Dominants dominate. In the end, no matter how much we want to talk it through, that's what it comes down to. I apologize if the reality check is not what everyone wanted to hear.

no one said He was cruel, they said the silent treatment is cruel to THEM and THEIR relationship and would not work for THEM in THEIR relationship. i was not bringing you and B's relationship into question i was simply saying that your comments to other posters always seem to be so harsh and hateful yet when you need someone to lean on because of relationship problems you're having then you expect the 'awwww's' and 'he's an asshole' stuff. but no one here is even saying he's a jerk for needing that space. they are giving their opinions of the silent treatment which is what this thread was about, i thought. my comments to you are not about what you are saying, but rather HOW you are saying. you are coming off very judgemental and down right mean to the OP and any other of us submissive whom happen to hate being away from our Doms.

just because we don't like it doesn't mean we can't deal with it. my point in the beginning was that she's not talking about the fact that he's at work or that he got hung up in a meeting, she's talking about the fact that he purposefully was cutting off all contact with her. not a text that says ' hey i'm upset and need to cool off' just dropped all contact...that is MUCH different than 'hey i'm at work for another 8 hours, i'll talk to you later' the point is she came here asking for advice and ended up being attacked and told that she needs to just 'deal with it' because it's life. *shrugs* i also was taught very young that if you can't say anything nice, it's best not to say anything at all...or maybe i'm missing something all together and i'm the only who sees your comments lately as rude and downright hateful...that's a good possibility i guess.

 

[lil_slave_rose]

Um...wow.

Because I don't agree with you, I'm not your friend anymore? And you don't like drama?

Just...wow.

I don't think there's anything else to say because everyone has totally missed my point (again).

Bunny, i honestly don't think it's that you dont' agree with her. i think it's more the way you have attacked her and others in this thread because 8 hours of no contact with their loved one when they are fighting devastates them. and i dont' think she said she isn't your friend. i think she's questioning you being her friend because of the way you have spoken so harshly to her about this situation. she came here looking for advice, which she got for the most part, and then she also got attacked and judged and told that she should just deal with it, it's part of life, yada yada yada, which to an extent i understand but then again when you are down, sad, upset, etc..don't you just want your friends to be supportive instead of judgmental or harsh or downright hateful? *shrugs* again i could be wrong, but this is my opinion....now, i'm going to bed as i have to be up in about 6 hours for work. have a great night everyone!

 

[SubKekiLee]

Um...wow.

Because I don't agree with you, I'm not your friend anymore? And you don't like drama?

Just...wow.

I don't think there's anything else to say because everyone has totally missed my point (again).

I never said I wasnt YOUR friend Bunny in fact it is me who sits here wiping away tears cause I come here to ask for advice and I get made fun of, I get ridiculed, and I get jumped on and told to deal with life... If it were that he got busy cause of the career he choose or something such as that then I could see I would be "overreacting" but it wasnt that at all... ****sigh***** I do not know... Im damned if I Do and I damned if I Dont

 

[Lamont Cranston]

Back to the beginning...

I have a question for everyone here.. Do you think that the silent treatment when your PYL/pyl < insert your term here> =0) Is the proper way to discipline them? As a sub perspective we are already hard enough on ourselves firstly that we do not need this but can someone give me some insight as to why some Dom's choose this route?

Okay, this thread has created some hot debate but I'll go right back to the beginning...

In this case it doesn't matter what I think about the silent treatment -- nikki has already shared that.

To me, the key is what works and doesn't work for the two of you. I would hope that you have the kind of relationship where he wants to know what is best for you. If silence is totally painful then it has to be an extreme punishment. Is eight hours too long -- I don't know. How often do you usually communicate? The important thing is that you two figure out how to handle the difficult times that are inevitable in any relationship. In what I consider a good relationship you should be able to tell him what works and doesn't work for you. He should listen and decide what is best.

I think you've seen plenty of different points of view here but the only ones that count are the ones you two have. I hope you can talk with him and be heard on this, because you deserve to be heard. After he's listened and decided then you both have choices to make. You're his because you want to be and you're his because he wants you to be. It has to work both ways.

Good luck to both of you...

 

[lil_slave_rose]

Okay, this thread has created some hot debate but I'll go right back to the beginning...

In this case it doesn't matter what I think about the silent treatment -- nikki has already shared that.

To me, the key is what works and doesn't work for the two of you. I would hope that you have the kind of relationship where he wants to know what is best for you. If silence is totally painful then it has to be an extreme punishment. Is eight hours too long -- I don't know. How often do you usually communicate? The important thing is that you two figure out how to handle the difficult times that are inevitable in any relationship. In what I consider a good relationship you should be able to tell him what works and doesn't work for you. He should listen and decide what is best.

I think you've seen plenty of different points of view here but the only ones that count are the ones you two have. I hope you can talk with him and be heard on this, because you deserve to be heard. After he's listened and decided then you both have choices to make. You're his because you want to be and you're his because he wants you to be. It has to work both ways.

Good luck to both of you...

*nods* very well said, and great sound advice!

 

[SubKekiLee]

Okay, this thread has created some hot debate but I'll go right back to the beginning...

In this case it doesn't matter what I think about the silent treatment -- nikki has already shared that.

