Bottoming

[nh23]

LOLOL

hmm now I'm thinking that if all we're doing is playing for the sense of the fact that it makes him hot to spank me..and it makes me wet getting spanked..then it's more of a Top/bottom thing..

Ah, but you're in a M/s or D/s dynamic are you not? So to me you are always his submissive, not just in the bedroom. So even in the lighter moments you are submitting. This is just my opinion, but the only time you would be bottoming would be if you were allowing someone you are not submitting to..to give you that pain/scene.

 

[EmpressFi]

that's why I was asking.. I am in a D/s dynamic. Malin and I are not D/s but I do have a Master. I have for over a year

 

[nh23]

Let me muddy it up for you a bit more..lol. I am not a Dominant. Nor am I a top or a sadist. I just don't have it in me. But, I'm experienced in needleplay. Bunny enjoys needleplay. I put needles in her back for her. So in a way, I was the top, she was the bottom..lol. T/b or S&M to me is a whole different category. Yes you can have S&M in D/s but it's not required. S&M doesn't have to involve D/s. Say for example if you and your Master went to a public play dungeon and you bottomed to someone there. You would be bottoming to that person, not submitting to them.

 

[nh23]

that's why I was asking.. I am in a D/s dynamic. Malin and I are not D/s but I do have a Master. I have for over a year

Yeah, you guys are like me. I have a husband, and I have a Dominant. Although my husband is vanilla. We are poly like you and Malin.

 

[nh23]

Ok I have this in my head and I've got to get it out..lol. Fi say for example you and your Master are playing around. He is spanking you etc.. He gives you an order. You're going to obey right? Even though you were just playing around a few minutes ago. Now if you were in a situation where you were bottoming, it's not the type of dynamic where you would have any obligation to follow an order. So if the top gave you and order, you could say no, with no repercussion. You have no obligation to obey the person who is topping you. As you would with your Master.

 

[unfoundiamond]

Bottoming Vs Submission

Bottoming is when you are the recieveing end of a Top... a person who is dominating the sex, in a way... This is also a term coined in the GLBT circles when talking about two men having sex, one being the bottom and reciving the D and one being the Top and having dirty penis...

Which is why I am so shocked people call themselves a bottom, in a straight sex, its not a appropriate context so much to me... I don't know, Leather men are the connect I think, It crosses over yes... but to me... having vaginal intercourse isn't bottoming... its odd, I dunno maybe its just me...


Submission is more than sex, its more than attitude, it can be sexless I am sure (I am sure there are Dom/mes that don't have sex with their subs') Submitting to someone for me is about learning things I couldn't learn from the people who raised me, Learning respect, learning to behave myself completely properly, not giving into the urge to be selfcentered and fight for my own will.

I think the whole "Taken In Hand" relationship concept is a perfect example of the diffrence between "bottoming" and submission... You can have submission that is not sex related... I am not saying those people don't have sex, but the submission aspect is not sexually based,

My Idea of perfect is a PYL that can be both sexually dominant,"a Masterful man" and also be more of a leader like in the D/lg relationships, nurturing and supportive, helping me to make good choices and keep focused, and devoting myself to someone who can help me learn lessons my ideal relationship...

They cross Bi.. But I don't find them to be interchangable... they are very diffrent...

 

[nh23]

Bottoming is when you are the recieveing end of a Top... a person who is dominating the sex, in a way... This is also a term coined in the GLBT circles when talking about two men having sex, one being the bottom and reciving the D and one being the Top and having dirty penis...

Which is why I am so shocked people call themselves a bottom, in a straight sex, its not a appropriate context so much to me... I don't know, Leather men are the connect I think, It crosses over yes... but to me... having vaginal intercourse isn't bottoming... its odd, I dunno maybe its just me...


Submission is more than sex, its more than attitude, it can be sexless I am sure (I am sure there are Dom/mes that don't have sex with their subs') Submitting to someone for me is about learning things I couldn't learn from the people who raised me, Learning respect, learning to behave myself completely properly, not giving into the urge to be selfcentered and fight for my own will.

I think the whole "Taken In Hand" relationship concept is a perfect example of the diffrence between "bottoming" and submission... You can have submission that is not sex related... I am not saying those people don't have sex, but the submission aspect is not sexually based,

My Idea of perfect is a PYL that can be both sexually dominant,"a Masterful man" and also be more of a leader like in the D/lg relationships, nurturing and supportive, helping me to make good choices and keep focused, and devoting myself to someone who can help me learn lessons my ideal relationship...

