Will someone define 'vanilla' for me?

[AllardChardon]

Okay, so vanilla is common and chocolate was exotic, not the usual. I get the idea of a vanilla lifestyle choice much better now. From what I gleaned, this is an anything goes between two people without added toys, props or cameras kind of thing. So, I can only assume that anal sex would be regarded as vanilla, too. Yes or no?

 

[TE999]

Okay, so vanilla is common and chocolate was exotic, not the usual. I get the idea of a vanilla lifestyle choice much better now. From what I gleaned, this is an anything goes between two people without added toys, props or cameras kind of thing. So, I can only assume that anal sex would be regarded as vanilla, too. Yes or no?

Nope...definitely chocolate...or Rocky (Dirt) Road.

I like peppermint, cotton candy and bubblegum ice cream...is that a form of weird pedophilia?

 

[Guest]

I don't think you need to think that deeply about it.

Vanilla is just plain. No frills, no additives - just plain old yummy sex.

Ice cream doesn't figure into it at all.

 

[3113]

So, I can only assume that anal sex would be regarded as vanilla, too. Yes or no?

Nope. Heterosexual, missionary, penis-in-vagina sex is what's vanilla. Most common. Oral may also be within defined vanilla limits, but once you start moving to what's "dirty" and not so common (or, if you like, what's generally considered common), you leave vanilla behind.

Putting it another way, vanilla is the kind of sex you can discuss in polite conversation with those neighbors you don't know too well. The kind of discussion about your sex life that wouldn't make them too uncomfortable or feel that you were telling them more than they ever wanted to know about your kinks and proclivities.

See? That's vanilla. The kind of flavor you can serve up to just about anyone and they'll all like it fine and have no major objections like, "I'm allergic to chocolate!" or "I don't like nuts" or "What the hell is this stuff?"

 

[Guest]

Okay, so vanilla is common and chocolate was exotic, not the usual. I get the idea of a vanilla lifestyle choice much better now. From what I gleaned, this is an anything goes between two people without added toys, props or cameras kind of thing. So, I can only assume that anal sex would be regarded as vanilla, too. Yes or no?

Anal is not vanilla.

 

[BadPup]

Imagine the wildest kinky sex you could ever see yourself involved in, and then see yourself doing it every week after CSI on. That's my definition of vanilla sex. Once it becomes part of the routine it's vanilla.

 

[Safe_Bet]

Nope. Heterosexual, missionary, penis-in-vagina sex is what's vanilla. Most common. Oral may also be within defined vanilla limits, but once you start moving to what's "dirty" and not so common (or, if you like, what's generally considered common), you leave vanilla behind.

Putting it another way, vanilla is the kind of sex you can discuss in polite conversation with those neighbors you don't know too well. The kind of discussion about your sex life that wouldn't make them too uncomfortable or feel that you were telling them more than they ever wanted to know about your kinks and proclivities.

See? That's vanilla. The kind of flavor you can serve up to just about anyone and they'll all like it fine and have no major objections like, "I'm allergic to chocolate!" or "I don't like nuts" or "What the hell is this stuff?"

Nope back atcha. Surly you aren't describing gay or lesbian sex as "dirty"? Gay guys don't discuss "where they put the dick" any more than straight people do and lesbians can politely (blandly) discuss their sex life exactly the same as straight people can.

I think what you are saying REALLY needs to be put into a locational context. What is perfectly acceptable "vanilla" conversation in LA, San Diego or San Francisco, is "evil, demented porn in Wichita Falls. A chaste lesbian kiss is acceptable in NYC, Philly or Miami but is a disgusting perversion in Hog Wallow, Arkansas.

 

[Over_Lord]

But what flavor is complete debauchery then, or is it anyone's choice after vanilla?

This is a bit confusing. Where does strawberry fit in? The strawberry seems very sexual by nature, but all ice cream still has a cream base. Even chocolate has cream in it.

It is 'vanilla ice cream' that began this comparison to sexual preference, I trust? Not the vanilla bean or the extract? The pale color is pertinent, yes?

