Taboo. Open discussion, no attitude.

[Betticus]

Sorry Betticus - I didn't have time to read the link you attached to your post.

But why? Why, why, why would they want to do something like that - where's the benefit. I ask again why !!!

I'm with Perfect_Trust - think I may throw up in the shower now - yuck ! Just nasty.

In this case the little girls have cancer and were about to undergo intensive chemotherapy that could leave them sterile. The reason for prematurely maturing their eggs and freezing them is to give them at least a chance of having children in their future.

Everything is not as it seems at the surface, that is what I'm trying to communicate to everyone. Some things that at the onset seem to be heinous could have roots in love and understanding. Don't be too quick to judge the thoughts and actions of others.

 

[Quint]

...........

 

[Netzach]

In this case the little girls have cancer and were about to undergo intensive chemotherapy that could leave them sterile. The reason for prematurely maturing their eggs and freezing them is to give them at least a chance of having children in their future.

Everything is not as it seems at the surface, that is what I'm trying to communicate to everyone. Some things that at the onset seem to be heinous could have roots in love and understanding. Don't be too quick to judge the thoughts and actions of others.

Here's a taboo - maybe not everyone needs to pass along their freaking genetic code no matter WHAT

 

[xxCrystal4314xx]

Here's a taboo - maybe not everyone needs to pass along their freaking genetic code no matter WHAT

Yeah, I think it sucks that there's so much pressure on us as people to produce offspring biologically, and people struggle to understand when you choose not to. I've been asked a few times why we haven't wanted to have kids yet (been married 4.5 years). Unfortunately for us, it isnt a choice we have

 

[CutieMouse]

Here's a taboo - maybe not everyone needs to pass along their freaking genetic code no matter WHAT

I love my children; I can honestly say they are among the best things I ever did with my life, and I am a damned good Mom... but with equal honesty I can admit that if I knew in my 20s what I know now, I don't think I'd ever have had kids. As it is, I (more than) balance out those who decided to not have any. LOL

 

[Netzach]

Are they going to start collecting sperm in the advent that the boy MIGHT develop testicular cancer?

 

[xxCrystal4314xx]

Are they going to start collecting sperm in the advent that the boy MIGHT develop testicular cancer?

I'm pretty certain it was for when the girls had already been diagnosed but before chemo was started. I don't think it'd be wise as a 'just in case'.

 

[Evil_Geoff]

Here's a taboo - maybe not everyone needs to pass along their freaking genetic code no matter WHAT

A-freaking-men!

There are too damned many breeders passing along the genes for stupid out there anyway. And there are genetic defects passed on that could be stopped cold by selective sterilization. One, two generations tops and that defect is gone...

*sighs*

Eugenics is such a nasty word now...

 

[mytwocents]

A-freaking-men!

There are too damned many breeders passing along the genes for stupid out there anyway. And there are genetic defects passed on that could be stopped cold by selective sterilization. One, two generations tops and that defect is gone...

*sighs*


Eugenics is such a nasty word now...

Hmmm, wasn't that tried in Germany once?

 

[mytwocents]

I WIN!

The ultimate taboo has been not only broken but smashed, ground into powder, snorted up by the members of the skulls and then sneezed out onto the leaves of the dead sea scrolls!

Scientists have made prepubescent girls sexually fertile via science of some kind. They made sexually mature eggs from the eggs of a five year old girl.

http://www.slate.com/id/2169583/fr/rss/

Getting cancer patients pregnant is a sure fire way to accelerate their death. So part of the reason stated for extracting the eggs is pure bull shit.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Getting cancer patients pregnant is a sure fire way to accelerate their death. So part of the reason stated for extracting the eggs is pure bull shit.

Ummm, I would hope that by the time they reached adulthood and decided to have a baby via using the saved eggs they would have been cancer free for years.

Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

A-freaking-men!

There are too damned many breeders passing along the genes for stupid out there anyway. And there are genetic defects passed on that could be stopped cold by selective sterilization. One, two generations tops and that defect is gone...

*sighs*

Eugenics is such a nasty word now...

