U.S. politics isolation tank

[JMohegan]

Here are a couple things I've read today that support my thinking:

Second Term Surprise

Resetting the 'Cliff"

More than anything else, it's my gut feeling that he wants to leave a legacy - and this is not news. It's the core raison d'etre of every second-term president. Clinton wasted immense amounts of energy and capital trying to broker a middle east deal in the last days of his administration. He desperately wanted to be known for something besides a few sloppy blowjobs. They all do.

Interesting that you and Rosco both put up the same link (to the TNR piece) in support of your perspectives.

It pains me to say this, but like Rosco and TG I'm wary. The difference between us is that I was willing to fight for (and vote for) Obama in opposition to Mitt Romney.

Remember this: The President opened "negotiations" on healthcare without even letting single payer be placed on the table! I think he's pragmatic about power-of-the-purse realities, which I get, but not cut out for hardball, which is a lot harder to accept.

 

[intothewoods]

I spent last October at OWS trying to reach out to anyone at all who was 1. interested and 2. not a hipster, NYU student, dirt punk, grad student or professional organizer.

I had a lot of great conversations but nothing to convince me that there's a snowball's chance in hell of any teabag-occupy linkup.

We view the central problem from two completely opposite standpoints. Just because we're all looking in the same direction means little.

Ok, I was being glib. But maybe some tea party outliers? There are some extreme conservatives (not tea party specifics) who are interested in dialogue on various issues. I've met them. But then they go into auto pilot mode. Eh, anyway, we can leave the tea party to themselves I guess.

It's just frustrating that there can't be some middle ground whereby people get that all business isn't exactly the same and untouchable.

Right. It's like suggesting a Planned Parenthood/ Focus on the Family coalition to tackle teen pregnancy rates.

Funnily enough I just read this blog post by a former pro lifer who went through all of the data and could only conclude that pro-life policy does not actually reduce abortions. So now she's pro choice. Facts might save the day! But probably not Focus on the Family. Those people are douchebags.

I find most TV and print journalism too superficial for any real understanding. I prefer book, book, and books.

I highly recommend:

The Web of Debt: The Shocking Truth About Our Money System and How We Can Break Free [Paperback] by Ellen Hodgson Brown

http://www.amazon.com/The-Web-Debt-...=UTF8&colid=JU53U9BSJ17R&coliid=I1ISYOD5CVM7E
Brown has the ability to explain complex economic matters in plain language with no Wall St baggage.


The Price of Inequality: How Today's Divided Society Endangers Our Future [Hardcover]
Joseph E. Stiglitz (Author)
http://www.amazon.com/The-Price-Ine...UTF8&colid=JU53U9BSJ17R&coliid=I1CCO8G5XP6CZE

One of the brightest of economists writing today.

I read a variety of writers but I try to find people who include data/evidence in their writing and explain it in straightforward terms. I wasn't a math major. I'm not a big fan of the study of economics. So I like to find people who break it down and make it accessible, but are faithful to the evidence.

So I guess I'm saying I need superficial -- or at least the cliff notes version. I think this is what the media is supposed to freaking be but it's not.

As there are two Mitt Romeys there are two Paul Ryans, is my understanding. Another "low information voter" snob, that I am, all I saw was the tight-lipped Eddie Munster who was going to save the world but not tell us how... dogged lib friends who actually dug into his budget insist it's insane, but not that it's stupid, stupid in the sense of ranting fantasy irrelevant. It would work - in an abstract world where people don't actually enter into it.

Make of that what you will. They probably put a shock device on him for any time he actually got wonkish in dealing with the public. There WERE no disclosures from the actual plan during the race, you have to dig in and look for deep articles on the damn thing.

Parts of my family are tea people. There IS no front brain to sit down and find common ground with. None.

Do you seriously think any of these people are thinking "you know if there was a dem who had balanced a state budget and cut a lot of fat, and was a gun owner and a hunter all his/her life and is very strong on the second, would you consider voting for him/her ?" as we speak, right now?

I know he was totally tight-lipped during the campaign and everyone was afraid he'd get all wonky. I don't think that helped Mitt at all btw. What you're saying about his budget pre-campaign makes sense actually.

I don't know many tea party people but I do know a few hardcore conservatives who were persuaded to change their mind on a few issues. I think they need a common element to change their mind. Like a fellow Republican, or a Christian, or someone who is all into American exceptionalism or something. I suppose it's the old cliche about Republicans. Like they all support gay rights once their brother comes out or something.

There were some amazing moments there. One night we all sat around the ad hoc union table with steamfitters, longshoremen, teamsters, girl electrician apprentices, a haz mat laborer, a couple old radicals out of retirement who looked like they'd died and gone to heaven, two Rick Perry supporting conservative frat boys from New Orleans and a expatriate diamond miner with false teeth back from Brazil who kept trying to pervily convince me to move out to the backwoods there because "a tall guy like you with a little money would have his pick of teenage poontang".

