The hardcore stuff:enemas/fisting/knife-play/needles/strangling...

[Liana26]

Oh no... can't we all just get along?

But anyway... getting back to the original post, the most intense and painful thing my Dom's ever done to me was burn me with about 1 1/2 inches of a hot wire hanger on my thigh, three times in the same spot (we wanted to leave a mark and my skin's damn near impossible to scar). As much as I expected it to be painful, I didn't expect that it would make that awful snapping sound when it touched my skin. *shudder* That was one of my hard limits a very short while ago but I think since I broke it with someone I trust very much, it made it a lot easier. So, as unqualified as I think I am to give advice, maybe you need to find someone more experienced that you can really trust to maybe do those things with you. Assuming you want to try them of course. I forget if you said you did or didn't because I was too caught up in trying to follow what was going on between AA and TaintedB. Sorry.

 

[Etoile]

I'm curious, Liana - was this intended to be a permanent brand? Has it lasted?

 

[Liana26]

Well, on my skin type the metal would have to be pressed against me for a LONG time to leave a permanent mark and I just couldn't do that without novacaine. It's still healing right now but it'll probably be there for a good three years (as has been my experience with bad kitchen burns).

 

[Cutie_Connie]

I don't think you can put fisting in the same category as needles, cutting or strangulation. With a caring partner and enough time fisting shouldn't hurt at all. The female body is completely receptive to fisting if you are in the right mindspace and has a partner who knows how to treat you.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Oh no... can't we all just get along?

But anyway... getting back to the original post, the most intense and painful thing my Dom's ever done to me was burn me with about 1 1/2 inches of a hot wire hanger on my thigh, three times in the same spot (we wanted to leave a mark and my skin's damn near impossible to scar). As much as I expected it to be painful, I didn't expect that it would make that awful snapping sound when it touched my skin.

LOL, different strokes for different folks.....I loved the snapping sound (just wish I could have seen it) and the sizzle that followed, but there wasn't pain after the first half second and is healing nicely. BTW, don't ever be tempted to have it done longer as you mentioned you would need as a permanent branding should only be held to the flesh for 1-2 seconds maximum if at the correct temperature. Perhaps it wasn't hot enough as I have read that is one main reason why people feel excruciating pain during a branding....I am so glad he got it right even if we need to touch up a patch or two which could have come out better.

Catalina

 

[A Desert Rose]

...I am so glad he got it right even if we need to touch up a patch or two which could have come out better.

Catalina

You're a better woman than I, Catalina. I admire you. This is one thing I'm pretty sure I could never do.

 

[alice_underneath]

You're a better woman than I, Catalina. I admire you. This is one thing I'm pretty sure I could never do.

I have a question relating to your comments here.

For those who don't know this already, I have no BDSM experience. And in real life, I don't even know anyone who does.

This is not a rhetorical question - I am asking because I honestly don't know the answer.

Is there a commonly held assumption within the BDSM community that a pyl who can take more pain/extreme treatment/hardcore stuff/etc. is "better" or more worthy of respect than a pyl who can not?

 

[A Desert Rose]

I have a question relating to your comments here.

For those who don't know this already, I have no BDSM experience. And in real life, I don't even know anyone who does.

This is not a rhetorical question - I am asking because I honestly don't know the answer.

Is there a commonly held assumption within the BDSM community that a pyl who can take more pain/extreme treatment/hardcore stuff/etc. is "better" or more worthy of respect than a pyl who can not?

In a word, no. I just know Catalina and have for a long time. She understands the spirit in which I used those words.

(And I don't use the PYL/pyl thing. I'm a submissive... not a ply.)

LOL I made a typo, too. Hope no one saw it.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I have a question relating to your comments here.

For those who don't know this already, I have no BDSM experience. And in real life, I don't even know anyone who does.

This is not a rhetorical question - I am asking because I honestly don't know the answer.

Is there a commonly held assumption within the BDSM community that a pyl who can take more pain/extreme treatment/hardcore stuff/etc. is "better" or more worthy of respect than a pyl who can not?

LOL, definately not, just different things work for different people. I knew long before the first spanking just how far I hoped I could go to satisfy my own desires and visions....ROFLMAO, so glad I found I could endure the things I fantasised about, well most, the rest we are working on devotedly and over time.

Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

You're a better woman than I, Catalina. I admire you. This is one thing I'm pretty sure I could never do.

Not sure I could have for anyone else. Was sort of amazed at myself how calmly I approached it (except for that one moment of panic which he quickly denied me acting on ), and was definately surprised to find it didn't hurt!! Mind you, I still have butterflies thinking about redoing it.

Catalina

 

[alice_underneath]

In a word, no. I just know Catalina and have for a long time. She understands the spirit in which I used those words.

(And I don't use the PYL/pyl thing. I'm a submissive... not a ply.)

LOL I made a typo, too. Hope no one saw it.

Thank you for responding to my question.