To me, the key is what works and doesn't work for the two of you. I would hope that you have the kind of relationship where he wants to know what is best for you. If silence is totally painful then it has to be an extreme punishment. Is eight hours too long -- I don't know. How often do you usually communicate? The important thing is that you two figure out how to handle the difficult times that are inevitable in any relationship. In what I consider a good relationship you should be able to tell him what works and doesn't work for you. He should listen and decide what is best.

I think you've seen plenty of different points of view here but the only ones that count are the ones you two have. I hope you can talk with him and be heard on this, because you deserve to be heard. After he's listened and decided then you both have choices to make. You're his because you want to be and you're his because he wants you to be. It has to work both ways.

Good luck to both of you...

THANK YOU LC.... THANK YOU from the bottom of my heart I think your words are wonderfully written and thanks Everything will work out cause I know now what I did was WRONG.. and now I am doing my punishments and I accepted responsiblity and acted accordingly.... I am his cause he chose me to be his Kajira... and He is mine cause I trust him EXPLICTLY...

Wonderful advice and thanks again

 

[Lamont Cranston]

THANK YOU LC.... THANK YOU from the bottom of my heart I think your words are wonderfully written and thanks Everything will work out cause I know now what I did was WRONG.. and now I am doing my punishments and I accepted responsiblity and acted accordingly.... I am his cause he chose me to be his Kajira... and He is mine cause I trust him EXPLICTLY...

Wonderful advice and thanks again

Seriously, best of luck. It seems to be working out and I'm happy for both of you. And the thread has been very interesting -- plenty of lessons have come out of it. We can all learn from what's been shared.
LC

 

[Life_Noir]

Maybe its just me but hasn't it gotten a bit rough on Lit? People seem to be getting more critical, judgemental and opinionated over others in ways that may be hurtful.

*sigh*

No...it hasn't gotten a bit rough.... Not really... Trust me, it has been MUCH worse.

But I've gotten a bit tired over the years...Which means I don't have my usual {believe it or not} patience...

I'm tired enough to where I should never have made my first post to this thread...
And tired enough that I think I'm going to take a serious break from this board for a while..

But.....For the moment..

No, it hasn't really gotten rougher...Don't believe me? Go back and look up Lance Castor...
What it has done, is gotten progressively more Oprah Winfrey...

Yah know...My ex used to say to me "You aren't listening to me.", and I was forced, repeatedly, to reply "Yes I am, I just don't agree with you. Hearing doesn't mean ageeing.". It was a symptom of her severe BiPolar syndrome.
In a lot of ways I feel like reading here, and posting here, have become a repeat of that conversation.

It has gotten to the point where anytime you don't agree with whatever someone may post, you are "attacking them".

It has gotten to the point where experienced people,{with a few exceptions} will not give advice, because they are castigated as "cruel and judgemental".
As a matter of contention...Almost anything that doesn't constitute a solid round of head patting and ear blowing is pounced on multiply..

I have seen people told ,over and over, in assorted phrasing, that they are not "real". Be it "real Dom/me" or "real sub"..
And the thing that bugs me about that one, is that they, often people with years of real life experience... Are often being told this by people who's only BDSM experience is wanking off in front of a monitor, or a webcam, or on the damned phone.

Anyone who tells the truth these days is most likely to be called hateful, or oh fuck...page back and insert whatever...

I'm sorry...Maybe I'm too old to be on here anymore... I've certainly become a bit too cynical I think.

So here is what is probably my parting shot in this little philisophical soiree....
*sigh*
I have years of real life{*sigh* too many I think}, real time, in the flesh, experience...In which I have been careful, and dedicated, and spent time and money and effort to learn.
I have NEVER hurt anyone in the progress of a scene. Or rather I should say "harmed". Since I have well and truly hurt quite a few... I have handled at least three unexpected total meltdowns. I have even had at least one offer to do what I do on a professional basis. *lol* I was into SSC before I knew SSC existed... Though I cheerfully used the phrase "If you break your toys, you can't play with them anymore.".
Oh...And I have spent entirely too much time on this board...Years, under two different names.

So, you will excuse me when I feel some justification in saying the following.

No...When you go on a public board and ask for advice ... you don't have a right to piss at people when they give it. Just because it isn't what you wanted to hear.

Yes...You ARE likely to get more than one opinion...Tough shit... Opinions are like assholes...We all have one..And they all stink.

It's a public board...Get that??? It's open...Anyone can answer... They won't all agree with what you want to hear... Don't like that?? Then don't fucking post. Everyone isn't supposed to agree with you..If they did, then it wouldn't very damned useful.

DON'T send me a PM and whine because I answered what you actually posted...Instead of what you meant to...
Or because your post sounded dumber than a rock...And I {and others}responded as it deserved...

Don't try and tell the other people that they aren't "Real" because you don't agree with their kink..
They..Are just as real as you are... Be that real sub, or real Dom/me. We ALL DO IT DIFFERENT. ALL OF US..

But one thing... Don't fewking try and tell me that sitting in front of your monitor, or on your phone... Is the same as being "in the flesh"...Cause it isn't.
I've tried doing both phone and online... and yah know what...There are {with one exception which will remain nameless} professionals that get paid to do a LOT better job of giving me something to wank to.
Which is not saying that those folks aren't "real"...But they are "real" phone and cyber people. It aint the damned same.