They cross Bi.. But I don't find them to be interchangable... they are very diffrent...

I'm not sure what you're saying..what do you think bottoming is? And are you saying it's exclusive to the gay community..or? S&M doesn't have to involve sex either..

 

[Luna_Wolf72]

In the interest of not hijacking the "Is Submission A Gift?" thread anymore, I'm snipping a quote of BiaTcHiNFiRe's and starting my own thread about it.



To explain, for anyone who hasn't read the entire "Gift" thread, BF said this to me, as a way to point out how she thinks my outlook on BDSM is cold. I believe there's a big difference between bottoming and submitting and that the two are not mutually exclusive of one another.

I'm not too sure exactly where I want to go with this. Thoughts anyone?

I haven't actively *submitted* to anyone in years. It requires a level of trust and love that I am not able to give to anyone, especially since I consider myself a Top-heavy switch. I do bottom on occasion and have been actively bottoming in semi-maso way for the past few weeks with my s/o.

To me bottoming and submission are different. I can have pain play, sensation play, and all the rest without wanting or needing the emotional attachment that comes with it. It doesn't take away from my enjoyment of bottoming to know that I am not allowing myself the full range of emotional experiences offered by submitting or being an active *submissive*, it's just not how I see myself.

I guess to others who know who and what they are in the scheme of things, there isn't a difference. But to those of us who play both sides of the fence at one time or another...there is a big difference. I don't see it as cold...but I do think that the differences are there...and noticeable.

 

[Homburg]

Tossing a pair of coppers in (and it's gonna be a ramble)

I have taken to thinking of myself as a Top more often than a Dom these days. I've actually gotten uncomfortable with the nomenclature, as there's so damned much baggage attached to the term, and so fucking many fakes that I really have no desire to associate myself with the term. Additonally, as I am in a M/s dynamic, I can't honestly say that I'm a Dom actively. Dom requires sub to be meaningful in context, and I have none. I own, I do not lease. So, yes, I am Dominant, but I eschew the term Dom when describing myself.

The primary reason, however, is simple math. To 99.99999%+ of the people on this planet, the only meaningful way that I will interact with them is by Topping. That's it. I may be a fuck-all Domly Top, but I'm not interested in Serial Dominance, nor am I particularly looking for a second submissive (Rope bunnies are encouraged to contact me, of course). So if I am going to be a Top towards the overwhelming majority of people with which I will interact in a BDSM milieu, why identify myself as other than a Top for interactions with them?

The long and short of is that I do not see bottoming and submitting to be mutually exclusive, but I also do not see them inextricably joined. Plot a Venn Diagram and there's a hell of a lot of overlap, but neither encompasses the other fully. The same could be said for Top/Dom. A diagram would show overlap but not a complete subsumption.

Part of the problem is that, wow, they look similar to outside observers generally. And, yeah, they are. The difference between the two lies in the minds and hearts of the participants. For example, last week I tied a lovely young lady at a party. One of the finest scenes I've had the pleasure of undertaking. It was a T/b dynamic, but an observant onlooker would have seen numerous signs of submission-style behaviour on her, and Domly behaviour on mine. Was a tone of D/s there? Sure there was. I'm a Dominant guy, and she has a submissive side. There's going to be D/s overtones when emotions run high. Was it a D/s scene? Hell no. T/b only. She did not submit to me, even for the time of the scene, and I was not interested in that.

Yes, we've all seen the temporary contracts allowing for time-limited submission for the length of scene. I consider that to be utter claptrap. You're going to spend more time dickering about and fiddling with the contract than you are scening. *yawn* Colour me uninterested. Yes, this girl and I talked at length before the scene, but the negotiations consisted of me telling her "I am going to touch you. You realise that, right? No, really, I'm going to touch you. Everywhere.", and her putting the limit of keeping her underwear on. That, and the understanding was there that we were limiting our actions to rope and wax as well, was the extent of negotiations. Why? Because it didn't need more. I was Topping her, nothing else.

