Intelligent Stories that don’t insult you

[holliday1960]

You'd have to read mine to know whether they are believable. I don't recommend it, though. I don't think I'm a very good writer yet.

You stop that, right now, WW!!! You wouldn't still be on Lit if you weren't a good writer. You wouldn't still be fighting to become a BETTER writer. Somewhere in the back of my mind, I think I HAVE read your work. But, just to be sure, I'll take that challenge and go read now. I have a few minutes while I'm cooking, so... But the deal is, I don't wanna hear you putting down your work, EVER AGAIN. No matter what... you keep writing!!!

 

[yowser]

You could hardly go wrong with any one of Sam Scibble's pieces. Spare, elegant, tightly constructed, subtle, sweet.

 

[theWollstonecraftWoman]

You stop that, right now, WW!!! You wouldn't still be on Lit if you weren't a good writer. You wouldn't still be fighting to become a BETTER writer. Somewhere in the back of my mind, I think I HAVE read your work. But, just to be sure, I'll take that challenge and go read now. I have a few minutes while I'm cooking, so... But the deal is, I don't wanna hear you putting down your work, EVER AGAIN. No matter what... you keep writing!!!

Okie Dokey.

 

[pink_silk_glove]

Yes, you've zeroed in exactly on what makes The Story what it is. I think of it as "pure erotica." One of these days I'm going to get my thoughts together to post about "pure erotica." That is, a story where everything contributes to arousal, without the distraction of personality and self reflection.

And people tell me that I'm full of shit when I say that in general the lit readership doesn't like too much plot and development getting in the way of the kinks. :/

 

[djrip]

You'd have to read mine to know whether they are believable. I don't recommend it, though. I don't think I'm a very good writer yet.

But you really capture the essence of bellhoppery.

 

[Euphony]

But you really capture the essence of bellhoppery.

They do inspire passion.

 

[holliday1960]

Yep, there are a LOT of great writers on Lit. Yowser, Sam Scribble, Simon Doom, ElectricBlue66, Chloe Tzang, SrPlt/KeithD, Altissimus, (the list goes on and on...) And on another note, using the term 'believeable' when referring to fictional stories is... questionable? It's fiction. That's why there's a division between fiction and non-fiction. Stories and Characters can be believable while readers still understand that the story and people in it are 'made up'. I can't tell you how many comments I've read about stories that depict men endowed with enormous penis' as being 'unbelievable'. Is that factually unrealistic? Maybe for some, based on their limited life experiences. But for others, it's their truth. It's all subjective. I'm not insulted nor do I feel misled by stories that might require a stretch of the imagination.

 

[TarnishedPenny]

I have a trilogy featuring a sentient, telepathic, shape-shifting, levitating giant octopus. It’s pretty gritty and realistic.

As one episode was for Geek Pride, it has lots of big words in it, like hypotrochoid. Big words make me sound intelligent, right?

Em

I think (and I am sure you already know) that a good writer can make almost anything believable. That’s what separates good ones from lame ones. A poor writer couldn’t make a cup of coffee seem real as written.

Good ones? Take the late Sir Terry Pratchett. His opus series was the Discworld, which:
- Had dozens of sentient species, including humans, vampires, trolls, elves, etc.
- Was set on a disc-like world carried on the backs of four immense elephants and a 10,000 mile long turtle.
- had precious little use for science. Magic was what made the world go round.
- that last includes witches on flying broomsticks and wizards throwing fireballs

And so forth, all totally absurd, but his genius was to make us accept it.

 

[EmilyMiller]

I think (and I am sure you already know) that a good writer can make almost anything believable. That’s what separates good ones from lame ones. A poor writer couldn’t make a cup of coffee seem real as written.

Good ones? Take the late Sir Terry Pratchett. His opus series was the Discworld, which:
- Had dozens of sentient species, including humans, vampires, trolls, elves, etc.
- Was set on a disc-like world carried on the backs of four immense elephants and a 10,000 mile l9mg turtle.
- had precious little use for science. Magic was what made the world go round.
- that last includes witches on flying broomsticks and wizards throwing fireballs

And so forth, all totally absurd, but his genius was to make us accept it.