Oh, and while I'm on a roll... Can some of ya'all not GET A FUCKING LIFE...
Jeeze..
Yah know...I...Am NEVER sure that I have anything useful to say...On any subject... Just because some folks have not a damned thing to do all damned day but hang out online...Does NOT improve the odds of their having any damned thing useful to say either..

Oh... And FUCK THE DAMNED COOKIES.... ALL THE DAMNED COOKIES... I HOPE THE COOKIE PEOPLE GET ASSRAPED BY KEEBLER ELVES...ALL OF THEM {all the elves that is...wouldn't want to not be absolutely clear}
ANything to do with cookies...is NOT SOMETHING USEFUL TO SAY.

On that note... YES...Some things are just downright stupid...Sorry...But it's true.. Listening to some chatroom wanker go on about physicly damaging and potentially lethal stuff. Is one of em... And yeah..people SHOULD point this out..ANd probably laugh.

Don't fucking whine... If you want to be a sub or whatever the hell you want to call yourself/be called.... Either live with what the Dom/me demands... Or fucking say NO...It's your right..It's how it works.. It's how it's always fucking worked...
Don't come on this board..Or any other...And piss and whine so you can have the cellophane sub mafia come pat your back and tell you how you are poor and misunderstood..And he is obviously abusive and evil incarnate..
Wanna know why?
Cause it makes you look like an IDIOT...
It's also what every 'net addicted, bored, {usually medicated}bipolar, fake sub in the world does..
Repeatedly.

Dom/me OR sub...It isn't right, just because it's what you want...

Awwww fuck it....

There is too much more..I don't have space, or time, or inclination...
To say EVERYTHING that a lot of others would like to say, but they don't want the flack. They don't want to take a rasher of shite from the mutual support and admiration society.

So, I end this and part with this gentler set of thoughts...

To those few really serious new people..I apologize...
I will ask this of you on behalf of all the people that have been here forever.

Think hard about what "Dominant" and "submissive" MEAN {and please remember to spell them correctly }.. Then go ahead and ask whatever you need to know..
But..
Please... Take a look at the library first..It will answer a LOT of your questions.
There are people of honest good faith and lots of experience here... They are a priceless commodity. I wish I had had access to them when I was starting all those years ago.
But..*grin* Don't be lazy... Look and see if it hasn't been covered in an existing thread first...I'll bet yah it probably has.
Good luck and the Gods speed..

I'd like to thank some of those wonderful, rational, experienced, truthful, people...The ones that aren't a part of the "back pat posse".. It's been fun talking to/and sharing experience with you.

Now. People {and I use the term loosely} can gleefully have their little online duckfits. Can call me nasty names because I said a lot of things that a lot of other people have wanted to. Honestly, I really can't bring myself to give a damn. Welcome to part and parcel of an old school Dom attitude. Your opinion means shit to me.
Now.
I'm gonna go take a damned shower.. And I'm not going to think about any of this for quite a while... And If I ever do wander back on here, to catch up with some I consider friends...I am going to make major use of the damned ignore button...Which is probably what I should have done to start with..But the simple fact is, lately, it would have eliminated most of the board.
Which having seen it before, even at it's worst...Sort of makes me a touch sad.

 

[BiBunny]

*Sigh* I think I love you.

 

[Homburg]

This is going to sound awful, but I gotta say that "duckfit" is just an awesome word. The post was great, but damned if that word didn't make me smile.

 

[Netzach]

snipping for total agreement.

OMG, please stay. Or at least come visit.

 

[@}-}rebecca----]

*sigh*

No...it hasn't gotten a bit rough.... Not really... Trust me, it has been MUCH worse.

But I've gotten a bit tired over the years...Which means I don't have my usual {believe it or not} patience...

I'm tired enough to where I should never have made my first post to this thread...
And tired enough that I think I'm going to take a serious break from this board for a while..

But.....For the moment..

No, it hasn't really gotten rougher...Don't believe me? Go back and look up Lance Castor...
What it has done, is gotten progressively more Oprah Winfrey...

Yah know...My ex used to say to me "You aren't listening to me.", and I was forced, repeatedly, to reply "Yes I am, I just don't agree with you. Hearing doesn't mean ageeing.". It was a symptom of her severe BiPolar syndrome.
In a lot of ways I feel like reading here, and posting here, have become a repeat of that conversation.

It has gotten to the point where anytime you don't agree with whatever someone may post, you are "attacking them".

It has gotten to the point where experienced people,{with a few exceptions} will not give advice, because they are castigated as "cruel and judgemental".
As a matter of contention...Almost anything that doesn't constitute a solid round of head patting and ear blowing is pounced on multiply..

I have seen people told ,over and over, in assorted phrasing, that they are not "real". Be it "real Dom/me" or "real sub"..
And the thing that bugs me about that one, is that they, often people with years of real life experience... Are often being told this by people who's only BDSM experience is wanking off in front of a monitor, or a webcam, or on the damned phone.

Anyone who tells the truth these days is most likely to be called hateful, or oh fuck...page back and insert whatever...

I'm sorry...Maybe I'm too old to be on here anymore... I've certainly become a bit too cynical I think.

