Time to Tame the Trolls

[elfin_odalisque]

AMEN!!! and you said it without insulting anyone, wish I had that talent!!! but the real problem is that those who believe they are being trashed by trolls are actually afraid to find out if they are truly any good or not, or they would indeed try it on the open market and not in a closed environment where their friends can boost their ego.



maria

No, honestly it's not like that. Dr M makes a valid point but I think you take things a bit too far.

Remember, we go back to where impressive started this thread. I think we're all against cabals of friends 5-bombing stories, but you have to accept that popular authors attract a fan club. There's nothing wrong in that.

I have no idea how to change things, but I do understand why impressive is so pissed off. Whether she is right or wrong to be so upset is not my worry. I just don't want a real joy and talent to be snuffed out by nasty people.

 

[BlackShanglan]

In some instances, I've no doubt you are correct. In others, perhaps there is no desire to be formally published. That does not mean there is no desire to be constructively reviewed. A hobbyist, for example, should be able to reasonably expect such here without tackling the publishing market.

I agree that it's good for us all to receive constructive reviews, but I really can't see that votes do this. A 1-5 vote tells me nothing about what needs to change in the work. For real, useful information, we already have several systems: anonymous feedback, the feedback forum, and the story discussion circle. All of these can give significant and useful responses to the author. A 1-5 vote really can't.

For that matter, I would observe that if one is actually aware that one is being trolled, then what good a serious of 1-5 votes is capable of is already there. That is, if you're sure that some votes are trolls, then you clearly are watching the rest of your votes closely enough to know what they are. In that case, what's the justification from a writer's point of view for demanding troll sweeps?

Shanglan

 

[impressive]

For that matter, I would observe that if one is actually aware that one is being trolled, then what good a serious of 1-5 votes is capable of is already there. That is, if you're sure that some votes are trolls, then you clearly are watching the rest of your votes closely enough to know what they are. In that case, what's the justification from a writer's point of view for demanding troll sweeps?

Shanglan

I'm not following your reasoning here.

 

[BlackShanglan]

I'm not following your reasoning here.

My point is that anyone who is aware that s/he has been trolled is aware of the voting on the story prior to the trolling. For example, I knew that "Will" had a 4.87 rating with 38 votes, then dropped to a 4.79 with a single vote that mathematically works out to a 2 (if I did my maths right).

So I know what the story was rated. Most of the voters voted it a 4 or a 5, with a majority toward 5 probably slanted by friends and acquaintances voting it with good will on my side. Yes, it's annoying that someone voted it a 2 - possibly because it had hit #3, or possibly just because s/he didn't like the story and was annoyed at the sudden revelation about the narrator. The latter is quite possible. But either way, I know how the story was doing pre-2-vote. I know what people think of it, and I can weigh my options in writing accordingly. In fact, the only way that I know that it received a low score was that I was aware of the average before - and thus aware of what people generally thought of it. If you're suggesting that votes are needed for author feedback, I'm suggesting that I know what the majority of people think whether I'm trolled or not. Having that 2 removed won't make the slightest difference to my understanding of how people felt about my story.

(And I highly recommend the SDC if substantial feedback is what anyone is after. One learns both to critique and to be critiqued, both valuable skills. I felt that it vastly improved my understanding of the story I submitted there.)

Shanglan

 

[impressive]

In fact, the only way that I know that it received a low score was that I was aware of the average before - and thus aware of what people generally thought of it. If you're suggesting that votes are needed for author feedback, I'm suggesting that I know what the majority of people think whether I'm trolled or not. Having that 2 removed won't make the slightest difference to my understanding of how people felt about my story.

Ah, now I understand. And, yes, from just the author's perspective, you're absolutely right. (Incidentally, if that's the ONLY low vote received, I don't necessarily consider it a troll -- although it could be if that same person voted a swath of them across the top 10 stories on a Top List just to elevate their own.)

However, from the reader's perspective, that trolling will affect story selection. It will affect contests. It may steal an H (or may not). I think it reasonable to assume we all want our work to be seen (for whatever reason) -- otherwise, why share it?