D/s requires more emotional investment than T/b. Though I'll disagree with the folks that say that it requires more mental investment as well. Nope, T/b can drain you mentally just as bad. And connection? Pfft. I've felt connections with people that were bottoming to me that were vastly more solid than the connection I've felt with someone that claimed to be submitting (temporarily). There's no magical connection that happens as soon the "s" part comes into play. connection forms because of the relationship, and the bond you feel, and you can get that in T/b too. The primary difference here is that most folks seem to do T/b in limited engagements, compared to D/s, so the relationships don't have the time to form the really solid bonds..

And, at the end of the day, were Netzach (to choose an example that everyone can understand) to show up with a coupla lengths of rope and a knowing glint in her eye, yours truly would take a shot at being a rope bottom (she does good work, and I would learn). But submission won't be a factor. They're seperate entities that comingle due to similar interests, but they lead their own lives.

 

[Netzach]

I've bottomed and I've submitted, but I'm missing Netzach's idea bottoming has something extra....but then I get tired of the continual competitiveness about just about every BDSM and its derivative topic that seems to be mandatory for some and aims at naming one option as the ultimate and the other as inadequate.

The ensuing multi-page shitfit which this led to would have been avoided had you understood that that post meant "bottming has something extra when I am madly in love with the top that it lacks when I'm not." I'm sure bottoming is completely boring no matter what you do with it to other people. My fault maybe in wording. Honestly, I don't think I was that ambiguous, but this was totally not what was intended. If anything I think most people are in agreement that bottoming with huge emotional investment in your top which may NOT express iteself as submission (hell, I'm Dominant to my Tops most of the time) is different than just showing up at a party play-ready.

 

[Netzach]

Tossing a pair of coppers in (and it's gonna be a ramble)

I have taken to thinking of myself as a Top more often than a Dom these days. I've actually gotten uncomfortable with the nomenclature, as there's so damned much baggage attached to the term, and so fucking many fakes that I really have no desire to associate myself with the term. Additonally, as I am in a M/s dynamic, I can't honestly say that I'm a Dom actively. Dom requires sub to be meaningful in context, and I have none. I own, I do not lease. So, yes, I am Dominant, but I eschew the term Dom when describing myself.

The primary reason, however, is simple math. To 99.99999%+ of the people on this planet, the only meaningful way that I will interact with them is by Topping. That's it. I may be a fuck-all Domly Top, but I'm not interested in Serial Dominance, nor am I particularly looking for a second submissive (Rope bunnies are encouraged to contact me, of course). So if I am going to be a Top towards the overwhelming majority of people with which I will interact in a BDSM milieu, why identify myself as other than a Top for interactions with them?

The long and short of is that I do not see bottoming and submitting to be mutually exclusive, but I also do not see them inextricably joined. Plot a Venn Diagram and there's a hell of a lot of overlap, but neither encompasses the other fully. The same could be said for Top/Dom. A diagram would show overlap but not a complete subsumption.

Part of the problem is that, wow, they look similar to outside observers generally. And, yeah, they are. The difference between the two lies in the minds and hearts of the participants. For example, last week I tied a lovely young lady at a party. One of the finest scenes I've had the pleasure of undertaking. It was a T/b dynamic, but an observant onlooker would have seen numerous signs of submission-style behaviour on her, and Domly behaviour on mine. Was a tone of D/s there? Sure there was. I'm a Dominant guy, and she has a submissive side. There's going to be D/s overtones when emotions run high. Was it a D/s scene? Hell no. T/b only. She did not submit to me, even for the time of the scene, and I was not interested in that.

Yes, we've all seen the temporary contracts allowing for time-limited submission for the length of scene. I consider that to be utter claptrap. You're going to spend more time dickering about and fiddling with the contract than you are scening. *yawn* Colour me uninterested. Yes, this girl and I talked at length before the scene, but the negotiations consisted of me telling her "I am going to touch you. You realise that, right? No, really, I'm going to touch you. Everywhere.", and her putting the limit of keeping her underwear on. That, and the understanding was there that we were limiting our actions to rope and wax as well, was the extent of negotiations. Why? Because it didn't need more. I was Topping her, nothing else.

D/s requires more emotional investment than T/b. Though I'll disagree with the folks that say that it requires more mental investment as well. Nope, T/b can drain you mentally just as bad. And connection? Pfft. I've felt connections with people that were bottoming to me that were vastly more solid than the connection I've felt with someone that claimed to be submitting (temporarily). There's no magical connection that happens as soon the "s" part comes into play. connection forms because of the relationship, and the bond you feel, and you can get that in T/b too. The primary difference here is that most folks seem to do T/b in limited engagements, compared to D/s, so the relationships don't have the time to form the really solid bonds..