So here is what is probably my parting shot in this little philisophical soiree....
*sigh*
I have years of real life{*sigh* too many I think}, real time, in the flesh, experience...In which I have been careful, and dedicated, and spent time and money and effort to learn.
I have NEVER hurt anyone in the progress of a scene. Or rather I should say "harmed". Since I have well and truly hurt quite a few... I have handled at least three unexpected total meltdowns. I have even had at least one offer to do what I do on a professional basis. *lol* I was into SSC before I knew SSC existed... Though I cheerfully used the phrase "If you break your toys, you can't play with them anymore.".
Oh...And I have spent entirely too much time on this board...Years, under two different names.

So, you will excuse me when I feel some justification in saying the following.

No...When you go on a public board and ask for advice ... you don't have a right to piss at people when they give it. Just because it isn't what you wanted to hear.

Yes...You ARE likely to get more than one opinion...Tough shit... Opinions are like assholes...We all have one..And they all stink.

It's a public board...Get that??? It's open...Anyone can answer... They won't all agree with what you want to hear... Don't like that?? Then don't fucking post. Everyone isn't supposed to agree with you..If they did, then it wouldn't very damned useful.

DON'T send me a PM and whine because I answered what you actually posted...Instead of what you meant to...
Or because your post sounded dumber than a rock...And I {and others}responded as it deserved...

Don't try and tell the other people that they aren't "Real" because you don't agree with their kink..
They..Are just as real as you are... Be that real sub, or real Dom/me. We ALL DO IT DIFFERENT. ALL OF US..

But one thing... Don't fewking try and tell me that sitting in front of your monitor, or on your phone... Is the same as being "in the flesh"...Cause it isn't.
I've tried doing both phone and online... and yah know what...There are {with one exception which will remain nameless} professionals that get paid to do a LOT better job of giving me something to wank to.
Which is not saying that those folks aren't "real"...But they are "real" phone and cyber people. It aint the damned same.

Oh, and while I'm on a roll... Can some of ya'all not GET A FUCKING LIFE...
Jeeze..
Yah know...I...Am NEVER sure that I have anything useful to say...On any subject... Just because some folks have not a damned thing to do all damned day but hang out online...Does NOT improve the odds of their having any damned thing useful to say either..

Oh... And FUCK THE DAMNED COOKIES.... ALL THE DAMNED COOKIES... I HOPE THE COOKIE PEOPLE GET ASSRAPED BY KEEBLER ELVES...ALL OF THEM {all the elves that is...wouldn't want to not be absolutely clear}
ANything to do with cookies...is NOT SOMETHING USEFUL TO SAY.

On that note... YES...Some things are just downright stupid...Sorry...But it's true.. Listening to some chatroom wanker go on about physicly damaging and potentially lethal stuff. Is one of em... And yeah..people SHOULD point this out..ANd probably laugh.

Don't fucking whine... If you want to be a sub or whatever the hell you want to call yourself/be called.... Either live with what the Dom/me demands... Or fucking say NO...It's your right..It's how it works.. It's how it's always fucking worked...
Don't come on this board..Or any other...And piss and whine so you can have the cellophane sub mafia come pat your back and tell you how you are poor and misunderstood..And he is obviously abusive and evil incarnate..
Wanna know why?
Cause it makes you look like an IDIOT...
It's also what every 'net addicted, bored, {usually medicated}bipolar, fake sub in the world does..
Repeatedly.

Dom/me OR sub...It isn't right, just because it's what you want...

Awwww fuck it....

There is too much more..I don't have space, or time, or inclination...
To say EVERYTHING that a lot of others would like to say, but they don't want the flack. They don't want to take a rasher of shite from the mutual support and admiration society.

So, I end this and part with this gentler set of thoughts...

To those few really serious new people..I apologize...
I will ask this of you on behalf of all the people that have been here forever.

Think hard about what "Dominant" and "submissive" MEAN {and please remember to spell them correctly }.. Then go ahead and ask whatever you need to know..
But..
Please... Take a look at the library first..It will answer a LOT of your questions.
There are people of honest good faith and lots of experience here... They are a priceless commodity. I wish I had had access to them when I was starting all those years ago.
But..*grin* Don't be lazy... Look and see if it hasn't been covered in an existing thread first...I'll bet yah it probably has.
Good luck and the Gods speed..

I'd like to thank some of those wonderful, rational, experienced, truthful, people...The ones that aren't a part of the "back pat posse".. It's been fun talking to/and sharing experience with you.

Now. People {and I use the term loosely} can gleefully have their little online duckfits. Can call me nasty names because I said a lot of things that a lot of other people have wanted to. Honestly, I really can't bring myself to give a damn. Welcome to part and parcel of an old school Dom attitude. Your opinion means shit to me.
Now.
I'm gonna go take a damned shower.. And I'm not going to think about any of this for quite a while... And If I ever do wander back on here, to catch up with some I consider friends...I am going to make major use of the damned ignore button...Which is probably what I should have done to start with..But the simple fact is, lately, it would have eliminated most of the board.
Which having seen it before, even at it's worst...Sort of makes me a touch sad.