Catalina may have have understood the spirit of your words, but I obviously did not. Thank you for the clarification.

As I tried to make clear by asking about "a commonly held assumption within the BDSM community", I was actually asking about attitudes in the broader community at large (as opposed to your attitude specifically). That is why I used the acronym "pyl".

If there is a more neutral or all-encompassing way to refer to bottoms/submissives/slaves, please let me know.

Alice

 

[alice_underneath]

LOL, definately not, just different things work for different people.

That's good to know.

Thank you for the response.

Alice

 

[A Desert Rose]

Thank you for responding to my question.

Catalina may have have understood the spirit of your words, but I obviously did not. Thank you for the clarification.

As I tried to make clear by asking about "a commonly held assumption within the BDSM community", I was actually asking about attitudes in the broader community at large (as opposed to your attitude specifically). That is why I used the acronym "pyl".

If there is a more neutral or all-encompassing way to refer to bottoms/submissives/slaves, please let me know.

Alice

I don't care what acronym you or anyone else uses. I just don't use that. And if you choose to use it, that's certainly your choice.

Catalina is a slave which is lots different than what I am. Doesn't make me any less a person nor does it make her any more of one.

We just do things differently.

And I'm sorry you didn't understand my post. I know lots of people here who post to each other in a "familiar" manner and I'm sure it can be confusing to those who are not privy to what familiar means.

 

[alice_underneath]

I don't care what acronym you or anyone else uses. I just don't use that. And if you choose to use it, that's certainly your choice.

Catalina is a slave which is lots different than what I am. Doesn't make me any less a person nor does it make her any more of one.

We just do things differently.

And I'm sorry you didn't understand my post. I know lots of people here who post to each other in a "familiar" manner and I'm sure it can be confusing to those who are not privy to what familiar means.

Posting on a message board is such a tricky thing to do.

Without body language, facial expressions, or tone, it is sometimes quite difficult to interpret the intent of a post.

As I said before, I was asking a question because I honestly did not know the answer to it.

I am curious about the lifestyle. That's all. My intent is not to insult or criticize or be nasty.

Not even when people are nasty to me.

Best regards,
Alice

 

[CorsetLvr]

I don't think I'll ever have the desire to try enemas, needle play, etc, but I am fascinated with other people's experiences. So, stayed tuned for the next "annoying" question from me in the near future.

Just remember this, IMO a Dom/me has an obligation to a sub to explore and expand the edges of a sub's soft limits. This is just a natural part of the growth, education and training process of a sub. Over time, the margin between a sub's soft and hard limits has a tendency to shrink. I think several previous posters have discussed how things that were once a hard limit have eventually become part of their BDSM repetoire. A lot of this is an extension of the trust and bond that develops between a Domme and sub. Its only natural that a sub would be willing to expand his/her limits in order to grow as a sub.

In addition, pain play has a tendency to be addictive. Over time a masochist can find him/herself requiring more of a rush then what they would have been satisfied with when they were a newbie. The increased rush may require more intense pain play than they had ever imagined experiencing earlier in their development.

 

[cati]

Alice_Underneath, I continue to enjoy reading your posts. To find a person with such cool level headedness and insight is rare here.

 

[A Desert Rose]

Posting on a message board is such a tricky thing to do.

Without body language, facial expressions, or tone, it is sometimes quite difficult to interpret the intent of a post.

As I said before, I was asking a question because I honestly did not know the answer to it.

I am curious about the lifestyle. That's all. My intent is not to insult or criticize or be nasty.

Not even when people are nasty to me.

Best regards,
Alice

I apologize if you took anything I wrote to you as nasty. I post like I talk. And you said nothing in any of your previous posts that I took as critical or insulting. I'm sorry if I came across to you like that, but this is me.

 

[alice_underneath]

Alice_Underneath, I continue to enjoy reading your posts.

Cati,

Thank you very much for your kindness.

I don't believe we have addressed one another before. I'm sure I would have remembered, because the hair in your avatar is exactly my r/l color - strawberry blonde tending to auburn.

So your post was a random act of kindness to a complete stranger.... which is wonderful indeed.

I appreciated it very much.

Alice

 

[alice_underneath]

I apologize if you took anything I wrote to you as nasty. I post like I talk. And you said nothing in any of your previous posts that I took as critical or insulting. I'm sorry if I came across to you like that, but this is me.

Thank you for the apology.

Alice

 

[catalina_francisco]

This is why I was looking for clarification.


On the first part. I said that a responsible dominant needs to have as much information as possible. I cannot handle all unforeseen possibilities and it is the pyl's responsibility to inform me as completely as they are able to try to prepare ourselves for what mayhappen. This is full disclosure. Again, it is not possible to prepare for everything, but we do our best. That means not holding back any "trivial" bits of information regarding their kink.

