….pick up younger woman at a bar, what makes older men attractive to younger woman

[littlecordelera]

Hi!
I've always had a thing for older men (neither daddy issues or gold digger vibes either as someone stated) and been picked up by older guys a fair bit through the years. When I was younger (like 20) I assumed the 40 year old man was just the pinnacle... I'm 40 now myself and find myself drawn to men a lot older.

As for the pick up... confidence is key, not cockiness just a quiet understated confidence. You have been around the block, you know how everything works, you are experienced and expert... for initial conversation I'd start light, buy a drink, ask her questions about her life, touch her - but not in a creepy way, just let your leg touch hers or touch her arm as you laugh at something she says. Touch is a great way to test if there is a spark! If you are getting good vibes then push a little further, tell her she smells great, tell her she's beautiful...

A lot of women love a silver fox!

With all due respect, I couldn't disagree more.

Yeah, guys, be a 40-something and touch a 20-something, and see how well that goes. She will probably not react in a noticeable way, because she's afraid of you, but at some point, she will likely start texting. If she is not texting friends, there are apps now for young girls to report guys who appear threatening.

 

[Britva415]

The thing that infuriates me about men complaining about friendzoning is that they think we made a choice not to pick them, when they were never anything else because we make the choice who to include not who to exclude.

This isn't what friendzoning implies at all. Friendzoning is a rejection of romantic possibilities. How is that not a choice?

I'm not saying women aren't entitled to choose to reject someone's interest, but if they're aware of it and make clear that it's not returned, that's... like... not involuntary.

Or maybe you're talking about a situation where the guy's interest isn't actually made clear to her, because he's too meek to do so, and then like a psycho he imagines her rejection?

 

[Britva415]

I’m not sure I get what you mean?

To keep going on dates with someone when you know it’s not going where the other person wants, to keep you occupied untill something better comes along or even because it’s somehow still the 50’s and they are paying all the time, is obviously an asshole move.
I would not be leaving my social circle though, because there is someone who ”stares at me with puppy eyes and tongue hanging out”.
But then I never quite got the argument between Harry and Sally either.

I don't really get what you mean either.

Friendzoning is not "going on dates." It's maintaining a friendship after saying no to dates.

 

[IrisAlthea]

How is that not a choice?

We do choose to reject someone but we do not choose who we are attracted to.
Feelings are not a choice, actions are.

I don't really get what you mean either.

Friendzoning is not "going on dates." It's maintaining a friendship after saying no to dates.

So if I’m not interested in romance and/or sex, but do like to stay/be friends, why should I walk away?
The other person is an adult and should be able to decide if the friendship is still worth having or not, in my opinion. If I didn’t think they had that ability, there probably wouldn’t be any offer of friendship.

 

[stickygirl]

This isn't what friendzoning implies at all. Friendzoning is a rejection of romantic possibilities. How is that not a choice?

When the approach wasn't invited.
If a guy approaches a girl in a bar and starts hitting on her, she is having a choice forced on her. What you're not seeing is how intimidating that can be: I don't mean he's initially being aggressive, but what if she outright rejects him by ignoring him? How is he going to react to that?
Often, in my experience, with slurs like "Okay - stick with your dykey friends" "Wassamattabitch? You should know a good thing when ya see it" or a muttered "Bitch" or "Frigid bitch".
I'm not making this up or dramatising it.
Pretending to be sociable with smiles and nods avoids a confrontation, while she'll text her friends 'Help!' and hopefully the cavalry arrives.

I'm not saying women aren't entitled to choose to reject someone's interest, but if they're aware of it and make clear that it's not returned, that's... like... not involuntary.

Or maybe you're talking about a situation where the guy's interest isn't actually made clear to her, because he's too meek to do so, and then like a psycho he imagines her rejection?

I'm sure you used the word 'entitled' unintentionally.

I don't really get what you mean either.

Friendzoning is not "going on dates." It's maintaining a friendship after saying no to dates.

Maybe that's how some folks interpret it now and that's probably why we're kicking the idea around still? What you're describing is maintaining a simple friendship, so I think the expression has been re-interpreted.

Friendzoning as I understand it might play out like this...
Fiona 'Hey Sheryl. Did I see Mark hitting on you last night?'
Sheryl 'Oh yea. He's too creepy. I friendzoned him' ( or if you're being cool 'I zoned him' )
Fiona 'Okay. No problem. I'll watch your back on that one'

So it's a passive aggressive rejection of Mark. It's unlikely that either Fiona or Sheryl will actually become friends with Mark, but they'll tolerate him up to a point. If Fiona sees Mark hitting on Sheryl again, she'll cruise in and rescue her from his unwanted advances.

It comes down to girls looking out for each other. As I said before, it grew out of high school slang and to be honest, as a woman gets older, she'll probably improve her social skills or have a steady bf.

 

[Noor]

This isn't what friendzoning implies at all. Friendzoning is a rejection of romantic possibilities. How is that not a choice?