Quoting entirely to tap into the premise of gonadal fortitude from afar

It's as close as I get Mr Noir : chuckles :

 

[lil_slave_rose]

it really has nothing to do with people not agreeing it has alot to do with HOW things are said to people on this board when they ask for advice, especially if they are 'newish'. i'm pretty sure the OP knew when posting the thread that she wasn't going to hear everything she wanted to, i'm sure she was fully aware that there would be people who did not share her opinions, but i do think that those "opinions" could be stated in a nicer way. do we really have to "talk down" to people and be hateful to get our thoughts across???

and Life_Noir, just because i came to this lifestyle via the internet, it does not make my relationship any less valid. OBVIOUSLY online/phone/etc..is not the same as in the flesh. i have "real life" experience. so you've been on this message board more years than me, big deal....that doesn't make you any better than anyone else nor does it entitle you to anymore privileges than someone who's only been here a day. i don't know, sounds to me like your post was nothing more than a superiority moment you were having and decided you should put it out here to get YOUR pats on the back.

the very same person who was saying that she doesn't understand why a couple of days of not talking to your significant other would devastate you is the same person who has a Dear X letter in the cafe to her significant other complaining about the exact same thing......i'm not trying to pull out things and use against others but how can you sit there and have this attitude with someone when in another thread you are complaining about the same thing that the person you are ridiculing is complaining about?? seems to me, that's a bit hypocritical, actually it's ALOT hypocritical.

i don't care that people don't agree with all of my opinions, as a matter of fact most of my opinions are not very popular, but i still expect to be treated like a human being and not be talked down to just because we don't agree, or just because someone has been on this message board or in the lifestyle longer than me. i don't give a rats ass to be honest. and i realize this board has freedom of speech but do we really need to use that to ridicule others? the OP posted this thread asking for advice, that's all that needed to be given (yes even if it didn't agree with her opinions) but it didn't need to be given in a way to make her feel "less then" or "stupid" for posting the thread in the first place.

yes there is aLOT in the library but if the same threads weren't started more than once, this board would run out of topics really quick and the same thread may bring up totally different issues than a thread that was started 4 years ago on the same subject. blah, i'm done with all of this..have a great day!

 

[incubus'_sub]

Bravo Life Noir. Fan bloody tastic post. Where's that clapping icon thingy when I need it.

 

[incubus_dark]

Life_Noir, bravo sir; I don't think I know you, though I wish that I did, if for no other reason than that beautifully cogent rant.

 

[LordHawk]

Cutting my little one off from contact is the worst punishment I can give her and is reserved for something really bad. We started online and I have since moved to her and we've gotten married. I've only punished her this way one time. She craves contact, whether it be talking when we were online or curling up together on the couch now that we are together for real.
When we were still just online, she had done something that greatly displeased me so I cut her off. It was the online version of sending her to another room in the house while I sat in the living room. I remained logged onto the messenger, she could see that I was there but was not allowed to talk to me until I addressed her. It was only five minutes but that was enough.
Was it effective? Damn right it was. But she also knew that she was being punished. I didn't just stop talking to her. Were she to majorly fuck up now, I wouldn't just get in the car and disappear for a day. If the Dom needs space to clear his head, let the anger go so he can safely punish his sub then that needs to be stated. Is it effective for everyone? I doubt it. Everyone is different. To me, part of this life is two people on a journey discovering who and what they are together.

 

[catalina_francisco]

*sigh*

No...it hasn't gotten a bit rough.... Not really... Trust me, it has been MUCH worse.

But I've gotten a bit tired over the years...Which means I don't have my usual {believe it or not} patience...

I'm tired enough to where I should never have made my first post to this thread...
And tired enough that I think I'm going to take a serious break from this board for a while..

But.....For the moment..

No, it hasn't really gotten rougher...Don't believe me? Go back and look up Lance Castor...
What it has done, is gotten progressively more Oprah Winfrey...

Yah know...My ex used to say to me "You aren't listening to me.", and I was forced, repeatedly, to reply "Yes I am, I just don't agree with you. Hearing doesn't mean ageeing.". It was a symptom of her severe BiPolar syndrome.
In a lot of ways I feel like reading here, and posting here, have become a repeat of that conversation.

It has gotten to the point where anytime you don't agree with whatever someone may post, you are "attacking them".

It has gotten to the point where experienced people,{with a few exceptions} will not give advice, because they are castigated as "cruel and judgemental".
As a matter of contention...Almost anything that doesn't constitute a solid round of head patting and ear blowing is pounced on multiply..

I have seen people told ,over and over, in assorted phrasing, that they are not "real". Be it "real Dom/me" or "real sub"..
And the thing that bugs me about that one, is that they, often people with years of real life experience... Are often being told this by people who's only BDSM experience is wanking off in front of a monitor, or a webcam, or on the damned phone.

Anyone who tells the truth these days is most likely to be called hateful, or oh fuck...page back and insert whatever...

I'm sorry...Maybe I'm too old to be on here anymore... I've certainly become a bit too cynical I think.

So here is what is probably my parting shot in this little philisophical soiree....
*sigh*
I have years of real life{*sigh* too many I think}, real time, in the flesh, experience...In which I have been careful, and dedicated, and spent time and money and effort to learn.
I have NEVER hurt anyone in the progress of a scene. Or rather I should say "harmed". Since I have well and truly hurt quite a few... I have handled at least three unexpected total meltdowns. I have even had at least one offer to do what I do on a professional basis. *lol* I was into SSC before I knew SSC existed... Though I cheerfully used the phrase "If you break your toys, you can't play with them anymore.".
Oh...And I have spent entirely too much time on this board...Years, under two different names.

So, you will excuse me when I feel some justification in saying the following.

No...When you go on a public board and ask for advice ... you don't have a right to piss at people when they give it. Just because it isn't what you wanted to hear.