I think it is subjective what is classed as stupid, not to mention who would decide on what criteria..and then there are all those other supposed genetic possibilities they could decide to ensure weren't passed on like people who like S&M, or those who don't follow the right religion according to the state? Add to that it is easy to say and believe when it doesn't directly affect you, but how would you have felt a couple of decades ago when you had your children if someone had told you they decided you weren't qualified or suitable for parenthood and making babies so they were going to remove your right to do so at any cost?

Catalina

 

[Netzach]

For me what bugs me is everything being reduced to consumer choice.

I'm not talking about "damn everyone can breed" I'm talking about "damn everyone feels entitled to NO MATTER WHAT. Can't have kids, shouldn't have kids because you're likely to give them a life-ruining life curtailing condition? Rather than "I'm sorry, maybe you can adopt" the first line now is to come up with yet more absurd and yet more expensive ways to fight the way things are. My view is rather biased in light of H's daughter, an adoptee who's turned out a remarkably adjusted and successful person.

And I think parenting should be taught in school, even though I'm opting out, I think changes, childhood ailments, "what to do when" basics ought to be part of your learning. Let's face it, the vast majority of people are going to breed. If we can teach people information they need to safely fuck, we can teach people the info they need other than "smack it when it cries" which seems to be a popular style.

 

[xxCrystal4314xx]

For me what bugs me is everything being reduced to consumer choice. Can't have kids, shouldn't have kids because you're likely to give them a life-ruining life curtailing condition? Rather than "I'm sorry, maybe you can adopt" the first line now is to come up with yet more absurd and yet more expensive ways to fight the way things are.

And I think parenting should be taught in school, even though I'm opting out, I think changes, childhood ailments, "what to do when" basics ought to be part of your learning. Let's face it, the vast majority of people are going to breed. If we can teach people information they need to safely fuck, we can teach people the info they need other than "smack it when it cries" which seems to be a popular style.

The second bit I definately agree with. The first bit I don't. In the same way that if you have cancer you can get expensive treatments to sort the problem, I think everyone should have the choice to use whatever technology is available to them if they want to become parents. I don't think its right to deny people the chance to do what their biological drives tell them, in the same way that people who become disabled through accidents would want to get back to their previous abilities.

 

[catalina_francisco]

And I think parenting should be taught in school, even though I'm opting out, I think changes, childhood ailments, "what to do when" basics ought to be part of your learning. Let's face it, the vast majority of people are going to breed. If we can teach people information they need to safely fuck, we can teach people the info they need other than "smack it when it cries" which seems to be a popular style.

LOL, I am showing my age here but when I went through high school in my teens they had a subject called Mothercraft which was exactly that. It taught you what to expect to need to know if and when you became a mother including the options of types of nappies, breastfeeding or not, processed babyfood or home cooked, how to fold nappies, all about nappy rash, how to look after baby and get your regular household chores done in an orderly fashion, and the milestones of the average child in the first few years etc. Now it seems to have been shelved for the more trendy bring a sack of flour or egg home and take it everywhere pretending it is a baby and think you then know how to cope with a real live baby.

Catalina

 

[Netzach]

Expensive treatments don't always fix cancer and a lot of people reach a point where they are accepting of what's going to happen to them rather than interested in more drugs and radiation.

Likewise, the degree to which "fixing" a disability is very controversial among the disabled. Look at the controversy about cochlear implant in the deaf community and you will find a lot of people who do not want "everything done at any cost."

I guess it just bothers me that there's a world filled with uncared for humans and another one being grown in a dish. And that everyone tries to explain to me that my moral outrage about this is wrong or short sighted, everyone has the right to breed.

Yep, taboo all right. "Every child has the right to a caring family" is seen as utopian la la crazy talk.

As for "Ok, so where's the bundle on YOUR doorstep" it may come. I don't know. The only way I am going to find myself changing diapers is via adoption, this much I do know.

 

[xxCrystal4314xx]

I do agree that its shitty that so many kids aren't cared for, and that adoption is a good move, but I know an awful lot of people who have tried the adoption route and haven't been eligible.

If I hadn't been through what I have, I might well be 100% in agreement with you, because you've got a damn good point. Sometimes it's hard to see reason when you're looking at it through so many years of heartache.

