What is feminism?

[intothewoods]

In the corporate world? Who would give a flying fuck? Maybe in a small business it would be a burden on some. But if she is a good employee, people are accommodating.

It's not the money (in a large company/corp), but someone does have to cover for that person. Like Netz's example. I've been in both situations - it's really a challenge all around.

 

[WriterDom]

It's not the money (in a large company/corp), but someone does have to cover for that person. Like Netz's example. I've been in both situations - it's really a challenge all around.

Life is full of challenges. If its a normal leave you suck it up and cover her with no resentment. Now if the woman wants to take a year off, that might be a problem if they don't bring in some help. That's when the ones left behind might have to vote with their feet.

In a normal economy that is. Not the Obama Depression.

 

[intothewoods]

Life is full of challenges. If its a normal leave you suck it up and cover her with no resentment. Now if the woman wants to take a year off, that might be a problem if they don't bring in some help. That's when the ones left behind might have to vote with their feet.

In most places, you need to bring in help if it's a "normal leave" too.

This is a management issue. You have to respect everyone's need for life outside of work, not just mothers. In reality in most places everyone is overworked and stretched too thin though.

 

[JMohegan]

My Favorite August.

An arc of history tale, from Gail Collins.

 

[Netzach]

My Favorite August.

An arc of history tale, from Gail Collins.

total OT:

"I particularly enjoy the part where I find Vincent van Gogh and inform him that one of the unsold paintings piled up over in the corner will eventually go for $80 million"

Whereupon he mutters something and mutilates his other ear? God I thought I was mean.

 

[teknight]

Feminists....are they all butch dykes?

Apparently not.
Here's evidence (and it comes in a funny package too):
See #2

 

[Stella_Omega]

Butch Dykes; are they all feminists?


Well, no. Statistically speaking, there's bound to be some woman who believes that her own liberation is an anomaly.

 

[teknight]

Butch Dykes; are they all feminists?

Hey, no twisting my stuff around!...Hmm...that could be misconstrued....

 

[Felix_Jones]

One of the real joys of being a man...same work, more pay.

 

[teknight]

One of the real joys of being a man...same work, more pay.

Also, if you're married and she has a job, she takes on an extra 8 hours of chores, while, on average you do one less.

Ladies, you're tougher than I am. Here's hoping you won't go on a murder-rampage.

 

[satindesire]

Also, if you're married and she has a job, she takes on an extra 8 hours of chores, while, on average you do one less.

Ladies, you're tougher than I am. Here's hoping you won't go on a murder-rampage.

Tons of ladies that won't ask for help because "If he loved me he should KNOW what I want" do an extra 8 hours of chores. Which makes no sense to me.

I don't see the logic in that...nor will I do more just because I resent 'having' to ask for help. I ask for help every day. I'm not going to saddle myself with more shit to do just because "I shouldn't have to ask." That's BS.

 

[graceanne]

Tons of ladies that won't ask for help because "If he loved me he should KNOW what I want" do an extra 8 hours of chores. Which makes no sense to me.

I don't see the logic in that...nor will I do more just because I resent 'having' to ask for help. I ask for help every day. I'm not going to saddle myself with more shit to do just because "I shouldn't have to ask." That's BS.

Amen. My feeling has always been if I don't ask I don't get to complain when I don't get it.

That said, a lot of those women also get pissed when the guy helps cause he's not doing it right. My sister won't let her husband do dishes, because he doesn't put them in the dishwasher right.

I'm a big believer in if you don't want to do it you don't get to bitch about how it's done. And if you do bitch about how it's done don't be surprised if you end up doing it all the time. (BTW this rule works in reverse. He doesn't get to bitch about how I do stuff if he doesn't want to do it, unless he wants to be stuck doing it all the time.)

 

[satindesire]

Amen. My feeling has always been if I don't ask I don't get to complain when I don't get it.

That said, a lot of those women also get pissed when the guy helps cause he's not doing it right. My sister won't let her husband do dishes, because he doesn't put them in the dishwasher right.

I'm a big believer in if you don't want to do it you don't get to bitch about how it's done. And if you do bitch about how it's done don't be surprised if you end up doing it all the time. (BTW this rule works in reverse. He doesn't get to bitch about how I do stuff if he doesn't want to do it, unless he wants to be stuck doing it all the time.)

See, that's just simple logic. Which I love.

Technically, if you aren't asking for help, you don't want it that badly. So when I hear women who work AND do all the domestic stuff whine about their SO's never helping, the FIRST thing I ALWAYS do is ask them if they're ASKING for help.

I don't care if Mister doesn't load the dishwasher as good as I do. The dishes are still getting done!

 

[graceanne]

I don't care if Mister doesn't load the dishwasher as good as I do. The dishes are still getting done!

Exactly! And if they're getting done that means I DON'T HAVE TO DO THEM!

You should also ask the martyrs if they bitch at their SO's when they do help.

 

[satindesire]

Exactly! And if they're getting done that means I DON'T HAVE TO DO THEM!

You should also ask the martyrs if they bitch at their SO's when they do help.

I usually do. And then they get all pissed off because I'm basically telling them that they have to right to act foolish like that.

Sorry, but they wouldn't have it if they were trying to help their SO with something and he was snapping at her the whole time. She doesn't get to act like a bitch unless she's willing to handle the same treatment when it's his turn.