And, at the end of the day, were Netzach (to choose an example that everyone can understand) to show up with a coupla lengths of rope and a knowing glint in her eye, yours truly would take a shot at being a rope bottom (she does good work, and I would learn). But submission won't be a factor. They're seperate entities that comingle due to similar interests, but they lead their own lives.

Honestly I don't know what the fuck to do with the nomenclature these days. I obviously am a pushy broad who naturally likes the pants in some contexts, tractable and easy in others, really not going out of my way to submit to anyone, but I'd probably rope bunny for a dude like you any day of the week, and then there's the rare person whom I don't mind bossing me around but even then it's not un style de vie.

My Mr. Right is always going to defer to me anyway, so of course I haven't "met the right Dom" yet, that speculation is downright silly. The bulk of my fantasies, interests, and activities are ones in which I'm Dominant, and I don't think it's like the old joke "suck ONE cock and..."

 

[Netzach]

I'm not sure what you're saying..what do you think bottoming is? And are you saying it's exclusive to the gay community..or? S&M doesn't have to involve sex either..

I'm actually jealous as all get out of my leatherdyke friends who don't have a "what is a MASTER versus a mere Top" argument all the time. People are tops or bottoms, some have 24/7 power trips and some don't. No big whoop.

 

[DeservingBitch]

Le sigh. Once again, the point of one of my posts has been totally missed. I don't care about you people's subbier-than-thou pissing contests. I was just asking a damn question. Are the two mutually exclusive of one another? If yes, why, and if no, why not? We don't have to have the equivalent of a "whose got the biggest dick" contest every damn time a question is asked.

To me, so far, they've been. I've bottomed. I've topped. But I've never been in a D/s relationship, either as a Dom or sub. And right now, I don't want a D/s relationship either.

That may well change tomorrow morning when I go get my croissant&coffee and meet a girl that would get the Dominant (or sub, who knows) out of me. But so far, I haven't met anybody who inspired that feeling or desire.

I do think they were certain elements of remnants of D/s in some of my scenes, in a 'sanitized' kind of way.

And I've got a pretty big fat dick. So here.

 

[Homburg]

Honestly I don't know what the fuck to do with the nomenclature these days. I obviously am a pushy broad who naturally likes the pants in some contexts, tractable and easy in others, really not going out of my way to submit to anyone, but I'd probably rope bunny for a dude like you any day of the week, and then there's the rare person whom I don't mind bossing me around but even then it's not un style de vie.

Exactly. I'm getting tired of the attitudes and sweating it. Do you do as I tell you to do? Great! Do you not? Well, that's okay too. Just becaus eI have one person that defers to me 24/7 doesn't mean I'm somehow cooler than anyone else.

(Thank you for the return on the rope bunny comment. *bows* )

(Quoting the second post here as well.)

I'm actually jealous as all get out of my leatherdyke friends who don't have a "what is a MASTER versus a mere Top" argument all the time. People are tops or bottoms, some have 24/7 power trips and some don't. No big whoop.

The nomenclature has become a sticking point for me. I'm getting to the point where T/b is the only valid terminology that I want to use. To sort of parallel a line of reasoning in JMohegan's post, D/s is entirely personal, and only functions within the confines of an actual relationship. T/b is more mobile, more flexible, and more relevant.

So, yes, I have to agree with you. I envy that side of BDSM, as they don't seem to worry about it anywhere near as much.

 

[nh23]

I'm actually jealous as all get out of my leatherdyke friends who don't have a "what is a MASTER versus a mere Top" argument all the time. People are tops or bottoms, some have 24/7 power trips and some don't. No big whoop.

Lol.. I honestly just had no idea what she was saying in her post. That was the reason I asked. I thought maybe if I got some sleep and then read it I would get it..but no... I still don't. Maybe I'm just dense..

 

[Homburg]

Lol.. I honestly just had no idea what she was saying in her post. That was the reason I asked. I thought maybe if I got some sleep and then read it I would get it..but no... I still don't. Maybe I'm just dense..

I'm not speaking for unfounddiamond, but I think her comment was on the wording itself. "Top" and "bottom" have a different meaning in the gay community at large*. Yes, when discussing S&M they mean the same thing, but if you read a "M seeking M" personal ad looking for a top, they're not necessarily looking for a beating.

