So when did you first figure out that you were heterosexual?

[knot_sweet]

I think that your sexuality is something you were born with, like eye or hair colour.

And like hair or eye colour, you can choose something different if you want to.

I grew up in a very liberal household. My mum is an odd mix of extremely narrow forceful opinions sheathed in preachy pro gay anti racist yay for equality but men are all bastards except your dad type of person, and they've been happily married for 35 years much to he bemusement.

Dad is the most relaxed person I've ever met. He truly doesn't notice or care anything about a person except whether they are polite and nice or not.

I've been sexually aware since quite young. And it was always men I was interested in. Boys my own age never did it for me, my earliest fantasies were of my male teachers. So I wasn't sexually active until I was much older and because I was a tomboy in both manner and dress, most people assumed I was a lesbian.

Because I never had any sexual interest in boys, I found it easy to be around them and be friends with them. As a consequence, women have always seemed strange, exotic and beautiful to me.

This led to me thinking maybe I was a lesbian, or at least bi.

Nope. Not at all. My interest is purely superficial. I like to look, but not in a sexual manner. Porn needs to have cock in it, in fact I enjoy watching two men together because it's just twice as many yummy bits to look at, and the smell of all that testosterone just flat does it for me.

My own experience aside, I do know one or two women who choose to be lesbians due to very traumatising experiences with men.

So I figure nature vs nurture is pretty much equal in the whole equation.

 

[Sir_Winston54]

... My own experience aside, I do know one or two women who choose to be lesbians due to very traumatising experiences with men.

So I figure nature vs nurture is pretty much equal in the whole equation.

I'm not *ignoring* the rest of your post, simply accepting it for what it is.

The statement about "women who choose to be lesbians due to very traumatising experiences with men," however, makes me wonder. Have they actually

• chosen to be lesbians, or
• chosen to engage only in lesbian sex

"due to very traumatizing experiences with men?"

 

[Shankara20]

• chosen to be lesbians, or
• chosen to engage only in lesbian sex

hmmmm, interesting difference. It leads me into considering the idea that most of us are bisexual and only choose where to focus our sexual energy.

just considering for the moment as I get up to fetch more coffee....

 

[AreYouMirin]

I would say when I was 12. Had a crush on my friends 14 year old sister. Ended up dating her a few years later.

That being said, the same year, a friend of mine admitted he thought he was gay and forwardly asked if I wanted to fool around and I said sure. I don't find men sexually attractive, but whatever.

 

[Sir_Winston54]

....My own experience aside, I do know one or two women who choose to be lesbians due to very traumatising experiences with men.

So I figure nature vs nurture is pretty much equal in the whole equation.

I'm not *ignoring* the rest of your post, simply accepting it for what it is.

The statement about "women who choose to be lesbians due to very traumatising experiences with men," however, makes me wonder. Have they actually

• chosen to be lesbians, or
• chosen to engage only in lesbian sex

"due to very traumatizing experiences with men?"

hmmmm, interesting difference. It leads me into considering the idea that most of us are bisexual and only choose where to focus our sexual energy.

just considering for the moment as I get up to fetch more coffee....

Just to clarify, my query was not intended to suggest that sexuality - hetero-, homo-, bi-, a-, or whatever - is in most cases *chosen.* I think I've made it clear in previous discussions that I believe most of the central facets of our sexual preferences are in fact hard-wired into us.

My question in this case suggested that perhaps the women in question wanted/needed sexuality in their lives, but because of the traumatic experiences they'd suffered, found themselves unable to do so in a heterosexual relationship, and thus decided to fulfill, inasmuch as they could, their desire/need for sexual activity through lesbian interaction.

 

[Curious_in_Cali]

Just to clarify, my query was not intended to suggest that sexuality - hetero-, homo-, bi-, a-, or whatever - is in most cases *chosen.* I think I've made it clear in previous discussions that I believe most of the central facets of our sexual preferences are in fact hard-wired into us.

My question in this case suggested that perhaps the women in question wanted/needed sexuality in their lives, but because of the traumatic experiences they'd suffered, found themselves unable to do so in a heterosexual relationship, and thus decided to fulfill, inasmuch as they could, their desire/need for sexual activity through lesbian interaction.