 

[graceanne]

I usually do. And then they get all pissed off because I'm basically telling them that they have to right to act foolish like that.

Sorry, but they wouldn't have it if they were trying to help their SO with something and he was snapping at her the whole time. She doesn't get to act like a bitch unless she's willing to handle the same treatment when it's his turn.

I can imagine. But, then, we live in a world where it's okay for the women to be bitchy and abusive, but when men do it we scream 'abuse!'.

 

[teknight]

I don't care if Mister doesn't load the dishwasher as good as I do. The dishes are still getting done!

Exactly! And if they're getting done that means I DON'T HAVE TO DO THEM!

Ladies, don't you have dishes to be doing? ((good thing people cannot reach through the screen to smack me)).

On a serious note- how much of this falls under feminism and how much falls under personal relationships? I for one don't believe that a woman's place is in the kitchen, I (eventually) do my own dishes, I do my own laundry...etc...
How does feminism affect this dynamic?

 

[Felix_Jones]

Also, if you're married and she has a job, she takes on an extra 8 hours of chores, while, on average you do one less.

Ladies, you're tougher than I am. Here's hoping you won't go on a murder-rampage.

I'm single, I do it all myself already. They might be tougher than you, not me though.

Also, respectfully, I think a man on a murderous rampage is way more dangerous than a woman doing the same thing. And more common.

 

[Felix_Jones]

Ladies, don't you have dishes to be doing? ((good thing people cannot reach through the screen to smack me)).

On a serious note- how much of this falls under feminism and how much falls under personal relationships? I for one don't believe that a woman's place is in the kitchen, I (eventually) do my own dishes, I do my own laundry...etc...
How does feminism affect this dynamic?

Plus I'm a better cook than every woman I know.

 

[graceanne]

Ladies, don't you have dishes to be doing? ((good thing people cannot reach through the screen to smack me)).

On a serious note- how much of this falls under feminism and how much falls under personal relationships? I for one don't believe that a woman's place is in the kitchen, I (eventually) do my own dishes, I do my own laundry...etc...
How does feminism affect this dynamic?

I had avoided this, because it normally pisses off everyone around me, but I do not consider myself a feminist. *shrugs* There isn't a word that I know of for what I am, but I'm a 'treat everyone as you would like to be treated' person. I'm also a 'take the world as it is' kind of person, and make the best of it. Do I think women always get treated fairly? No. But neither do men. Fair is a four letter 'f' word, and what I expect to hear from 4 year olds. "But mom! It's not fair!" Life is not always fair to ANYONE. That doesn't mean I don't think that we shouldn't try and make things more 'fair', - I just refuse to label myself that way.

To your question - yes, I think some of it is relationships problems. And some of it isn't - this is a chronic complaint from women. But, instead of hearing about communication as a response, you constantly hear about how it's not fair, but that's how it is. So most times it's assumed the guy is lazy or rude or abusive or whatever. (sometimes that's the problem, but that's true of women, too.)

 

[satindesire]

Ladies, don't you have dishes to be doing? ((good thing people cannot reach through the screen to smack me)).

On a serious note- how much of this falls under feminism and how much falls under personal relationships? I for one don't believe that a woman's place is in the kitchen, I (eventually) do my own dishes, I do my own laundry...etc...
How does feminism affect this dynamic?

To me, this is feminism in a nutshell.

Men can choose to work or stay home. Men can choose to employ birth control if they want, and choose how many children he wants if any. Men can choose to be Dominant or Submissive to their partners, vote, get paid fairly for his labor, and dress how he wants to dress. Men can choose to have sex with who he wants, when he wants to. Men can choose to get married if he wants to, or stay a bachelor if he wants to.

Feminism means that women have those rights, too.

 

[teknight]

I'm single, I do it all myself already. They might be tougher than you, not me though.

Also, respectfully, I think a man on a murderous rampage is way more dangerous than a woman doing the same thing. And more common.

Plus I'm a better cook than every woman I know.

You need to meet more/more skilled women. But kudos for your claims.

I had avoided this, because it normally pisses off everyone around me, but I do not consider myself a feminist. *shrugs* There isn't a word that I know of for what I am, but I'm a 'treat everyone as you would like to be treated' person. I'm also a 'take the world as it is' kind of person, and make the best of it. Do I think women always get treated fairly? No. But neither do men. Fair is a four letter 'f' word, and what I expect to hear from 4 year olds. "But mom! It's not fair!" Life is not always fair to ANYONE. That doesn't mean I don't think that we shouldn't try and make things more 'fair', - I just refuse to label myself that way.

I like that- the "4 letter 'f word' ". Nice.

 

[graceanne]

I like that- the "4 letter 'f word' ". Nice.

My mom used to scream that at me, when I'd tell her something isn't fair. She'd say 'fair is a four letter f word and I BETTER NOT HEAR YOU USE IT AGAIN!' Then she'd smack me. lol

 

[teknight]

My mom used to scream that at me, when I'd tell her something isn't fair. She'd say 'fair is a four letter f word and I BETTER NOT HEAR YOU USE IT AGAIN!' Then she'd smack me. lol

Well, that's not fair!...Uh-oh...I just used a bad word.

 

[Etoile]

My father-in-law has always done WAY more chores than my mother-in-law. He's responsible for just about everything except laundry. (We all do our own dishes.)