Yes...You ARE likely to get more than one opinion...Tough shit... Opinions are like assholes...We all have one..And they all stink.

It's a public board...Get that??? It's open...Anyone can answer... They won't all agree with what you want to hear... Don't like that?? Then don't fucking post. Everyone isn't supposed to agree with you..If they did, then it wouldn't very damned useful.

DON'T send me a PM and whine because I answered what you actually posted...Instead of what you meant to...
Or because your post sounded dumber than a rock...And I {and others}responded as it deserved...

Don't try and tell the other people that they aren't "Real" because you don't agree with their kink..
They..Are just as real as you are... Be that real sub, or real Dom/me. We ALL DO IT DIFFERENT. ALL OF US..

But one thing... Don't fewking try and tell me that sitting in front of your monitor, or on your phone... Is the same as being "in the flesh"...Cause it isn't.
I've tried doing both phone and online... and yah know what...There are {with one exception which will remain nameless} professionals that get paid to do a LOT better job of giving me something to wank to.
Which is not saying that those folks aren't "real"...But they are "real" phone and cyber people. It aint the damned same.

Oh, and while I'm on a roll... Can some of ya'all not GET A FUCKING LIFE...
Jeeze..
Yah know...I...Am NEVER sure that I have anything useful to say...On any subject... Just because some folks have not a damned thing to do all damned day but hang out online...Does NOT improve the odds of their having any damned thing useful to say either..

Oh... And FUCK THE DAMNED COOKIES.... ALL THE DAMNED COOKIES... I HOPE THE COOKIE PEOPLE GET ASSRAPED BY KEEBLER ELVES...ALL OF THEM {all the elves that is...wouldn't want to not be absolutely clear}
ANything to do with cookies...is NOT SOMETHING USEFUL TO SAY.

On that note... YES...Some things are just downright stupid...Sorry...But it's true.. Listening to some chatroom wanker go on about physicly damaging and potentially lethal stuff. Is one of em... And yeah..people SHOULD point this out..ANd probably laugh.

Don't fucking whine... If you want to be a sub or whatever the hell you want to call yourself/be called.... Either live with what the Dom/me demands... Or fucking say NO...It's your right..It's how it works.. It's how it's always fucking worked...
Don't come on this board..Or any other...And piss and whine so you can have the cellophane sub mafia come pat your back and tell you how you are poor and misunderstood..And he is obviously abusive and evil incarnate..
Wanna know why?
Cause it makes you look like an IDIOT...
It's also what every 'net addicted, bored, {usually medicated}bipolar, fake sub in the world does..
Repeatedly.

Dom/me OR sub...It isn't right, just because it's what you want...

Awwww fuck it....

There is too much more..I don't have space, or time, or inclination...
To say EVERYTHING that a lot of others would like to say, but they don't want the flack. They don't want to take a rasher of shite from the mutual support and admiration society.

So, I end this and part with this gentler set of thoughts...

To those few really serious new people..I apologize...
I will ask this of you on behalf of all the people that have been here forever.

Think hard about what "Dominant" and "submissive" MEAN {and please remember to spell them correctly }.. Then go ahead and ask whatever you need to know..
But..
Please... Take a look at the library first..It will answer a LOT of your questions.
There are people of honest good faith and lots of experience here... They are a priceless commodity. I wish I had had access to them when I was starting all those years ago.
But..*grin* Don't be lazy... Look and see if it hasn't been covered in an existing thread first...I'll bet yah it probably has.
Good luck and the Gods speed..

I'd like to thank some of those wonderful, rational, experienced, truthful, people...The ones that aren't a part of the "back pat posse".. It's been fun talking to/and sharing experience with you.

Now. People {and I use the term loosely} can gleefully have their little online duckfits. Can call me nasty names because I said a lot of things that a lot of other people have wanted to. Honestly, I really can't bring myself to give a damn. Welcome to part and parcel of an old school Dom attitude. Your opinion means shit to me.
Now.
I'm gonna go take a damned shower.. And I'm not going to think about any of this for quite a while... And If I ever do wander back on here, to catch up with some I consider friends...I am going to make major use of the damned ignore button...Which is probably what I should have done to start with..But the simple fact is, lately, it would have eliminated most of the board.
Which having seen it before, even at it's worst...Sort of makes me a touch sad.

Excellent words...just hope people read it and begin to see the light instead of feeling everyone must agree with everyone. It never works trying to be all things to all people, nor trying to be everyone's best friend. Sometimes the best friendships are those where the truth is told in the interests of preventing someone being harmed as opposed to stroking their ego and watching them fall flat on their face.

Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

My emotionally abusive ex husband used to do this - he would sometimes not speak to me for days. However all it did over many years was make me feel resentful and angry, made my self esteem hit rock bottom, and I ended up miserable and depressed.

Communication is one of the cornerstones of any relationship, let alone BDSM ones. Cutting that off undermines a sub's confidence and plants doubts and exacerbates any self esteem issues. Especially in online relationships, where the written and spoken word is all there is.

IMO it's an immature way of dealing with issues. people need to talk about problems not shut them away.

Great post Bandit and I have to say I would react in much the same way as you say...resentment, anger, depression, and in the end emotionally distancing myself from that person. And no, emotionally distancing myself would not be my trying to manipulate their behaviour, it would be my own unconscious self preservation mechanism kicking in, borne of years of life experience which have taught me how best to protect myself and my spirit.

