2011 Survivor: Plotting & Planning thread

[Algonquin Twit]

And yes, once an immunity is used that particular *cap level* (not the whole category) is closed and is not supposed to be filled.

Yes, you are correct about the cap level closing and that works for me. Thanks.

Does anyone else have anything to say on immunities? Everyone agree with the 1:1 ratio change (1 cap level filled for each valid immunity)?

I vote yes on this one.

So, what do we wish to do about chapters? Abolish the rule completely? Modify the rule to include clarification? Modify the rule to include the use of chapters under certain conditions? I asked for ways to clarify it last year and didn't really get anywhere with it. What say you? I really would like to get all of this nailed down so the rules can be finalized.

Short of having the moderators read each and every chaptered story to determine if it is a stand alone story and short of a definitive definition of "stand alone story" I don't know how we can avoid abuse here. Either way I'll probably avoid writing chaptered stories, I'd hate to lose points over the question of what is "stand alone" or not at the end of the contest like what happened in the 2009 contest.

AT

 

[Auden James]

Questions

I want to make certain that I've fully understood some points:

1. I can submit stories in different languages: all of these submissions will be validated, e.g. I post 3 stories to category X, 1 of these stories is in English, 1 in French and 1 in Spanish, I fill cap 1 of category X and so on.

2. If I submit translations of other authors' submissions (that were submitted before or in 2011): will those be validated? To my mind they would be new and original, for the story wasn't available to readers of the target language before and I myself translated it which is an original (and challenging) task to do.

3. Chapters are illicit, though it's permitted to re-use characters and/or settings?

 

[Algonquin Twit]

I want to make certain that I've fully understood some points:

1. I can submit stories in different languages: all of these submissions will be validated, e.g. I post 3 stories to category X, 1 of these stories is in English, 1 in French and 1 in Spanish, I fill cap 1 of category X and so on.

2. If I submit translations of other authors' submissions (that were submitted before or in 2011): will those be validated? To my mind they would be new and original, for the story wasn't available to readers of the target language before and I myself translated it which is an original (and challenging) task to do.

3. Chapters are illicit, though it's permitted to re-use characters and/or settings?

A lot of these questions came up in an earlier year.

The rules for translations are as follows: Non-English stories and poems: Submissions in all languages are eligible for the contest and must be posted in the corresponding categories as applicable. There will not be a specific non-English category in the scoreboards. All submissions must be original work of the entrant, and subsequent translations in any language are not eligible for points.

So it appears that in answer to question 1: Different language stories can be submitted but the each submission must be a different story. You cannot submit a story in English and then submit the same story translated into Spanish and have both count as points. If you choose to submit a story in French, that is acceptable, but subsequent translations of that story would not be eligible for points.

It also appears in answer to question 2: Since the story must be, "...the original work of the entrant..." translations of other author's work would not be allowed for survivor points.

As for question 3 I think that is still up for debate.


AT

 

[Auden James]

It also appears in answer to question 2: Since the story must be, "...the original work of the entrant..." translations of other author's work would not be allowed for survivor points.

And that's the point: To my mind it is original work of the entrant. It's not like I would translate my own work and submit both versions into the survivor contest: that, in effect, would mean to submit the same story twice, and I think that's the reason why translations of one's own work are rightfully illicit.

But if I submit the translation of another one's story which itself does not enter the survivor contest, then I submit only one original work of me the entrant and it's nowhere less original than to write another story myself because the translation is not simply there before I translated it: it's original on it's own right.

 

[Boxlicker101]

In 2009, some of the stories posted were long tales that had been cut up into chapters that were each barely long enough to meet Lit. standards for length. No one chapter made any sense without the ones that preceded and followed. They were even posted in a variety of categories. A 5,000 word story would be cut up into five or six chapters and each one posted individually and the individual segments would be scored. This was the kind of abuse the chapter rule was intended to eliminate.

At the same time, I and others have sometimes written stories, usually stroke, with recurring characters and/or recurring locations and posted them as separate stories. Examples are those about the hot blonde student and about Marian and Ryan and about Angel Jones and about Strider the ponygirl and some others. Each of these tales is a stand alone story with a definite beginning, a series of orgasms and an ending. Most are the normal length for stroke stories on Lit., between 4,000 and 6,000 words. Some, such as those about Angel Jones were longer, over 10,000 words.