On the dominant's role being "the kind of responsible one." No. Or rather, I disagree. The submissive shares equal responsibility. A pyl's responsibility is to communicate their desires, needs and as much information as they possibly can. Within a scene, it is my responsibility to direct things in a mutually satisfying way. Unless there is a real non-consent issue, when a pyl agrees to scene, make love or otherwise get involved with a PYL, they are also responsible in the relationship. Sharing responsibility I will do. Shouldering it all because the poor lil pyl is the poor lil pyl who doesn't know what they want and I'm the big bad PYL doesn't fly.

Back OT.....I think it is important to recognise the mutual responsibility of both Dominant and submissive when contemplating play of any kind. What is edgy to one person may be fairly standard to another depending on their life experiences and individual issues and quirks. I agree with blue kat and AA that is is not always something you can be fully prepared for, or even suspect....sometimes a trigger comes out of nowhere. As in all things though, you cannot guarantee the outcome without first trying it. I know my first session resulted in deep bruising for a couple of weeks. I had no prior experience, I hated pain on any other kind, but my desire was to experience it hard and I was fortunate to have someone willing to oblige and commit to halp if anything arose we were not expecting. Fortunately the only thing that surfaced was I realised I was definately oin the right track for the type relationship I wanted for the rest of my life...although I was fairly certain before that moment, I couldn't be 100% sure without experiencing it. The downside of it was there were not many Dominants out there who were comfortable moving into the extremes I felt I wanted to explore and live....but I found the one meant for me.

Catalina

 

[Etoile]

As I tried to make clear by asking about "a commonly held assumption within the BDSM community", I was actually asking about attitudes in the broader community at large (as opposed to your attitude specifically).

This might be controversial of me, but yes, I think it is a commonly held assumption among those without much experience themselves. I don't think anybody would necessarily admit to it, but newbies probably do feel that edgeplay is "better" than regular kinky play. By extension, I would say that those with more experience in the lifestyle know that it isn't what you do that matters, but how you do it, especially if it is in a way that works for an individual couple or group.

Personally, I am kind of in the middle...I am at a point where I can recognize that whatever each couple does with each other is "proper" BDSM. If it works for them, then they are doing it "right" and not any more or lesser than other couples. And yet sometimes I think "wow, now that is serious stuff."

 

[A Desert Rose]

...And yet sometimes I think "wow, now that is serious stuff."

Good answer Etoile, but I especially liked this part. This is kinda how I feel/felt about branding and I'm sure that Catalina understood what I meant. It's one of those things I'm not sure I can ever do.

(But I never say never, either.)

 

[Slutacus]

Is there a commonly held assumption within the BDSM community that a pyl who can take more pain/extreme treatment/hardcore stuff/etc. is "better" or more worthy of respect than a pyl who can not?

People are responding to this with how they personally feel, which is fine, but I want to address the general community part of this question. I've met lots of people who feel this way. Most won't come out and say it directly, unless the social culture supports it (there are online places where it is--or was--supported, although maybe not here). It's not some kind of community trend (but then again I don't see people who do bdsm as a coherent community), but there are lots of people who associate themselves with bdsm who feel and act this way. You'll find some of them among the hardcore sadists and masochists (the people into sensation, not power?) and also the people who do performance SM, which is some of the most extreme stuff out there. You'll also find them among plain old doms and subs.

You have to be careful though, some people just like it, well, hot, and aren't trying to outclass anybody else. They just talk about what they like, with enthusiasm. If you don't particularly like the things they've done, it's easy to assume that they are boasting or just showing off. I don't assume anybody has a "better than thou" attitude about pain or any of the other bdsm extremities unless they come out pretty directly and say it. Lots will do just that.

I knew a man once who was something of a bdsm Don Juan on another message board a long time ago, who all the girls who didn't mind pretentiousness up the butt (about 99 percent of them) swooned over. He was an extremist snob and claimed he wouldn't even meet any woman who wouldn't agree to take it as hard as he wanted to dish it out. A lot of inexperienced women, who had crushes on him and thought they could take all kinds of "intense sensation" just because they'd never experienced it before, went to play with him and were shocked to the core by the experience, sobbing, horrified, totally demoralized, self-hating, the whole package. Even just singletailing somebody inexperienced with no warmup can be a pretty shocking experience if they aren't prepared for it (or looking forward to it). The asshat was too lazy, most times, to do any aftercare, too. He figured they'd asked for it and he'd educated them. He let others pick up the pieces. As you can probably guess, I didn't have too high a regard for this fellow, but he had a rep back then among the less critical of being some sort of bdsm guru so he got away with a lot of awful stuff...and an awful lot of stuff.

 

[Etoile]

Interesting response, Slutacus - I notice that you and I both addressed how the general community feels, but we have differing perceptions.

 

[Slutacus]

Perhaps they differ because my experience is from a different time. I haven't done much bdsm socializing in a long time. Maybe people have grown up a little more since then and don't need to play stupid bdsm Don Juan games? Well, one can hope...but at the same time, I suggest you tie your camel.