This reminds me of the comments like... I am not gay, but I do have sex with like gendered folks. I guess that is like choosing to have sex without a natural attraction to a person? Maybe it is a more complex version of a sex toy as how can sex without attraction not be objectification of some sort?
If so that can seem irrelevant to sexual orientation I suppose, depending on how you define it... But where do you draw that line?

But then again, maybe it is because I struggle to filter attraction based on gender and more on the person as a whole that this seems a muddled concept for me to understand.

 

[knot_sweet]

I'm not *ignoring* the rest of your post, simply accepting it for what it is.

The statement about "women who choose to be lesbians due to very traumatising experiences with men," however, makes me wonder. Have they actually

• chosen to be lesbians, or
• chosen to engage only in lesbian sex

"due to very traumatizing experiences with men?"

You raise an interesting question, and one which prompted me to ask my friends. I got two different responses.

Friend A simply chooses to indulge her need for sex with women. She likes women but doesn't necessarily feel any of that "oooo yeah" tingle thinking about them.

Friend B started out like friend A, but over time has evolved into actually emtionally attaching and being attracted to women. She admits it's a "learned behaviour" (her words not mine), but sge honestly feels no desire for men anymore. When I asked her if she may have been bi-latent before the incident, she assured me that she had tried sex with a woman once and her reaction was decidedly negative.

Meh...human sexuality; liquorice allsorts...multi layered and two rarely the same.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I'm not *ignoring* the rest of your post, simply accepting it for what it is.

The statement about "women who choose to be lesbians due to very traumatising experiences with men," however, makes me wonder. Have they actually

• chosen to be lesbians, or
• chosen to engage only in lesbian sex

"due to very traumatizing experiences with men?"

I have known enough women who do NOT choose to be lesbians despite their very traumatising experiences, to say that your second choice is nearer the mark.

This includes women who do not choose to trust or have intimate friendships with men ever again-- sexually, women do not satisfy them. And in several cases it's not because they haven't tried. Or been offered the opportunity by more than one women.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

"The most important question that any human being can ever ask is, ‘how do you know that?’."

I heard this last week on the radio. I have no idea if someone famous or smart or famously smart said it, but it smacked me as a great question for just about every conversation that includes a statement for fact...

*bzzzzzzzzzzzzzz*

Who is Edward Tufte on Science Friday?

 

[Shankara20]

I think I've made it clear in previous discussions that I believe most of the central facets of our sexual preferences are in fact hard-wired into us.

I know, but I just used you to get off a little on my own

 

[the captians wench]

This reminds me of the comments like... I am not gay, but I do have sex with like gendered folks. I guess that is like choosing to have sex without a natural attraction to a person? Maybe it is a more complex version of a sex toy as how can sex without attraction not be objectification of some sort?
If so that can seem irrelevant to sexual orientation I suppose, depending on how you define it... But where do you draw that line?

But then again, maybe it is because I struggle to filter attraction based on gender and more on the person as a whole that this seems a muddled concept for me to understand.

I kind of fall into this category.

I've always said I'm not bi. I'm not (generally) attracted to women, but I have been sexual with a few. For most of them, it was because I liked the attention that I received from the man in the room. I wanted to get him off, I wanted his praise and attention, so I did things that didn't really give me any joy.

On the other hand, when they did onto me, I was happy as a clam. It was much as your "sex toy" comparison. They used what ever they could to get me off. And I like getting off. It really didn't mater to me if they were born with a dick or bought one, if I'm being fucked, I'm happy.

I also don't (generally) have any emotional attachment to women. I don't understand them honestly.

Of course, there is an exception to all of this, and well that's just a whole 'nother tail spin and makes me question what makes one "bi" anyway.

 

[Sir_Winston54]

I know, but I just used you to get off a little on my own

Whatever floats your boat, my friend. I may think your taste kinda sucks, but ... that's just me

 

[beebeeto]

Originally Posted by beebeeto
I m starting to realize I might have underestimated the power of social conditioning.

Perhaps if men could be more open about their desires there would be less misogyny?