I described some of the work I have done, but others do the same kind of thing. Stories such as these are sequels or parts of series, and should be acceptable as individual entries. An arbiter can tell by a quick look at the beginnings of them that they are standalone stories, and that should be the criteria. Either that or length, requiring stories in a series to be a minimum length, such as 4,000 words, which would not include lengthy passages from the previous story in the series.

 

[Kaishaku]

And that's the point: To my mind it is original work of the entrant. It's not like I would translate my own work and submit both versions into the survivor contest: that, in effect, would mean to submit the same story twice, and I think that's the reason why translations of one's own work are rightfully illicit.

But if I submit the translation of another one's story which itself does not enter the survivor contest, then I submit only one original work of me the entrant and it's nowhere less original than to write another story myself because the translation is not simply there before I translated it: it's original on it's own right.

Rule #8 under Stories and Poems clearly forbid the use of previously submitted work on literotica for entry in the contest whether translated, narrated, templates, etc. I think that addresses the issue.

 

[Auden James]

Rules

Stories and poems that had already been posted at Literotica.com, as well as translated (...) versions of submissions already entered in the contest are not eligible for points.

The rule speaks of translations of submissions already entered in the contest.

I speak of translations of submission that were not submitted by me in the first place and that also were not entered into the contest before.

To my mind those translations I speak of should be eligible for points.

And reading what boxlicker writes, I think that the prohibition of chapters is reasonable. Though I'm not too sure how to prevent what boxlicker described when the same figures and places are used over and over again...

 

[Algonquin Twit]

Regarding translations of another author's work

The Submission Guidelinesfor literotica state:

By submitting a story to Literotica, you certify the following stipulations to be true:

You are the sole creator of the submission; You are 18 years of age or older and legally able to write, submit and read erotic or pornographic material;
You grant Literotica the right to publish your submission as received by Literotica.com. (I bolded the text here)

it also states:

10. Manuscripts are copyrighted in the name of the author. This means you must be the author of any story you submit. (The bolded text here is in the Submission Guidelines).

If a story is submitted, translated or not, the submittor must be the sole creator of the submission. The submittor must be the author of any story they submit.

It is simply against site and contest rules to take a story written by another and submit it to literotica. Obviously if it is against the rules to submit the story, it certainly is not eligible for points in the survivor contest.

The rules seem very clear, translating the work of another author and submitting it to Literotica is not allowed.

AT

 

[Auden James]

Sorry to correct you, but the 10th rule actually reads:

10. Manuscripts are copyrighted in the name of the author. This means you must be the author of any story you submit.

Of course, the translator is obliged to give credit to the author of the source material: Still, the translated manuscript is the sole creation of the translator who, in fact, is the author of the translation and therefore also the author of the respective submission of the translation. It's also clear that you cannot simply take and translate any text you want without the agreement of the author of the source material.

Anyhow, I think some clarification from the officials would be helpful.

 

[Algonquin Twit]

You are correct... I misplaced the phrase "translated or not." and I will correct my post to place the phrase where I intended it.

 

[Algonquin Twit]

This statement is very clear: "This means you must be the author of any story you submit."

Not translator, author.

 

[Auden James]

Seems so? Well, I still would like an official to confirm your extremely strict interpretation of the guideline (an interpretation that would actually render some submissions illicit as shown below).

My argument is clear: A translator who submits his translation is the sole author of this translation. That the translation would not be possible without a source text doesn't change a bit of this: Though it obligates the translator to state his submission to be a translation and credit the source. It's exactly the same with people giving credit to their editors: editors my inflict heavy changes on a text and still the author who writes it down is the sole author of his submissions. A translator crediting the source material wouldn't rip anyone off.

However, what do we do vice versa if one adopts your strict interpretation: If it is illicit for translators to submit their (credited) translation, then for sure the author of the source must not submit the translation, too, because he/she definitely isn't the author of the translation in any respect. In consequence the Lit policy then would have to be to declare any translation illicit that's not done by the author of the source himself, even if the author of the source text gave, as I presuppose, his permission to a translation.