That would be a Knickerbocker Glory...

 

[neonlyte]

On Chocolate

Chocolate is sexy... not at all Vanilla.

The optimum temperature for making excellent hard dark chocolate is 36C, though of course, nothing is this simple. First chocolate needs to be brought to a melting point to melt the VI and V crystals, this is achieved at 27C. Stimulation helps the formation of seed crystals, you then need to raise the temperature to 31C, to eliminate the VI crystals so that only the V crystals are left. The final outpouring, for hard chocolate is 36C.

It is so equivalent to sex that one is tempted to believe in Design Theory, first raise the temperature of the partner to release inhibitions, stimulate to form the right desire, and slowly raise the heat until the right hardness ensures a guaranteed 'snap'.

36C is the ideal temperature for making babies

 

[SlickTony]

Offhand, I'd say I was Moollennium Crunch.

 

[xssve]

Nope back atcha. Surly you aren't describing gay or lesbian sex as "dirty"? Gay guys don't discuss "where they put the dick" any more than straight people do and lesbians can politely (blandly) discuss their sex life exactly the same as straight people can.

I think what you are saying REALLY needs to be put into a locational context. What is perfectly acceptable "vanilla" conversation in LA, San Diego or San Francisco, is "evil, demented porn in Wichita Falls. A chaste lesbian kiss is acceptable in NYC, Philly or Miami but is a disgusting perversion in Hog Wallow, Arkansas.

That is true, being lesbian or bi is defined as kink in general terms, but I suppose there is a difference between kink and Vanilla among lesbians - oral sex is Vanilla, has been since the Sixties, anal is still pretty much kink, but yeah, a lot of it does depend on where you're at, i.e., the local culture - "oral sodomy" is still considered "unnatural" in some place, and even against the law a lot of places until very recently, even though it's become Vanilla in the broader national culture.

It's really just a generic term for boring, routine, etc., and it was borrowed from mass culture, "plain Vanilla", i.e., "no frills", the basics, Meat and Potatoes, unimaginative, generic.

It also describes and attitude, however, i.e., kink fearing mass culture - people afraid to try anything new, though possibly in a more neutral, rather than actively hostile sense, the boredom addicted, etc. - consumer culture, where kink, if it's mentioned at all, is usually played off as a visual joke, as absurdity. It's the people who just don't get you, don't share, or dissociate from you and your enthusiasms, the orthodoxy.

Again, there are distinct cultural differences depending on time and place, you might say things in the bar for instance that you might not mention in the line at the grocery store.

 

[lesbiaphrodite]

I'm not sure of how I define 'vanilla,' but my instinct is that it's what bores me silly and I avoid.

 

[glynndah]

Discuss my sex life with my neighbors?!?

 

[damppanties]

Discuss my sex life with my neighbors?!?

Doesn't everybody do that?!

 

[midwestyankee]

Ultimately, "vanilla" is a term used from the outside looking in. It's a term used by folk who, for the most part, see themselves as being not vanilla. It distinguishes them from the majority of folks in our society, who mostly practice very common and mainstream sex. More than anything else, it serves as a relative identifier by subtraction. Used by members of the bdsm community (whence it originated as far as I can tell), it refers to common PIV sex without the added attractions of power exchange, toys, or pain.

There's a certain amount of debate about "vanilla" as to whether it's a pejorative. My own suspicion is that originally it did have significant pejorative value but that has waned somewhat. In recent decades the bdsm community appears to have assumed an attitude of wide-ranging tolerance and this tolerance seems to extend, to a large degree, even to those outside the community, the population of the vanilla world.

 

[glynndah]

Doesn't everybody do that?!

Let's see. My neighbors? A seventy-something widow and a married couple also in their seventies... Oh, and my mother-in-law.