Part of the weirdness is because a number of the terms we use originated in the Leather community. The Scene absorbed the words, and changed them to a point, and it can cause some cognitive dissonance for someone used to those terms in different context.

NOTE: I'm not an expert on Leather or the personal ads of gay men. I am simply explaining how it was explained to me by someone involved in those communities. And by adding this note, I'm not trying to distance myself from either. I am simply providing full disclosure that I am holding forth on a topic that I do not have personal experience with. I offer this information because it helped me understand, and I think it might help you too.

 

[nh23]

I'm not speaking for unfounddiamond, but I think her comment was on the wording itself. "Top" and "bottom" have a different meaning in the gay community at large*. Yes, when discussing S&M they mean the same thing, but if you read a "M seeking M" personal ad looking for a top, they're not necessarily looking for a beating.

Part of the weirdness is because a number of the terms we use originated in the Leather community. The Scene absorbed the words, and changed them to a point, and it can cause some cognitive dissonance for someone used to those terms in different context.

NOTE: I'm not an expert on Leather or the personal ads of gay men. I am simply explaining how it was explained to me by someone involved in those communities. And by adding this note, I'm not trying to distance myself from either. I am simply providing full disclosure that I am holding forth on a topic that I do not have personal experience with. I offer this information because it helped me understand, and I think it might help you too.

Ah, yeah that helps. I was a little lost there...lol Thanks

 

[Homburg]

Ah, yeah that helps. I was a little lost there...lol Thanks

No sweat. To those who are actually personally familiar with the Leather and Gay communites, if I dorked up the explanations, please accept my apologies and correct as needed. As I said, I am simply explaining it as it was explained to me by a gay bottom (in both senses of the term) friend of mine.

 

[catalina_francisco]

The ensuing multi-page shitfit which this led to would have been avoided had you understood that that post meant "bottming has something extra when I am madly in love with the top that it lacks when I'm not." I'm sure bottoming is completely boring no matter what you do with it to other people. My fault maybe in wording. Honestly, I don't think I was that ambiguous, but this was totally not what was intended. If anything I think most people are in agreement that bottoming with huge emotional investment in your top which may NOT express iteself as submission (hell, I'm Dominant to my Tops most of the time) is different than just showing up at a party play-ready.

Sorry Netz, I am not a mind reader, and as we all know, it gets just as dangerous in these parts to assume the rest of an untyped sentence as it does to react to exactly what is typed. I do stand by what I said about the competitiveness that goes on around here, and it was not aimed at you, but when I see multiple discussions taking place (and not always involving me) where one POV is given and then someone or others disagree it is the only option and present another reality only to be continually told over and over they are living in fantasy land and their reality is not real by the ones who do not share that reality, then those same people posting innuendos of the same patronising message (several times, not isolated) of 'my truth is the only truth and the rest are dreaming' in various other threads which had nothing to do with the original, well then yes, I call it competitive BS that has no part here, especially when based on the beliefs of people who admit they have little or no actual experience.

As you know, I have long admired you and agree with much of what you have to say. I apologise for any misunderstanding with you and hope you accept it. I am not alone in avoiding spending as much time here as I used to because of the BS that has been going on from time to time. I don't know how people expect to learn and expand their views/ideas/experiences if they cannot and will not accept and respect others have different realities and experiences than their own which are just as real. Hopefully it will take a change for the better again soon as so often happens with these cycles. Sorry for the hijack again BB but just saw this after being offline all day.

Catalina

 

[catalina_francisco]

Tossing a pair of coppers in (and it's gonna be a ramble)

I have taken to thinking of myself as a Top more often than a Dom these days. I've actually gotten uncomfortable with the nomenclature, as there's so damned much baggage attached to the term, and so fucking many fakes that I really have no desire to associate myself with the term. Additonally, as I am in a M/s dynamic, I can't honestly say that I'm a Dom actively. Dom requires sub to be meaningful in context, and I have none. I own, I do not lease. So, yes, I am Dominant, but I eschew the term Dom when describing myself.

The primary reason, however, is simple math. To 99.99999%+ of the people on this planet, the only meaningful way that I will interact with them is by Topping. That's it. I may be a fuck-all Domly Top, but I'm not interested in Serial Dominance, nor am I particularly looking for a second submissive (Rope bunnies are encouraged to contact me, of course). So if I am going to be a Top towards the overwhelming majority of people with which I will interact in a BDSM milieu, why identify myself as other than a Top for interactions with them?