We were talking politics like crazy.Anyone who had something to say could get a word in.For a magic second or two there, I actually thought that maybe just maybe this thing could have legs. I wish I could describe the feeling, it was like having hold of a political live wire.

Very cool. Well, except for the Brazilian miner. I guess some of the things that kind of inspire me are the interest in history and wonkish detail even if it is totally predigested Glen Beck or something. I feel like there's a distinction between that person and the Rush Limbaugh fan who just yells FEMINAZIS and FAGGOTS.

I think I'm going to name something Feminazis and Faggots. It has a good ring to it.

I don't trust him one bit, not after the offer he made Boehner last summer, which if accepted would have been a historic triumph for the anti new deal right. That's the moment he lost my vote for good and all.

I sure hope you guys are right and I'm wrong.

I'm with you actually on this one. Phew, that optimism was giving me a cramp. I was the same way with Clinton. Low expectations. He shafted progressives a lot during the first term. I mean, not that I was Obama's top volunteer or anything last time around, but still I did much much less this time. But like I said, at the end of the day, I gathered some enthusiasm because I don't want an anti-choice, anti gay marriage guy in the white house. And some other stuff too but this was no 2008.

 

[JMohegan]

But like I said, at the end of the day, I gathered some enthusiasm because I don't want an anti-choice, anti gay marriage guy in the white house. And some other stuff too but this was no 2008.

Ruth Bader Ginsburg will not last this term. That's as good a reason as any I can think of to keep the plutocrat out of the White House.

 

[intothewoods]

Ruth Bader Ginsburg will not last this term. That's as good a reason as any I can think of to keep the plutocrat out of the White House.

HELL YES. I wish Scalia would retire. I actually prefer Clarence Thomas over him. I mean, not in terms of philosophy but the way Scalia doesn't recuse himself and went duck hunting with Cheney and the public statements he makes about cases. There's no respect there.

ETA -- though Clarence Thomas's wife is a loon.

 

[ThorkelGriersen]

<<clip>>So I guess I'm saying I need superficial -- or at least the cliff notes version. I think this is what the media is supposed to freaking be but it's not.

Brown makes it about as simple as possible. Try this article. If you register for the site, you can then follow her and get e-mails for new articles. They come every couple of months and are informative without being complex. Her previous articles are linked at the bottom of the article. Some charts but no complex math!

SEEKING ALPHA ARTICLE: It's The Interest, Stupid! Why Bankers Rule The World November 8, 2012 Ellen Brown

http://seekingalpha.com/article/991631-it-s-the-interest-stupid-why-bankers-rule-the-world

They have multiple e-mail notices. ALL FREE!!!!

 

[intothewoods]

Brown makes it about as simple as possible. Try this article. If you register for the site, you can then follow her and get e-mails for new articles. They come every couple of months and are informative without being complex. Her previous articles are linked at the bottom of the article. Some charts but no complex math!

SEEKING ALPHA ARTICLE: It's The Interest, Stupid! Why Bankers Rule The World November 8, 2012 Ellen Brown

http://seekingalpha.com/article/991631-it-s-the-interest-stupid-why-bankers-rule-the-world

They have multiple e-mail notices. ALL FREE!!!!

Ok, will do!

I went as far as Calculus but just do not enjoy it.

 

[Sir_Winston54]

When I looked at the article it seemed that the reason for shutting down these particular facilities is that they consist of mobile trailers. What kind of different planning would you want them to do? Look around and rent space in undamaged buildings rather than truck in ready-made offices? I'm really curious how you would have solved this problem differently.

The people who are in those trailers are doing logistics. They are not just handing out blankets, they are a critical part of the chain of logistics decisions. There is a bottom-up-top-down nature to all the decision making, very much like the millitary (a lot of people come to the org from the military) - those "head in the sand" people are constantly being informed by people who liaison with the ground situation.

It's not perfect, but I don't know what people expect. Are they all living in Giants stadium? No.

This

FEMA spokesman Carter Langston said that the mobile centers were shuttered and staff moved inland because they were not structurally sound enough to weather the storm, which could put their staff in danger.

“Because these are mobile centers, they were shut down for life safety,” Langston said. “As soon as weather permits tomorrow, they’re going to be back in place [possibly by noon].”

The remaining five sites in the city — in Staten Island, Coney Island, the Rockaways and The Bronx — were also closed or in the process of shutting down.​

is the part that made me go, "WTF?" I understood the closing down of the mobile centers, but my inference from reading this passage in its entirety is that "the remaining five sites [that] were also closed or in the process of shutting down" were *not* insecure and potentially dangerous mobile centers.