Never got into Pratchett - tried - gave up. But I totally agree with you. You can write high fantasy in a way that is totally credible and self-consistent (e.g. Tolkien), the same goes for Sci-Fi.

Em

 

[SimonDoom]

And people tell me that I'm full of shit when I say that in general the lit readership doesn't like too much plot and development getting in the way of the kinks. :/

This is one person, so you cannot accurately make any claims "in general" about lit readership based on this person's opinion.

 

[AG31]

It's been a while since I read the book, but I recall thinking that the specifics of O's character, personality, and background were so lacking that I was less interested in her than I would have been otherwise. I also would have enjoyed more introspection and reflection by her on what she was doing, and the tension that it obviously would have caused. It all seemed rather fast and automatic to me.

The author Molly Weatherfield wrote what was basically an updated, Americanized version of Story of O with Carrie's Story, which I thought was more fun. The character in question was a UC Berkeley grad student, so she was intelligent and introspective and far more reflective about her experience.

Happy to talk about The Story of O!
I think what's going on is that Reage is writing about surrender so complete that the MCs interiority is overwhelmed by it. There is nothing else. Now that may or may not appeal to someone reading erotica. But I hope you agree that she does that really well???

 

[mirafrida]

I guess in my own consumption, I don't focus on "intelligent" as much as "interesting."

I feel like with Lit stories, as with most media, there is an awful lot of "boring" out there. Stuff that strikes me as predictable in almost every way. I can pretty much guess what's going to happen, what is going to be said, what the aesthetics will be, what 'twists' are in store, etc.

Of course, "interesting" is surely just as subjective a criteria as "intelligent." There are millions of people who (to pick a random example) apparently find Law and Order spinoffs interesting, IDK.

As for myself personally, there is no one formula to reach interesting, I sort of just know it when I see it. Sometimes it is a work that is truly outlandish and daring and avant-garde. But sometimes it's really rich characters who are treated with loving respect; or some imaginative driving concept I haven't seen done before; or simply a very well constructed plot that delivers suspense and mystery and some surprises, without feeling contrived or thin.

 

[SimonDoom]

Happy to talk about The Story of O!
I think what's going on is that Reage is writing about surrender so complete that the MCs interiority is overwhelmed by it. There is nothing else. Now that may or may not appeal to someone reading erotica. But I hope you agree that she does that really well???

I agree. I think you put that well.

 

[theWollstonecraftWoman]

But you really capture the essence of bellhoppery.

Well, if a guy is going to end up a cuckold, no better time for it happen than the honeymoon, right? Sort of sets him in the road to successful cuckoldry.

 

[AG31]

https://literotica.com/s/the-bridge-over-wilsons-creek

https://literotica.com/s/the-corner-table-at-mickeys-pt-01

https://www.literotica.com/s/art-of-deception

The reason I cited these sentences as a reason why the stories were, for me, not "intelligent," has to do with being "in the moment" (see pink_silk_glove's reply in this thread (I wish we could get links to individual replies):

"There's a phrase that you will see often that goes "takes me out of the moment". Most of the time this is what jars people out of a story and may make someone feel 'talked down to' or insulted that the writer expected them to believe what happened."

When I hit these awkward sounding sentences, it took me "out of the moment."

 

[theWollstonecraftWoman]

View attachment 2272993

The reason I cited these sentences as a reason why the stories were, for me, not "intelligent," has to do with being "in the moment" (see pink_silk_glove's reply in this thread (I wish we could get links to individual replies):

"There's a phrase that you will see often that goes "takes me out of the moment". Most of the time this is what jars people out of a story and may make someone feel 'talked down to' or insulted that the writer expected them to believe what happened."

When I hit these awkward sounding sentences, it took me "out of the moment."