Furthermore this strict interpretation would contradict the facts, regarding that some stories on Literotica are submitted by users who openly declare to not be the original authors of their submission (look Tithe, A Man, a Woman, a Talk, and a Rocking Chair, Office Party and Musical Chairs, Roommate etc.)! So, you want to allow/accept for no apparent reason that in one case the author of the source and the submitting user aren't identical in the strictest sense of the word, and at the same time declare it illicit in the other case where the author of the source is either credited and/or gave permission?

 

[theravenfox]

Any chance we'll have a review of the rules as they apply to Text With Audio? I'm hoping that someday, I'll be able to submit all of my stories via Audio. As in an entry in each of the categories (Lesbian, Taboo, Loving Wives, etc) but all submitted as Audio stories. Those submitting audio would state in the description which category it applied to. I think I speak for all of the aural sex goddesses when I say this would be a great idea!

Other than that, bring it on and good luck all!

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

Each story or poem must be original work from the entrant for points to be awarded.

I'm sorry, but a translation of someone else's story is not original work. You are simply taking someone else's story and translating it to a different language. You didn't write it. You didn't have any hand in the creation of the story line. Therefore, a translation does not count for points in the contest.

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

Any chance we'll have a review of the rules as they apply to Text With Audio? I'm hoping that someday, I'll be able to submit all of my stories via Audio. As in an entry in each of the categories (Lesbian, Taboo, Loving Wives, etc) but all submitted as Audio stories. Those submitting audio would state in the description which category it applied to. I think I speak for all of the aural sex goddesses when I say this would be a great idea!

Other than that, bring it on and good luck all!

Sorry, but no. As long as the Text with Audio category is its own category, then all audio submissions would belong in that category for the contest. Maybe some day, the audio won't be a separate category but an addition to each regular category, but until then Audio stories go in the Audio category (just like illustrated go in illustrated.)

 

[Auden James]

I'm sorry, but a translation of someone else's story is not original work. You are simply taking someone else's story and translating it to a different language. You didn't write it. You didn't have any hand in the creation of the story line. Therefore, a translation does not count for points in the contest.

Thanks for clarfication.

Though I decisively disagree with you on the point of not being original. However, I'd still like to ask whether it's allowed to post a translation of another author's story (with his/her permission) on Literotica in general?

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

Thanks for clarfication.

Though I decisively disagree with you on the point of not being original. However, I'd still like to ask whether it's allowed to post a translation of another author's story (with his/her permission) on Literotica in general?

That is a question you would have to take up with the site admins. A pm to Laurel might get you an answer.

 

[theravenfox]

Sorry, but no. As long as the Text with Audio category is its own category, then all audio submissions would belong in that category for the contest. Maybe some day, the audio won't be a separate category but an addition to each regular category, but until then Audio stories go in the Audio category (just like illustrated go in illustrated.)

Well, as I said...someday. Thanks for the answer.

 

[odax]

Special contests for bonuses

I apologize if I've missed it, but is there a concrete list somewhere of this year's contests that count toward the "special/holiday contests" bonuses? As far as I could tell in the rules, there wasn't a specific number to look for.
Or are they the same every year?

 

[Boxlicker101]

I apologize if I've missed it, but is there a concrete list somewhere of this year's contests that count toward the "special/holiday contests" bonuses? As far as I could tell in the rules, there wasn't a specific number to look for.
Or are they the same every year?

Hi, Odax, and welcome to Literotica. If you are going to be here for a while, you might like to visit the Authors' Hangout, which is a nice place to hang out and discuss writing and whatever else comes up.

Here is a list of the 2010 theme contests. They don't change very often, but that has been known to happen. http://forum.literotica.com/showpost.php?p=32794855&postcount=9

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

I apologize if I've missed it, but is there a concrete list somewhere of this year's contests that count toward the "special/holiday contests" bonuses? As far as I could tell in the rules, there wasn't a specific number to look for.
Or are they the same every year?

You will be issued a scorecard thread soon (hopefully sometime this weekend). The thread has a link to the card template, which lists all of the special contests.