The long and short of is that I do not see bottoming and submitting to be mutually exclusive, but I also do not see them inextricably joined. Plot a Venn Diagram and there's a hell of a lot of overlap, but neither encompasses the other fully. The same could be said for Top/Dom. A diagram would show overlap but not a complete subsumption.

Part of the problem is that, wow, they look similar to outside observers generally. And, yeah, they are. The difference between the two lies in the minds and hearts of the participants. For example, last week I tied a lovely young lady at a party. One of the finest scenes I've had the pleasure of undertaking. It was a T/b dynamic, but an observant onlooker would have seen numerous signs of submission-style behaviour on her, and Domly behaviour on mine. Was a tone of D/s there? Sure there was. I'm a Dominant guy, and she has a submissive side. There's going to be D/s overtones when emotions run high. Was it a D/s scene? Hell no. T/b only. She did not submit to me, even for the time of the scene, and I was not interested in that.

Yes, we've all seen the temporary contracts allowing for time-limited submission for the length of scene. I consider that to be utter claptrap. You're going to spend more time dickering about and fiddling with the contract than you are scening. *yawn* Colour me uninterested. Yes, this girl and I talked at length before the scene, but the negotiations consisted of me telling her "I am going to touch you. You realise that, right? No, really, I'm going to touch you. Everywhere.", and her putting the limit of keeping her underwear on. That, and the understanding was there that we were limiting our actions to rope and wax as well, was the extent of negotiations. Why? Because it didn't need more. I was Topping her, nothing else.

D/s requires more emotional investment than T/b. Though I'll disagree with the folks that say that it requires more mental investment as well. Nope, T/b can drain you mentally just as bad. And connection? Pfft. I've felt connections with people that were bottoming to me that were vastly more solid than the connection I've felt with someone that claimed to be submitting (temporarily). There's no magical connection that happens as soon the "s" part comes into play. connection forms because of the relationship, and the bond you feel, and you can get that in T/b too. The primary difference here is that most folks seem to do T/b in limited engagements, compared to D/s, so the relationships don't have the time to form the really solid bonds..

And, at the end of the day, were Netzach (to choose an example that everyone can understand) to show up with a coupla lengths of rope and a knowing glint in her eye, yours truly would take a shot at being a rope bottom (she does good work, and I would learn). But submission won't be a factor. They're seperate entities that comingle due to similar interests, but they lead their own lives.

Great post...and now you know one of the reasons we do not socialise in the community, go to parties, clubs etc....we are happiest being with each other, doing what works for us, and to hell with anyone else trying to stick it into a nice neat box for their own comfort zone. Oh, and I think my reclusive nature has invaded his brain and body.

Catalina

 

[sexycaz22]

I have a regular play partner I see occasionally, maybe once a month, maybe more, for spankings and floggings, maybe more, it depends on what mood we both are in.

In this scene, I would say that I am bottoming to him, and him Topping me. We are not in a relationship, and I don't feel that I am submitting to him, because the last time I played with him, I actually directed him to flog my upper back *ahhh, lovely.......dreaming.....* ops...back to the disussion..

So, in this instance, I am bottoming to him. However, I do have a special bond with him, we talk online, he helps me out with other guys, he gives me advice on other guys or things. He is a great gentleman and very gentle, but when it comes to play...very evil!

I feel that I could not bottom to a stranger, personally, I prefer to get to know them first, building up a friendship with them, and then we would organise a play session where we would be a bottom/Top, nothing more. But still, the bond would be there.

For me, my views are similar to Nh's, with regarding to a D/s relationship, you have to be in a relationship, to have soul and mind in the relationship, to have heart and love in the relationship and to have a D/s or M/s dynamic in the relationship, then both parties would be a submissive and a Dominant.

But this is only my view at the moment - in the future, who knows? My views might change, but that's what is wonderful, because when I first did my play scene with my play partner, I actually thought I was submitting to him, but then I read some more on what bottoming and Topping meant, and I came to realise that TO ME, bottoming and Topping is what we do in that play scene.

One day, I might be submitting to him (although I don't think it will happen) but for now, I am enjoying being a bottom and hopefully will be Topping very soon!

 

[BiaTcHiNFiRe]

I have a regular play partner I see occasionally, maybe once a month, maybe more, for spankings and floggings, maybe more, it depends on what mood we both are in.