Homophobia, you mean? Yes, i think so. Guys who really don't care about other men don't necessarily express physical revulsion-- Many of them just express that the concept is meaningless to them.

Social conditioning is the water we swim in, yanno? It pervades our day to day life without us even noticing.

I actually mean misogyny in its simplest definition:hatred of women.

If so many men truly desire homosexual sex,but deny themselves that pleasure because of social conditioning,this might lead them to associate women with the personification of social pressure:

"You may have sex with women,and only women if you do not wish to be ridiculed"

A man's reaction to that could be:"I don't want only women,I'm forced to have women and nothing else,if it weren't for women,I could have what I desire"

An irrational and not fully understood frustration towards women is a result of society denying many men the pleasure of bisexuality???

 

[the captians wench]

I actually mean misogyny in its simplest definition:hatred of women.

If so many men truly desire homosexual sex,but deny themselves that pleasure because of social conditioning,this might lead them to associate women with the personification of social pressure:

"You may have sex with women,and only women if you do not wish to be ridiculed"

A man's reaction to that could be:"I don't want only women,I'm forced to have women and nothing else,if it weren't for women,I could have what I desire"

An irrational and not fully understood frustration towards women is a result of society denying many men the pleasure of bisexuality???

I'm not sure that this line of thinking is fully on track. It is a possibility, no doubt, but most it's fathers that little boys learn their social roles from. They mimic the behavior of older male figures.

We were talking about the "don't be a sissy" thing in class this week. I heard my step father and the little boys on the play ground say this to my brother, but I didn't hear it from girls.

 

[1sickbastard]

This was an interesting topic in my Psych of Gender class.

The discussion covered how the outlook of the researcher shapes not only the outcome, but even the direction of the study. In this example the question was asked, "why do we have studies on why a person is homosexual, or bi-sexual? Why not ask ' why are you heterosexual?'."

The answer is of course because the researchers are heterosexual, and so they feel as if any other type of sexuality is weird/different/interesting. We only research things that are interesting to us. Makes sense.

But I thought I would put it out here anyway. Answer the question, or comment on something I said, or gum. What ever, I'm easy.

About age three when I started having unusual dreams about my older sister's barbie dolls. I knew for sure about age seven when I found one of my pop's Playboys and got my first erection.

 

[the captians wench]

Stereotype Threat:

This was this week's assignment. Basically what stereotype threat is, is when some one preforms more poorly than they might because of a fear of fitting into a stereotype, and therefore making it self-fulfilling.

The example the Prof used was this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGEUVM6QuMg&feature=related

I'd never thought of stereotype threat being a possible reason for me to not do as well at something than I might. So now I wonder how much this plays a part in my life, and how much of it is just something to blame our mistakes on.

 

[Dyslexicea]

I'm not *ignoring* the rest of your post, simply accepting it for what it is.

The statement about "women who choose to be lesbians due to very traumatising experiences with men," however, makes me wonder. Have they actually

• chosen to be lesbians, or
• chosen to engage only in lesbian sex

"due to very traumatizing experiences with men?"

I'm not sure the premise is correct. I've know lesbians who have been sexually abused by close male relatives, mostly their fathers but there are many straight women who have had the same experience. The same goes for rape. By the way being sexually abused by a male as a child is also the myth about strippers and I assure you most strippers had a rather normal childhood. If we assume both to be true, we surly must have a lot of lesbian strippers. Anyway let us assume that some are lesbians only because of traumatizing experiences with men.

If you mean by 'chosen to be a lesbian' close emotional relationships with other women including sex. I believe this would be the reason they became lesbians, sex being secondary. We all need close bonding type relationship, at least most of us, being she can't have that with a man she'll turn to another woman.

Now as far as the lesbian strippers go wouldn't that be an interesting subject. Even more interesting is two ex-lesbian strippers who happen to be married to each other.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Stereotype Threat:

This was this week's assignment. Basically what stereotype threat is, is when some one preforms more poorly than they might because of a fear of fitting into a stereotype, and therefore making it self-fulfilling.

The example the Prof used was this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGEUVM6QuMg&feature=related

I'd never thought of stereotype threat being a possible reason for me to not do as well at something than I might. So now I wonder how much this plays a part in my life, and how much of it is just something to blame our mistakes on.