I agree with you, I nodded, would work better. But i wouldn't stop reading on one occurrence of an awkwardly worded sentence.

 

[pink_silk_glove]

This is one person, so you cannot accurately make any claims "in general" about lit readership based on this person's opinion.

True, but I've ran into many many more with the same attitude. You and the vast majority of AH regulars haven't. You're not in the chat.

You see, most of us draw our conclusions on what the readers want based on feedback votes and comments. Well, if you analyze that data it's a very small sample. Let's say that you have a story with 10,000 hits, 100 votes and 12 comments. The folks who comment on your story will tell you that they liked your plot because folks who are into plot are far more inclined to comment. So you write a great plot (because most of us here in the AH are into plot and characters with our smut, that's why we like to talk literary here) and the majority of your comments and feedback is overwhelmingly positive, and based on that you conclude that plot is popular.

What about the other 99% who hit your story and didn't even vote let alone toss you a bouquet? You bored them with your plot. That's what.

The vast majority of the authors on lit barely know that the AH even exists, and they write the bulk of the stroke sheets, let alone the readers who read them. Where do their readers hang out? A good deal of them hang out in chat. I hang out in chat from time to time and I know the mentality, trust me. Now certainly a cross section of chat attitudes can't be considered super accurate parallel to the 99% of the readership who remain anonymous, but it is by far the closest comparison that we have. Let me tell you, they don't like plot. Oh, here and there some appreciate it but by and large, they hate it. They tell me so straight up. They're bored with my plot. "Why can't it just all be sex?" "Loved chapter 3! (hot sex in the bathroom stall), bored with chapter 1 (meeting the cast of characters)" "Boner killer!" Most of the folks in chat have been lurking reading the stories for years until they one day realize that there's a chat, so they wander into chat looking for the exact same smut that they're looking for in the stories. Now there are all kinds in the chat, but there is an overwhelming tendency to get to the fapping and dispense with the buildup. They also tell their personal fantasies and with no exaggeration 98% of them involve a guy literally getting lucky with a unicorn.

Now many of the folks here in AH don't want to hear this as it may damage an ego chuffed on the notion that the masses love them because of their skill on the smut and story sides equally, but I'm telling you, by and large, the anonymous masses are scrolling scrolling scrolling over your carefully crafted plot to get to the action, and if they have to scroll too much or too far, they're hitting the back button.

Am i saying that we shouldn't write plot? Fuck no. I write what I want. I don't pander. Just don't kid yourself if you think that your plot motive and character development is winning over the masses. It's not.

 

[SimonDoom]

I'll just toss out some random stories I can think of that I thought were "intelligent" in one way or another. I think they're intelligent in the sense of giving an interesting twist or perspective on the subject matter or handling it with a smart flair. This is a quick and incomplete list.

KeithD's collaboration with another author under the name Shabbu, The Forever Man, https://www.literotica.com/s/the-forever-man, was a contest-winning story about a gay male relationship that was handled in an adult, intelligent manner. I also have to give a shout out to another story by Keith, the name of which I cannot remember (it might have been under his sr71plt handle), about an affair between an older woman and a young married Amish man on a cruise ship. I smiled the whole time I read the story because I kept thinking, "Who the fuck thinks up a story idea like this?" KeithD is very good with foreign and unusual settings, if you like to read stories that are set in unfamiliar places.

The first story I read by TarnishedPenny was Up, Down, and Away!, https://www.literotica.com/s/up-down-and-away, a female exhibitionist/predicament story based upon an exceptionally clever concept for putting oneself at risk of exposure outdoors. I always enjoy her writing style.

ElectricBlue66's story series Rope and Veil, https://www.literotica.com/s/rope-and-veil, is a sensitive and kinky account of an erotic relationship between a man and a woman in a wheelchair.

LoquiSordidaadme's story Time to Breathe, https://www.literotica.com/s/time-to-breathe, combines elements of the sci fi thriller The Martian with an interesting exploration of the mechanics of no-gravity sex.