I am wary of people who get so angry they need hours/days of 'cooling off' time...it usually is a bad sign in terms of their ability to control their reactions, and a sign they do not tend to deal with them or their emotions. F and I are both highly emotional beings and he more so than me can get angry in a second if the wrong button is pushed (very rare occurance), but despite this, after a few moments cooling off (usually 5-10 minutes tops), he is able to control his emotions and sit down and discuss the issue calmly and openly. Not communicating IMHO is not constructive, nor does it seem to convey a message I would find positive, or as some like to think their PYL should be, nurturing.

All that being said, I recognise my way might not be everybody's, and that my opinion and reaction is based on my experiences, but really that is all we have at the end of the day...it helps to recognise those points so you can better differentiate who and what you need in a partner/relationship.

Catalina

 

[RJMasters]

Geez I wish at times like this we had a current Dom/me Calendar happening. Excellent post.

Catalina

Thanks Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

Thanks Catalina

You're welcome

Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

I know that as a Dom, and most of the Dom/mes I know, {Again, a personal opinion, and/or anecdotal} would probably not look terribly kindly, or with great acceptance on having this broadcast publicly..
Then again, perhaps he doesn't read here?
*sigh* If he does, then the above may be damaging to her relationship beyond whatever was already going on.

This is something I also agree with and something which I notice often that others do not tap into or understand. I guess it depends on the PYL, but like you, the ones I have known draw the line at what they will and will not welcome being publicly discussed. For those who might not yet have had the misfortune to learn that lesson personally, and maybe not understand why, the reasons can vary as to why this is an expectation of the PLY. One reason is about bringing shame or discredit upon your PYL through public disclosure of intimate parts of your relationship...people will judge (it is natural despite what people say here before they voice their own judgements), people will only have your version to go by, people will read between the lines even if there is nothing to read between the lines, and overall it can embarrass, humiliate, shame, anger, or disappoint the PYL.

Another common reason, especially with experienced PYL's is because they know what they want and expect from their pyl, and it is not something they appreciate being aired for a public vote on whether they are right or wrong to expect such things. It is between the people in the relationship, not a bunch of anonymous online people who have no part of the relationship. It is to the PYL the pyl turns for guidance and instruction, not outsiders...asking publicly if something is OK is often seen as doubting the PYL, not trusting them, and strange as it may seem to some, not submitting to them. And yes, someone is bound to say, 'what if the pyl is being abused, or doesn't know what is acceptable etc.?' I would hope a pyl would be sensible enough to know when it is necessary to look for outside help, and when it is an issue of what D/s is all about as opposed to attempting to manipulate or sway things to go the way they want or think they should. If it doesn't fit, review if it is the right PYL for you and act accordingly.

Catalina

 

[lil_slave_rose]

This is something I also agree with and something which I notice often that others do not tap into or understand. I guess it depends on the PYL, but like you, the ones I have known draw the line at what they will and will not welcome being publicly discussed. For those who might not yet have had the misfortune to learn that lesson personally, and maybe not understand why, the reasons can vary as to why this is an expectation of the PLY. One reason is about bringing shame or discredit upon your PYL through public disclosure of intimate parts of your relationship...people will judge (it is natural despite what people say here before they voice their own judgements), people will only have your version to go by, people will read between the lines even if there is nothing to read between the lines, and overall it can embarrass, humiliate, shame, anger, or disappoint the PYL.

Another common reason, especially with experienced PYL's is because they know what they want and expect from their pyl, and it is not something they appreciate being aired for a public vote on whether they are right or wrong to expect such things. It is between the people in the relationship, not a bunch of anonymous online people who have no part of the relationship. It is to the PYL the pyl turns for guidance and instruction, not outsiders...asking publicly if something is OK is often seen as doubting the PYL, not trusting them, and strange as it may seem to some, not submitting to them. And yes, someone is bound to say, 'what if the pyl is being abused, or doesn't know what is acceptable etc.?' I would hope a pyl would be sensible enough to know when it is necessary to look for outside help, and when it is an issue of what D/s is all about as opposed to attempting to manipulate or sway things to go the way they want or think they should. If it doesn't fit, review if it is the right PYL for you and act accordingly.

Catalina

i don't think it's fair to assume that the pyl doesn't' know their PYL well enough to know what would be accepted and what wouldn't be accepted to ask on a message board. *shrugs* JMHO........

 

[catalina_francisco]

i don't think it's fair to assume that the pyl doesn't' know their PYL well enough to know what would be accepted and what wouldn't be accepted to ask on a message board. *shrugs* JMHO........

'sigh' (I hate that, but seems to be the done thing online)...I was not assuming anything, I was agreeing with what had been said already about how PYL's may feel about it based on my own personal experience with many of them, none of whom would tolerate it and some of whom it would signal the need to end a relationship. It is not a judgement, but is a reality of many experienced RL PYL's and as I feel for people, I think sharing knowledge can sometimes prevent someone making mistakes they cannot wind the clock back on...simple as that. From memory, you and MP once had an issue with this here, as have a couple of other people on the forum.