In this scene, I would say that I am bottoming to him, and him Topping me. We are not in a relationship, and I don't feel that I am submitting to him, because the last time I played with him, I actually directed him to flog my upper back *ahhh, lovely.......dreaming.....* ops...back to the disussion..

So, in this instance, I am bottoming to him. However, I do have a special bond with him, we talk online, he helps me out with other guys, he gives me advice on other guys or things. He is a great gentleman and very gentle, but when it comes to play...very evil!

I feel that I could not bottom to a stranger, personally, I prefer to get to know them first, building up a friendship with them, and then we would organise a play session where we would be a bottom/Top, nothing more. But still, the bond would be there.

For me, my views are similar to Nh's, with regarding to a D/s relationship, you have to be in a relationship, to have soul and mind in the relationship, to have heart and love in the relationship and to have a D/s or M/s dynamic in the relationship, then both parties would be a submissive and a Dominant.

But this is only my view at the moment - in the future, who knows? My views might change, but that's what is wonderful, because when I first did my play scene with my play partner, I actually thought I was submitting to him, but then I read some more on what bottoming and Topping meant, and I came to realise that TO ME, bottoming and Topping is what we do in that play scene.

One day, I might be submitting to him (although I don't think it will happen) but for now, I am enjoying being a bottom and hopefully will be Topping very soon!

Very nice said Catz and I must say it explain lots of things to me. I was always thinking how you can just "play" with this guy and then proclaim you are no one's sub. Now I understand, I really didn't know what bottoming was. Now I know!! (geez I need to start study more about BDSM again )

Anyways, for me "Bottoming" is still something I would unlikely go for. I do not judge those who does this and have fun with it! For me this is the same thing as Poly relationships really. I cannot do anything sexual without feeling something to the person who would touch my body and since I see every lil touch as sexual *chuckles* it's something I couldn't do. I need the conection and the bound wich is between Dom and sub, the kind of conection I have with my Sir. With him I could enjoy anything everything, but with someone else? nuthing at all.

I dunno let someone "just" kiss me or "just" touch me or "just" spank me, I dunno this, never did and never will I think. My ex knows this very well and I must say I always hated it lol. He can touch and kiss and sleep with damn anyone, just like that and then come to me saying it was no big deal LOL. Well for me it is "big deal", guess thats why me and him could never work it out. If I had the poly mindset as Bunny or nh23 I would be maybe still by his side, but for me he was too sharing. Sharing things about him I need and expect to stay just between me and him, so I had to go. He dunno be just with one woman-I dunno be with someone for who one is not enough.

I am glad my Sir is not into sharing either cuz I really need someone for who I'll be enough and all he needs and want to be happy and satisfied. I am happy I've found it.

 

[AvaAdore]

I think if this thread has taught us anything is that bottoming and submission are completely subjective.

In the end, people are just arguing about semantics.

 

[BiBunny]

I think if this thread has taught us anything is that bottoming and submission are completely subjective.

In the end, people are just arguing about semantics.

You're welcome.

 

[unfoundiamond]

Ha!

I wasn't being mean in what I was saying about (Tops and) Bottoms, Here's some insight...

I am a Top in the GLBT community... I learned that as a teen growing up and identifying as transgendered...

Its complicated, but my veiws come from many gay and lesbian men and women who told me about themselves, (What they where, Top or Bottom and why, what's it means... how to tell who is what... they didn't tell me what to do, just told me ABOUT it, I came up with my own conclusions about my behavior)

This was the first thing that made me realize I enjoy control and dominance... being around these people helped me to see who and what I am, I could never thank those people enough, as being me and figuring out who I am has been the most challenging quest of my life.

And even Hom said there is a link between Leathermen and "Top and bottom"... and the leatherman which are gay make up A LOT of the total Leatherman population, FYI... its not about me saying there aren't straight men who are Tops and bottoms, its about everyone realizing this isn't some new or het phenomenon, it has been being used somewhere else... for a LONG time,

I am aware of it... so... I mentioned it.

Why do people assume all these things from what I say. I hate when people project their shit on what I say. Just a bit of advice, Read my words, I have thought them out, bulit and designed these paragraphs... its not a accident, or a whim, and if you have a question, ask... but really read, and understand, first.

Bottoms are great, why would anyone say I was saying something negative about them? Its beyond me...