I'm not saying women aren't entitled to choose to reject someone's interest, but if they're aware of it and make clear that it's not returned, that's... like... not involuntary.

Or maybe you're talking about a situation where the guy's interest isn't actually made clear to her, because he's too meek to do so, and then like a psycho he imagines her rejection?

Woman can think they are friends with a guy, they treat the guy as a friend, they aren’t even looking, the guy mistakes friendship for romantic intent when there was never any to begin with, the guy pretends to be a friend, later he asks her out and she says no, and he thinks he was friendzoned, and she finds out that is friendship was totally just to date her or get sex and he never was a friend to begin with.
Then there is the chess move type logic, if I make this move or do this, she’ll date me, where he thinks if only she didn’t have a boyfriend then she’d date me, if only I had more muscles, if only I had money, but none of that matters she was never interested to begin with and never will be. You can’t create clicking or chemistry with another person if it’s not there.

 

[twister947]

I had a friend nearly 60 years ago. She was in thrall to a "bad boy"; I still wonder "what if...".

 

[Plasmaball]

The expression is childish and ridiculous but I've only ever heard it as a verb "Uh-huh? You've been friend-zoned" but to clarify your interpretation, girls can be frightened to hurt a guy's feelings because they don't know how he'll take rejection so she'll keep him safely at arms length.

The implication is that once you've been friend-zoned, you have zero chance of sleeping with her and that she is only being friendly because you're 6'3" but your knuckles still touch the floor.

I don't know if I agree with this.

 

[stickygirl]

I don't know if I agree with this.

I'm realising that the expression has morphed into something used more broadly than young girls. I need to check with some undergrads and find out what the update is.

 

[Plasmaball]

I'm realising that the expression has morphed into something used more broadly than young girls. I need to check with some undergrads and find out what the update is.

I'm just going off my own friend zone experiences.

On the one hand one girl wanted to "friendzone" me after we had already been dirty. Actually Two of them.

The other is more in line with this conversation.
We were friends. I waited till she was single. I thought we clicked. I wasn't just there to get in her pants or wait to date her. I honestly enjoyed when we hung out. I was young though and didn't know. Sometimes I think I missed my chance during this one moment and that's when I pushed into friends.

Or I'm just over thinking it like usual. We didn't remain friends, it was too hard for me.

I'm not saying the other examples are wrong because this subject can be so open to your own opinion.

 

[Noor]

When the approach wasn't invited.
If a guy approaches a girl in a bar and starts hitting on her, she is having a choice forced on her. What you're not seeing is how intimidating that can be: I don't mean he's initially being aggressive, but what if she outright rejects him by ignoring him? How is he going to react to that?
Often, in my experience, with slurs like "Okay - stick with your dykey friends" "Wassamattabitch? You should know a good thing when ya see it" or a muttered "Bitch" or "Frigid bitch".
I'm not making this up or dramatising it.
Pretending to be sociable with smiles and nods avoids a confrontation, while she'll text her friends 'Help!' and hopefully the cavalry arrives.

I'm sure you used the word 'entitled' unintentionally.

Maybe that's how some folks interpret it now and that's probably why we're kicking the idea around still? What you're describing is maintaining a simple friendship, so I think the expression has been re-interpreted.

Friendzoning as I understand it might play out like this...
Fiona 'Hey Sheryl. Did I see Mark hitting on you last night?'
Sheryl 'Oh yea. He's too creepy. I friendzoned him' ( or if you're being cool 'I zoned him' )
Fiona 'Okay. No problem. I'll watch your back on that one'

So it's a passive aggressive rejection of Mark. It's unlikely that either Fiona or Sheryl will actually become friends with Mark, but they'll tolerate him up to a point. If Fiona sees Mark hitting on Sheryl again, she'll cruise in and rescue her from his unwanted advances.

It comes down to girls looking out for each other. As I said before, it grew out of high school slang and to be honest, as a woman gets older, she'll probably improve her social skills or have a

I'm just going off my own friend zone experiences.

On the one hand one girl wanted to "friendzone" me after we had already been dirty. Actually Two of them.

The other is more in line with this conversation.
We were friends. I waited till she was single. I thought we clicked. I wasn't just there to get in her pants or wait to date her. I honestly enjoyed when we hung out. I was young though and didn't know. Sometimes I think I missed my chance during this one moment and that's when I pushed into friends.

Or I'm just over thinking it like usual. We didn't remain friends, it was too hard for me.

I'm not saying the other examples are wrong because this subject can be so open to your own opinion.

I think the idea that a person has missed the one moment is faulty.
If you both clicked, there would be many moments.
She didn’t friendzone you, she just wasn’t interested in more. She probably thought you were an actual friend.
If you were a friend and not just waiting your moment to date her, why was it too hard to remain friends?

 

[Plasmaball]

I think the idea that a person has missed the one moment is faulty.

Seen enough stories to say this does happen

If you both clicked, there would be many moments.

true..and there could have been in my head.