My total resistance and even *inability to process* stereotype threats was one reason my sister asked me to be tested for asbergers.

But-- I think it stems from poor socialization. I was raised by wolves. In an ivory tower.

 

[graceanne]

Stereotype Threat:

This was this week's assignment. Basically what stereotype threat is, is when some one preforms more poorly than they might because of a fear of fitting into a stereotype, and therefore making it self-fulfilling.

The example the Prof used was this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGEUVM6QuMg&feature=related

I'd never thought of stereotype threat being a possible reason for me to not do as well at something than I might. So now I wonder how much this plays a part in my life, and how much of it is just something to blame our mistakes on.

If I'm understanding this correctly, it reminds me of my mothers reaction when I was little and told her I wanted to be mom or a nurse or a hairdresser or a teacher. She totally flipped out, because no daughter of hers was going to be trapped in a job that was for only for women. HER DAUGHTER (tm) was going to be a doctor or a lawyer, by god.

Several years ago she had an aneurysm in her nose and nearly bled to death. I spent a week with her nursing her back to health. Now she thinks I should be a nurse. However, I'm not healthy enough now.

That's what I call ironic.

 

[Netzach]

My total resistance and even *inability to process* stereotype threats was one reason my sister asked me to be tested for asbergers.

But-- I think it stems from poor socialization. I was raised by wolves. In an ivory tower.

See, I think this basically is an example of how people perform worse under stress - it points out that people who are marginalized and stereotyped live with layers and sources of stress that others don't have to deal with. I'm not sold on the idea that it's a different kind of stress biologically or in some metric way - it's surprising to me that mainly white researchers are that surprised.

 

[Netzach]

If I'm understanding this correctly, it reminds me of my mothers reaction when I was little and told her I wanted to be mom or a nurse or a hairdresser or a teacher. She totally flipped out, because no daughter of hers was going to be trapped in a job that was for only for women. HER DAUGHTER (tm) was going to be a doctor or a lawyer, by god.

Several years ago she had an aneurysm in her nose and nearly bled to death. I spent a week with her nursing her back to health. Now she thinks I should be a nurse. However, I'm not healthy enough now.

That's what I call ironic.

It'd be a little more like this - if someone tests a bunch of women on the same material and tells them the first time that they're being tested on communication style, and quantitative reasoning the second time.

Most of us will do worse the second time, because "math is hard" and we've had it drilled into us that we're always at a liability with this kind of knowledge.

 

[KoPilot]

You can have enjoyable sex with people you're not sexually attracted to.

You can have enjoyable sex with people you're not sexually attracted to.

You can have enjoyable sex with people you're not sexually attracted to.

Once more, with feeling:

You can have enjoyable sex with people you're not sexually attracted to.

And therefore your actions (or lack thereof) don't define your "orientation".

Okay, now that that's out of the way...

I always knew there was something weird and different and "off" about me compared to my more typically hetero peers, so I don't think I ever internalized the concept. Deep down, I'd always felt that "I like boys" was far more accurate than "I am heterosexual". Didn't have the words to talk or even think about how the two could possibly be different until like... a few years ago, though.

I grew up feeling genderless (and now officially identify) and would get excited at thinking about being eaten, or held hostage by dragons, or being someone's pet sidekick or a fairy instead of get excited about holding a boy's hand or kissing him or "being with him" or whatever. Dating never interested me, I never thought about it. Sex with individual people wasn't something that really occupied my thoughts. The first boy that had a crush on me I wound up picking apart and treating like shit because I was fascinated by his attraction and wanted to know how it worked (he was a creep, though, so I don't feel too bad about it).

So I guess tl;dr, I never found out I was heterosexual. I'd always thought of myself as a "thing" and now I have adult words to use to express myself more properly: agender, asexual, androphilic paraphile. It's a mouthful but calling me hetero makes as much sense as calling me a cisman.

 

[TheleHun]

I can't tell you the exact moment. But I do remember Gwen Stefani was involved.

 

[BiBunny]

You can have enjoyable sex with people you're not sexually attracted to.

Um...how?

 

[reachedme]

I'm not sure I ever did