 

[odax]

Hi, Odax, and welcome to Literotica. If you are going to be here for a while, you might like to visit the Authors' Hangout, which is a nice place to hang out and discuss writing and whatever else comes up.

Here is a list of the 2010 theme contests. They don't change very often, but that has been known to happen. http://forum.literotica.com/showpost.php?p=32794855&postcount=9

Thanks! I'll have to check that out.

 

[Noira]

Before I jump into writing, I would like to know that I can reuse settings and characters for certain, since I see there's some debate on this even though the rules say you can have characters reappear as long as each story is standalone. I plan to do something that will be something like Discworld (anyone familiar with that series?) where one big world was created and some characters reappear throughout the series, and some books are in the same localle but you can pick up any book and they stand alone.

Sure, I'm pretty sure I could churn out a few hundred "A is a something. A meets B in generic porn location of choice, TENSION, they fuck" where we know nothing about A and B besides their measurements, name, gender and role short stories... but that's not the point. If I'm going to write hundreds of stories, I want to write what I enjoy.

So I just want to know right now that I won't be disqualified if Joe appears in more than one story, or that more than one story takes place in London or somesuch. I promise I'm not looking to write a really, really long novel about the adventures of Joe the Pirate Who Fucks A Lot In Many Genre Fitting Ways and chopping it into five hundred short stories, I'm just looking to do something... uniquely me, that I'll enjoy doing, to keep myself in the competition. And I'd like to know before I start writing, so I can make other plans if it's not cool. Thanks!

 

[CrimsonMaiden]

Before I jump into writing, I would like to know that I can reuse settings and characters for certain, since I see there's some debate on this even though the rules say you can have characters reappear as long as each story is standalone. I plan to do something that will be something like Discworld (anyone familiar with that series?) where one big world was created and some characters reappear throughout the series, and some books are in the same localle but you can pick up any book and they stand alone.

Sure, I'm pretty sure I could churn out a few hundred "A is a something. A meets B in generic porn location of choice, TENSION, they fuck" where we know nothing about A and B besides their measurements, name, gender and role short stories... but that's not the point. If I'm going to write hundreds of stories, I want to write what I enjoy.

So I just want to know right now that I won't be disqualified if Joe appears in more than one story, or that more than one story takes place in London or somesuch. I promise I'm not looking to write a really, really long novel about the adventures of Joe the Pirate Who Fucks A Lot In Many Genre Fitting Ways and chopping it into five hundred short stories, I'm just looking to do something... uniquely me, that I'll enjoy doing, to keep myself in the competition. And I'd like to know before I start writing, so I can make other plans if it's not cool. Thanks!

The conversation that was spawned from this post was moved to the 2010 Off topic thread (since I had not created the 2011 one yet). No biggie, just trying to keep this thread clean for discussion.

Okay, here is the problem with what you are asking and why we still have an issue with the clarity of the no chapter rule (which I still haven't gotten much discussion on btw): You have to be very careful when you are using the same characters in more than one story that none of them sound like they are a continuation of a previous story. Stories have been disqualified in the past because even though the location was different, the story still read as though it was a continuation of a previous one (and the author and some others didn't agree but there's the rub... it's subjective and both of the moderators felt the stories in question *were* related enough to be considered chapters).

I've been giving the chapter rule some thought on how it can be better utilized. Some people don't want chapters at all. Some would like to have chapters but do not want the chopping that went on in previous years. There's got to be a way to find a compromise which takes care of the problem with the disagreement on what is a chapter and what isn't. So here's what I have come up with so far:

We can allow chapters but have certain requirements for them (like we do for certain categories like chain stories and novels), such as:

• Chapters of a series cannot jump categories.
• Each chapter must include sexual content (IE an oral sex scene, etc. NOT just a kiss) if the series is in an erotic story category.
• Each chapter must include X amount of words.

Now, obviously, we might need to go into greater detail about what constitutes sexual content, and we'd have to decide how many words (I was thinking a full Lit page or thereabouts.) It's going to require a bit more time to check those entries and the mods would need help from the participants to ensure the rules were being followed, but it might be a decent compromise.

So, what do y'all think? Good idea? Not good idea? Other suggestions?

 

[PrincessErin]

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