She didn’t friendzone you, she just wasn’t interested in more. She probably thought you were an actual friend.

That much is clear.

If you were a friend and not just waiting your moment to date her, why was it too hard to remain friends?

I had feelings. I couldn't bury those.

 

[Purple_Fronds]

When the approach wasn't invited.
If a guy approaches a girl in a bar and starts hitting on her, she is having a choice forced on her. What you're not seeing is how intimidating that can be: I don't mean he's initially being aggressive, but what if she outright rejects him by ignoring him? How is he going to react to that?

This brought me back to a great conversation I had a long time ago at a hotel bar in Canada. I was chatting with two women, friends who were traveling together one older (40s) one in her twenties.

As a guy walked by he was clearly interested, and then the younger woman says to me something to the effect of “Shit I made direct eye contact and now i have to look him up and down so he knows I’m definitely not interested“ and it worked. I was just fascinated about with her thought process and how quick it was.

 

[Krigirl1233]

They can usually last longer than 30 seconds.

 

[littlecordelera]

I understand what everyone means by "friend-zone" in this thread, and I think it serves its purpose, but for what it's worth, it's not used by Gen Z. To them, Facebook doesn't exist.

 

[stickygirl]

This brought me back to a great conversation I had a long time ago at a hotel bar in Canada. I was chatting with two women, friends who were traveling together one older (40s) one in her twenties.

As a guy walked by he was clearly interested, and then the younger woman says to me something to the effect of “Shit I made direct eye contact and now i have to look him up and down so he knows I’m definitely not interested“ and it worked. I was just fascinated about with her thought process and how quick it was.

Wow - I'll scribble that down in my notebook. Wow... Being on the autistic spectrum means that's a technique I know I'd fuck up. I'd end up looking like I'd lost an eyeball or summinck. Hence also why autistic women get into difficult situations because their social skills are not intuitive.

 

[stickygirl]

I understand what everyone means by "friend-zone" in this thread, and I think it serves its purpose, but for what it's worth, it's not used by Gen Z. To them, Facebook doesn't exist.

I feel so old, and to them I am

 

[Purple_Fronds]

Woman can think they are friends with a guy, they treat the guy as a friend, they aren’t even looking, the guy mistakes friendship for romantic intent when there was never any to begin with, the guy pretends to be a friend, later he asks her out and she says no, and he thinks he was friendzoned, and she finds out that is friendship was totally just to date her or get sex and he never was a friend to begin with.
Then there is the chess move type logic, if I make this move or do this, she’ll date me, where he thinks if only she didn’t have a boyfriend then she’d date me, if only I had more muscles, if only I had money, but none of that matters she was never interested to begin with and never will be. You can’t create clicking or chemistry with another person if it’s not there.

I agree with this, but what can be confusing is that people (not just women) often make statements to the effect that we were friends first, or they’ve been such a good friend. Hence why the harry met sally thing is a little weird and isn’t in my opinion very common, and certainly the vignettes in the movie itself undermine the point as they all suggest it starts with some kind of romantic intent.

 

[Purple_Fronds]

Wow - I'll scribble that down in my notebook. Wow... Being on the autistic spectrum means that's a technique I know I'd fuck up. I'd end up looking like I'd lost an eyeball or summinck. Hence also why autistic women get into difficult situations because their social skills are not intuitive.

This made me laugh, thank you.

 

[Hipshot1554]

"what makes older men attractive to younger women?"​

Ummmmmm... our wallets?

 

[Noor]

Seen enough stories to say this does happen
Stories by whom? I’ve seen a lot of stories that support the incel agenda on line, but in RL, I’ve never seen it happen. It’s unlikely at best.

true..and there could have been in my head.


That much is clear.


I had feelings. I couldn't bury those.

I’m sorry that happened. It’s hard when a fantasy is burst, but it passes. Do you still have these feelings?

This brought me back to a great conversation I had a long time ago at a hotel bar in Canada. I was chatting with two women, friends who were traveling together one older (40s) one in her twenties.

As a guy walked by he was clearly interested, and then the younger woman says to me something to the effect of “Shit I made direct eye contact and now i have to look him up and down so he knows I’m definitely not interested“ and it worked. I was just fascinated about with her thought process and how quick it was.

unfortunately, eye contact, being polite, whatever can make some guys think you’re interested.
Walking up to them, sniffing them and asking them out sometimes scared the hell out of them, but some love it.

 

[Noor]

"what makes older men attractive to younger women?"​

Ummmmmm... our wallets?

We have our own wallets, got anything else?

 

[Noor]

They can usually last longer than 30 seconds.

The friendship, the sex, the guys themselves?
Perhap 30 secs is an exaggeration, but I’ve lost a lot of friends in the past 9 yrs.

 

[Krigirl1233]

The friendship, the sex, the guys themselves?
Perhap 30 secs is an exaggeration, but I’ve lost a lot of friends in the past 9 yrs.

Huh?

 

[Noor]

Huh?

You said they can usually last longer than 30 secs and I wondered what you meant.