Isn't it better to share knowledge with those who may not have had cause to think of this before now than sit back and let them stumble into trouble without warning?...it is easy enough to discuss it with your PYL before making such a blunder and finding out where their boundaries lay on such issues. After all, most come here to share and learn more, not to have information withheld until after it is too late.....that is just vicious IMO. After living under the same roof 24/7 for 5+ years, I know where F stands on this and it was one of the things he found offensive to PYL's here when he used to frequent the board...and one he wouldn't tolerate, hence we discuss whatever issues arise between us no matter how painful. And yes, that is just our way of doing it and based on our personalities, but we are not alone in feeling this way.

It actually doesn't take much to understand why it would draw such negative reactions from PYL's given the premise for most is that the pyl look up to their PYL, that PYL's do often have delicate but huge ego's, and that they deserve loyalty and to know what is bothering their pyl in the relationship before the whole world in invited in to referree first. I don't even see it so much as an exclusive D/s issue, but also something you would honour out of respect to your partner even in a mainstream relationship. Perhaps the acceptance of it and disbelief it can be seen as bad practice is because we have become so desensitised by TV programmes such as Jerry Springer, Dr. Phil, Ricki Lake, and Sally Jessy Raphael where it is considered entertainment to publicly air your dirty linen and out your partner's personal issues and relationship issues for all the world to see. I often cringe when I see what some people are willing to publicly discuss on such shows (not to mention their behaviour), and I am not one to be easily shocked...I just find it demoralising to all involved. So no, I don't think it hurts to check first what is considered discretionary with your PYL/partner.

Catalina

 

[ecstaticsub]

Sometimes early in a relationship it is difficult to talk to your PYL about things that they do (like giving the silent treatment) that upset you. I remember on my than one occasion within the first 6 months of being collared something would come up that I would have a hard time accepting or obeying and I would feel the need to talkit out with someone. But talking to my Dom was something I hadn't yet gotten comfortable with. I didn't want him to be disappointed with me, I didn't want him to know I was having dificulty with it, also I thought it would be disrespectful to bring up something I disagreed with. So I would talk to others, not on a discussion board but through PM/IM . I would then send him a copy of the discussion. He never really told me if this upset him or not but it was my way at the time of bringing issues up.

Now after 2.5 years I no longer have that need. If there is a issue I now know how to bring it up for discussion without feeling intimidated or disrespectful. I think this is something that comes with time.

At least that has been my experience so far..

 

[SubKekiLee]

'sigh' (I hate that, but seems to be the done thing online)...I was not assuming anything, I was agreeing with what had been said already about how PYL's may feel about it based on my own personal experience with many of them, none of whom would tolerate it and some of whom it would signal the need to end a relationship. It is not a judgement, but is a reality of many experienced RL PYL's and as I feel for people, I think sharing knowledge can sometimes prevent someone making mistakes they cannot wind the clock back on...simple as that. From memory, you and MP once had an issue with this here, as have a couple of other people on the forum.

Isn't it better to share knowledge with those who may not have had cause to think of this before now than sit back and let them stumble into trouble without warning?...it is easy enough to discuss it with your PYL before making such a blunder and finding out where their boundaries lay on such issues. After all, most come here to share and learn more, not to have information withheld until after it is too late.....that is just vicious IMO. After living under the same roof 24/7 for 5+ years, I know where F stands on this and it was one of the things he found offensive to PYL's here when he used to frequent the board...and one he wouldn't tolerate, hence we discuss whatever issues arise between us no matter how painful. And yes, that is just our way of doing it and based on our personalities, but we are not alone in feeling this way.

It actually doesn't take much to understand why it would draw such negative reactions from PYL's given the premise for most is that the pyl look up to their PYL, that PYL's do often have delicate but huge ego's, and that they deserve loyalty and to know what is bothering their pyl in the relationship before the whole world in invited in to referree first. I don't even see it so much as an exclusive D/s issue, but also something you would honour out of respect to your partner even in a mainstream relationship. Perhaps the acceptance of it and disbelief it can be seen as bad practice is because we have become so desensitised by TV programmes such as Jerry Springer, Dr. Phil, Ricki Lake, and Sally Jessy Raphael where it is considered entertainment to publicly air your dirty linen and out your partner's personal issues and relationship issues for all the world to see. I often cringe when I see what some people are willing to publicly discuss on such shows (not to mention their behaviour), and I am not one to be easily shocked...I just find it demoralising to all involved. So no, I don't think it hurts to check first what is considered discretionary with your PYL/partner.

Catalina

Thank you for your points of view Catalina... I have previously checked with my PYL and he says if I dont understand something I can be free to ask, if you notice in all my postings I DID NOT give the total reasons why I was in trouble/silent treatment and nor did I tell you what the final outcome except that I have spoken to him and everything will work out. I asked for the assitance of knowing since I didnt know the anwser if it was a common thing. I did not insult MY PYL or ANYONE elses for that matter as to not agreeing with everyones opinion I did not bash anyone for not agreeing with me I took some of the info and understood and will use it for my benefit I also took some and shared it with my PYL and told him I dont like that approach. I dont like that I got ridculed or chastized for having my opinion and sharing it.. but hey thats life Freedom of speech... But please understand I am not in a "just" online relationship I live about 40 mins away from my PYL and he is my friend, lover and PYL. It is important to me for me to understand the purpose of some of the things he has done to me durring our relationship. I have previously privately asked for opinions and I got opinions that didnt neccissarly agree with but I didnt chastize them for giving it to me. I felt as if this whole thing got blown out of porportion when all I asked originally is do you believe in it... But thanks for your opinion ..