 

[Evil_Geoff]

I think it is subjective what is classed as stupid, not to mention who would decide on what criteria..and then there are all those other supposed genetic possibilities they could decide to ensure weren't passed on like people who like S&M, or those who don't follow the right religion according to the state? Add to that it is easy to say and believe when it doesn't directly affect you, but how would you have felt a couple of decades ago when you had your children if someone had told you they decided you weren't qualified or suitable for parenthood and making babies so they were going to remove your right to do so at any cost?

Catalina

*grins and shrugs* The thread is about taboos... Eugenics certainly is one.

Someone is going to set standards, some people aren't going to make the grade. It's like flunking out of high school. I mean hell, you have to take classes and pass tests to drive a commercial truck, but any moron can pop out a baby? We have to license our pets, but children are allowed to run wild?

As for deciding who can have children and how many, and allowing parents to determine the sex of their child - we need look no further than the PRC (People's Republic of China). Their draconian rules regarding pregnancy and child rearing have slowed their population growth rate, but at the expense of a HUGE surplus of male offspring. That cultural imperative to produce male children coupled with ready access to abortion at will has led to the problem of an entire generation of Chinese men that will be having a lot of competition at finding partners...

In the industrial world, the ratio of male to female live births is roughly 1.04 to 1. All things being equal and considering that there will be GLBT folks who are not interested in members of the other genders, it pretty much works out that everyone can find someone... But in China now, the ratio of male to female births is getting close to 1.2 to 1, and in some provinces, the ratio is as high as 1.3 to one... That's a HUGE over balance of testosterone in the society. And trust me, that 20% to 30% overage of males in the population are not all going to become homosexuals.

If a government is going to impose the regulations, someone bloody well better do a better job of normalizing the sex ratio...

Oh... and I would have no problem being the one blowing the whistle and shouting "YOU! Outta the gene pool! NOW"

 

[bobshortforkate]

Here's a taboo - maybe not everyone needs to pass along their freaking genetic code no matter WHAT

Post of the thread.

 

[lynnh]

Older women, younger men

That's old news. But people really freak out over Harold and Maude.

On WE television's Secret Lives of Women they had a full episode devoted to the topic everybody seemed very favorably disposed towards it.

Then again you have a rash of women schoolteachers "falling in love" with 3rd graders; now that is, as far as I know, currently freaking people out.

 

[Betticus]

Here's a taboo - maybe not everyone needs to pass along their freaking genetic code no matter WHAT

Oh hell yes. I'm a big fan of selective breeding. Could you imagine if some country like Sweden implemented a policy of scientific selective breeding. Procuring genetic material around the world. A whole country of genius supermodels who are kinky.

 

[mytwocents]

Oh hell yes. I'm a big fan of selective breeding. Could you imagine if some country like Sweden implemented a policy of scientific selective breeding. Procuring genetic material around the world. A whole country of genius supermodels who are kinky.

I guess most advocates of selective breeding think it's most appropriate so long as they are included in the selection. Kind of interesting that people support the idea, even though they raised hell with Nazi Germany for doing it.

 

[LadyAria]

How about the taboo of not admitting some of our children were born to mop up fish guts and dig ditches? Not all children can be anything they want to be when they grow up and that is okay. No shame in filling your duty to society be it shoveling horse shit or owning the horse farm. Nature balances.

Society functions because we have a classes of people to do the mundane or manual labor the intellectuals do not desire to do. Every role has its place and skills required to fill that slot.

Genetic diversity supports a Utopian society. I hate to see a world of disgruntled geniuses.

Not all humans were created equal. We are a society of perfectly flawed people filling in each others weakness with other's strengths. Our inequalities are what equalizes us. Not one of us can do it all alone.

 

[Puman]

Oh hell yes. I'm a big fan of selective breeding. Could you imagine if some country like Sweden implemented a policy of scientific selective breeding. Procuring genetic material around the world. A whole country of genius supermodels who are kinky.

... and just a little grouchy!

 

[skittles_lm]

selective breeding is almost a must in these days of over-population and unchecked reproduction. There are too many of us as is, and yet _________ and _________ breed like rabbits and China limits the number of children one family can have, they're so overpopulated.

If my kids weren't gorgeous little baby einstiens, I'd have drowned them.

The principle stands though.