Women who like trannies

[Etoile]

I might be taking it too seriously, but there is a significant anti-transperson movement out there that does need to be accounted for. Advocates of "Womyn-born-womyn" policies, which excludes transgendered MtF,

For what it's worth, there are a LOT of women who think womyn-born-womyn policies are total bullshit. You will never catch me at Michigan, because of their exclusionary policies. That's the biggest profile event that is "for womyn-born-womyn" only, what others have you heard of?

Janice Raymond's "The Transsexual Empire", a book that levels the accusation that,

"All transsexuals rape women's bodies by reducing the real female form to an artifact, appropriating this body for themselves .... Transsexuals merely cut off the most obvious means of invading women, so that they seem non-invasive. (Raymond, 1979: 104)"

Okay, Janice Raymond is a crackpot. I won't argue with you there. Not to defend her, but she was writing from a separatist perspective in 1979. Most of the modern feminists I know are also trans-positive. Raymond's views have been pretty well left behind. Yes, she has held positions of authority, but lots of people in high positions have dumb ideas. Take a look at this page that clarifies Raymond's position - which is, takes it out of the snobby tone and puts it in plain text, making it obviously idiotic. BTW, she's also against in-vitro fertilization for infertile women, and RU486 the "abortion" pill. I like Nancy Nangeroni's article skewering the Empire book.

I wouldn't hold up Janice Raymond as an example of how a broad group dislikes transpeople. I would say she represents less than 10% of self-described feminists. She's cuckoo, and most people know it.

When presented with a "man in a dress", some gay men do find it offensive. This is part of the reason why some want to remove the T from GLTB. (Some also want to remove the B, but that's a different story.) Depending on where you live it differs. In small towns and such where there is a need for solidarity to gain equality, you don't find this. However in a big more liberal city where there is a general undercurrent of acceptance, there is often more in-fighting.

Why do they find it offensive? The MTF person is saying "I am not a man," not "I am a type of man." I don't understand why they would find it offensive. Although I do sort of understand the reason for wanting to take the T out of the equation - when you think about it, what similarities are there between gay needs and trans needs? We each have our own set of goals, that are not necessarily shared. I happen to feel that transgender rights are equally important as gay rights, and I think it's safe for us to be united in our goals - but I can see the perspective of those who disagree. (As for bisexuals, I think that's just about being angry at bisexuals for having the ability to fall in love with somebody "safe" to be partnered with. Which is not to say that bisexuals do take "the easy way out" - they end up with who they end up with - but the anger stems from the fact that the "easy way out" is there.)

I definitely agree with you about bigger cities being more likely to have differences between groups. But there's also more opportunities to find those who do think as you do.

 

[Etoile]

And y'know...Janice Raymond really should change her last name. It's a MAN's name. ZOMG!!!!

 

[md3lt4]

Janice Raymond isn't the only one out there, unfortunately -

Questioning Transgender Politics


Which makes me sad

 

[Etoile]

Thanks for that link, I will have to read it tomorrow.

 

[StrixVaria]

wait for it. in the next hour someone is going to post how the term tranny and shemale and manboy and chick with a dick and whatever else you can think of is degrading and should be erased from the language and how the ones you see in porn arnt what they are or are about.


get the fuck over it. i dont give a shit if someone calls me a cracker. im white and you can call me any racist thing you want.


that said. i would love to be with a shemale who could pass for a woman. dont even know she had a dick until you take her panties off to lick her pussy and as soon as you spread her legs a dick slaps you in the lips. mmmmmm tasty

Sigh.....

For those of us who went through five years of "Aversion Therapy" for being Transgendered, I would like to say that you really don't know shit about being Trans.

You don't know shit about questioning who you are at the most fundamental level, you don't know shit about having to "explain yourself" to a team of five psychologists while naked in a chair for two hours a week, you don't know shit about electrochock or any of the other techniques that are still considered "acceptable" to be used on the "gender confused".

Quite frankly, you consider the inbetween state of a body in transition to be your private masturbation toy, and, in that I do know all about the above - and I do mean all of it - I think I have the right to say, in that I've earned the right to say, that you sir, disgust me personally.

I am, for the most part, a female person who lives in a male body. It's too damn late in life for me to do anything to change that fact without becoming a clown. Fortunately for me, I am attracted to women, which - for all intents and purposes, makes me a straight man. I can hide behind polite society. But, that does not change what I have been through in order to get here.

As for you and your Shemale fantasy - unless you pay for six months of hormones and therapy - Fuck You.

 

[Mirror_tan]

I'm a little miffed here that every misconstrues me as believing all feminists, all gays, all heteros are against transgendered people. But what I'm saying is that there's a fairly vocal and significant group wanting to get rid of us, and that it's ill-advised to stick our heads in the sand. As the rabid neo-cons in this country show, it doesn't matter how much of a minority you are of public opinion, if you are vocal and active. Certainly there are feminists which oppose discrimination against transwomen. As well there are many gays and lesbians that realize a system that discriminates against gays is likely to discriminate against transgendered people as well, and vice versa. And so on. But just because we have allies, does not allow us the luxury of complacency.

I have the nagging sense that whenever I type the giant walls of text...

 

[naughtyinsilk]

mirror_tan I understand where you are coming from and I do understand the issues you are raising, but I must say that your experiences are of how transgendered people are regarded and treated is limited to america. In the UK, I have experienced a much more supportive society and less opposition to transgendered people. Here there is very little discrimination, and TS find it fairly easy to carry on with a normal life. I know we are fortunate, and also that 25 years ago it wasnt so easy, but these days I do not know any TS who have lost their jobs or their families over this.

I hope that in America, society wakes up ad welcomes the TS commmunity into the main stream. It may take a while but its worth the struggle

 

[contos]

one of my biggest fantasies is to be with one.

i like them, iadmire them and i feel all wet just to think in beeing with one.

kisses for you all

 

[Stella_Omega]

Ah, a blast from the past, Etoile!

StrixVaria's post is heartbreaking.

 

[Etoile]

Ha, I didn't even realize this was an old thread at first! Good point Stella!

 

[sarawithacock]

Hey,
Just to put my self into the conversation...I am woman who was born transgendered. That simply put is the best way I feel describes me. I am also bisexual (well, mostly I like girls but there's room in my heart and other places for boys). I also have a penis because of how I was born and while I have struggled with it...it is a healthy part of my body that I don't feel the need to change, though given the choice at birth..I would have gone a much different direction! This may one day change but it is as I am right now.

This is my unique way of being and though it is different from most woman, I hold that I am indeed female...and it does matter that this is recognized. This is not merely a psychological issue, though the mind is where the greatest transition happens for someone who was betrayed by their body at puberty (oh testosterone, you turned my lights off!). I was born with a particular physiology and while male seemed to appear correct because of what was between my legs...alas! it was not to be...

I live as I am, and only as I feel most naturally to be. Estrogen set my mind free and not only can I think better and feel more than numb and sad....I have a lovely body which I thank God for everyday (well, ok...not everyday...)

I could write an essay! Oh and sure shemale isn't a great term but I'm not that fond of tranny either. Chick with a dick at least recognizes that I am indeed a girl!

But that's just me.
Cheers!

 

[Stella_Omega]

That's okay, Sarah-- I'm a man who was born with a pussy. So I know exactly where you're coming from!

 

[sarawithacock]

That's okay, Sarah-- I'm a man who was born with a pussy. So I know exactly where you're coming from!

hot.

Y'know I've always felt I had more in common with the few "f to m" transgendered individuals I have met... for one reason or another.