 

[3113]

I think what you are saying REALLY needs to be put into a locational context. What is perfectly acceptable "vanilla" conversation in LA, San Diego or San Francisco, is "evil, demented porn in Wichita Falls. A chaste lesbian kiss is acceptable in NYC, Philly or Miami but is a disgusting perversion in Hog Wallow, Arkansas.

She said that anal sex was vanilla. Out of context. Meaning without the qualifier of "gay." Which means, so far as I've always known, she is incorrect, as "vanilla," is most often used by hetero BDSM users to describe non-bdsm hetero folk having the most common, plain and simple, what-you-can-say-about-your-sex-life-to-hetero-neighbors sex.

You are correct that if we qualify with the word "gay," as you did ("gay vanilla sex") then anal qualifies as vanilla. But without that qualification, the most *common* sex isn't anal. I am, however, willing to admit that I'm not enough of a member of the BDSM community to know for sure, so perhaps you're right that anal is included in vanilla sex no matter what.

 

[3113]

Discuss my sex life with my neighbors?!?

I'm always astonished, myself, at what people will tell me--often without my asking or wanting to know, and this includes neighbors (if you get to know them that is). And I did say polite conversation. Like that 70 year old widow telling you, "I went out with a very nice gentleman the other night and I think he must have used some viagra...." (wink, wink).

At which point you'll get the picture (as much of a picture as you want), probably, of vanilla sex, not of him taking her up the ass and she reciprocating with a whip and dildo.

 

[midwestyankee]

I'm always astonished, myself, at what people will tell me--often without my asking or wanting to know, and this includes neighbors (if you get to know them that is). And I did say polite conversation. Like that 70 year old widow telling you, "I went out with a very nice gentleman the other night and I think he must have used some viagra...." (wink, wink).

At which point you'll get the picture (as much of a picture as you want), probably, of vanilla sex, not of him taking her up the ass and she reciprocating with a whip and dildo.

Point well made. You need Cialis to get to the whips and strap-ons level.

 

[unregistered]

 

[NoJo]

The free London "Metro" newspaper yeserday had a feature on puppy girls -- women who like to be treated as puppies by their Masters. They even had the website and email addess of a proDom so you could find out more and indulge your "dirty puppy" fantasies.

Now the "Metro" is just about the most mainstream, unprovocative newspaper you can imagine -- which goes to show that a lot of kinky sex is pretty much acceptable, though generally considered slightly ridiculous. If it's taken really seriously, then of course it's no longer slightly ridiculous, it's slightly sad.

 

[AllardChardon]

From its very sound, vanilla could not be a part of anal sex in my thinking, but the definitions here are as varied as the definers.

Oral sex has become more mainstream, so I can see how it could be vanilla.

But only the missionary position? That does not sound right. The woman on top occasionally or doggie-style are not vanilla? I would think if oral sex was in there, these two would be. This is a bit confusing.

But I do get the general drift. I used to term 'vanilla' to describe myself BEFORE I joined LIT. Now I see, I have never been 'vanilla' in my entire lifetime. I masturbated as a young child. And still do at 57.

 

[Guest]

I actually had a relationship end over this....

He thought I was talking about race when I said that he was vanilla and I wasn't

I just rolled my eyes when I explained to him what it was... dork

 

[Stella_Omega]

The free London "Metro" newspaper yeserday had a feature on puppy girls -- women who like to be treated as puppies by their Masters. They even had the website and email addess of a proDom so you could find out more and indulge your "dirty puppy" fantasies.

Now the "Metro" is just about the most mainstream, unprovocative newspaper you can imagine -- which goes to show that a lot of kinky sex is pretty much acceptable, though generally considered slightly ridiculous. If it's taken really seriously, then of course it's no longer slightly ridiculous, it's slightly sad.

Puppy girls might be almost vanilla, but I bet puppy men-- gay puppy men-- are not.

 

[AllardChardon]

It seems to me that kinky sex is more acceptable in London than most of the united States. I must admit, I am intrigued by the Brits and their sexual appetites.

But social acceptability of kinky sex seems more common to me these days than when I was younger. Internet porn surely has changed the world.