Bramblethorn's The Floggings Will Continue, https://www.literotica.com/s/the-floggings-will-continue, works as a fun group sex romp and a wicked satire of corporate culture.

Two authors from the earlier days of Literotica, PacoFear and Dr. Mabeuse, wrote intelligent and insightful erotica with good prose.

Holliday1960's Southern Comfort series, https://www.literotica.com/s/southern-comfort-ch-01, is a gracefully written erotic romance with realistic characters.


If you need a break from "intelligence," I recommend diving into my own story "Mom, You're a Hucow," https://literotica.com/s/mom-youre-a-hucow, which is, well, exactly what it sounds like. It's not too long. Think of it as a much-needed interlude of ginger to wash out the aftertaste of an especially spicy sushi/wasabi combo.

 

[AG31]

I agree with you, I nodded, would work better. But i wouldn't stop reading on one occurrence of an awkwardly worded sentence.

True, but I've developed a feel. It either grips me from the get-go or it doesn't.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

I agree there's a mountain of perfectly competent stories where two American whitebread characters get it on and think they're being amazingly risqué, and I can't remember any of them.

Stories need compelling characters or vivid surroundings to be memorable. KeithD is excellent at the latter, Quince, EarlyMorningLight, joy_of_cooking do the former, BelleCanzuto and Omenainen have managed both (list is non-exhaustive and off the top of my head).

The Romance section often has some of the best characters and telling, if you want that, but getting that combined with particular hot kinks can be difficult if your particular thing is anything rarer than a blow job.

I aspire to both, with some people thinking I manage it, with a bunch of scientists and other geeky characters. Other readers think there's too much story for the amount of hot (I Say Arse..., Educating Laura, Smoking Hot).

My most recent story is apparently 'half legal thriller', 'Swiftian satire' and 'hugely educational', though I only intended it as justification for our FMC to plausibly do a scene and get fucked in front of the judges of the Supreme Court, as you do.

 

[AchtungNight]

I just gotta say a couple things here.

First- a scene where an FMC gets fucked in front of the Supreme Court? Literally and not figuratively? That is daring beyond anything I’d do. And I’ve done some crazy things in my time as a smut writer. [shakes head]

Dr. Mabeuse is another great Lit writer I’d recommend. I remember him from my earlier days here. Doesn’t seem to be around now, but he was good. Same for Aurora Black & Fallingtofly.

I’ve read a little Terry Pratchett. I must confess I’ve never gotten deep into his work. The style turns me off and the characters don’t hold my interest. Maybe he’s before my time. On the other hand, his daughter Rihanna? She wrote the most compelling Tomb Raider video game (and one of the best action games in general) I’ve ever played.

 

[theWollstonecraftWoman]

True, but I've developed a feel. It either grips me from the get-go or it doesn't.

Fare enough. Fair enough? hum which is which? Fair enough, is right. Get-go grap or nada, gotchya.

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

What's really rare on Lit is not just "intelligent" smut, but intellectual smut. All of my stories are intelligent, but I think only one qualifies as intellectual: The Male Gaze.

It's about a smart girl considering the semiotics of the female nude while she's posing naked.

 

[Abbafan]

Yeah, I don't usually care for the stories that play out like a typical porn movie either.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Yes, you've zeroed in exactly on what makes The Story what it is. I think of it as "pure erotica." One of these days I'm going to get my thoughts together to post about "pure erotica." That is, a story where everything contributes to arousal, without the distraction of personality and self reflection.

But personality and self-reflection can be behind the most arousing content, indeed, can make it the most arousing content of all.

You don't need self-reflection necessarily, but for me, content without personality wouldn't get out the gate, it wouldn't be erotic. It wouldn't get close to arousal.

I think my stories arouse readers because of the personalities I create, the intimacy I bring to the pillow. If you took the personalities out of a story, what would you have left? Mechanics? An assembly manual?

As I've written this post, I realise I don't understand what you mean at all. Erotica without personality? I don't think I ever seen an example of that.