That, of course, is outside my unstated but implied opinion that when planning to help survivors of a disaster situation, one should first ensure that the people doing the helping are in a position to endure whatever the results (and/or follow-ups) of that disaster situation may reasonably be, so that they *can* help the survivors.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

It's really tempting to gloat. Some of the smarter ones are remembering that T shirt the nerdy IT guy was wearing about the definition of insanity, but let's face it...
very...
very few.

Yes, it IS tempting to gloat, and I AM gloating, and some of you people are really killing my buzz here with your "concerns" about "national problems" and the fucking over of America with MoneyPower.

We'll see. I heard someone today say that IF the GOP does well in 2014 (which it probably will, given the history of midterms), then it will interrupt any serious soul-searching anyway, and they'll motor toward 2016 with another far right field. I think Jeb would be formidable, but I'm not part of the group that thinks, "well we lost with Dole, and McCain, and Romney, so fuck "moderating.""

Mitt Romney's a typical guy born on third who thinks he hit a triple. Few things piss me off more than his disdain for the 47 percenters.

And Bill O'Reilly & his ilk can choke on those grapes for all I care.

I loved Andy Borowitz' tweet: "BREAKING: Man who told half the nation to fuck themselves somehow loses."

HELL YES. I wish Scalia would retire. I actually prefer Clarence Thomas over him. I mean, not in terms of philosophy but the way Scalia doesn't recuse himself and went duck hunting with Cheney and the public statements he makes about cases. There's no respect there.

ETA -- though Clarence Thomas's wife is a loon.

I have a theory that Clarence Thomas is that comic strip character, Henry. He hasn't talked in, what, 30 years?

And I agree that the SCOTUS appointments may have been the very best reason to be afraid of Mitt. Because can you imagine who he'd have had to appoint to appease his base? Who would have replaced Ruth Bader Ginsburg and tipped the court to permanent right?? Wow. The gift that keeps on giving.

 

[Stella_Omega]

From Daily Kos;

...And as for Citizens United, the Koch Brothers and Sheldon Adelson? Well...

"The billionaire donors I hear are livid," one Republican operative told The Huffington Post. "There is some holy hell to pay. Karl Rove has a lot of explaining to do … I don't know how you tell your donors that we spent $390 million and got nothing."

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

That's a beautiful thought there.

The billionaire donors are livid. Just livid, I say!

Heheh.

 

[Stella_Omega]

From Forbes via esquire via NBC;

From the moment Mitt Romney stepped off stage Tuesday night, having just delivered a brief concession speech he wrote only that evening, the massive infrastructure surrounding his campaign quickly began to disassemble itself.

Aides taking cabs home late that night got rude awakenings when they found the credit cards linked to the campaign no longer worked.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

Maddow: Still great after the fifth time.

 

[Netzach]

Unfortunately I'm with you on this one. I voted Green for Pres and Demo for the rest.

I read a brief that argued that SS and Medicare, Medicaid would be safer with Romney in the White House. If Romney tried to cut them, Nancy Pelosi would kick him in the balls until he puked. The danger will be that Obama will trade off the safety net for a bowl of porridge. The title assertion was that Obamacare should be called Pelosicare.

I like this. This appeals to my pessimistic side perfectly, in a way that actually gives a mechanical breakdown of the breakdown scenario.

I voted D but held my nose - I look at Green voters with the envy that agnostics have for the certainty of atheists. If I were in NYC I'd probaly vote green or write in Lizard People or something. I voted Nader in '92 (he was less tinfoil, I swear) when it was clear we were not getting a republican again.

 

[gypsy*seer]

Maddow: Still great after the fifth time.

OMG! That was great! Love her...forgot to add to the "Favorite People to Follow On Twitter" the other day.

 

[DeepGreenEyes]

OMG! That was great! Love her...forgot to add to the "Favorite People to Follow On Twitter" the other day.

Oh yeah. She's the caterpillar’s kimono.

 

[ThorkelGriersen]

Counting-counting-counting

And it goes on and on and on and on.

For real fun. The Miami ballot. Most other ballots were similar. As our almost felon [I plead Nolo Contendere and paid a $2 BILLION fine, but wasn't judged guilty] Governor* said: << If we can't stop 'em froim voting, we can baffel them with bullshit>>

MIAMI-DADE BALLOT:http://www.miamidade.gov/elections/s_ballots/11-6-12_sb.pdf

*He spent $70 million of his own money and paid campaign workers with $100 American Express Gift Cards to avoid paying withholding taxes, workers comp, etc etc. Illegal, actually, but never prosecuted. White collar crime is so much fun.

 

[Scentofawoman]

The Republican Party

"If I hide long enough things are bound to change"

 

[midwestyankee]

A roundup of stupid:

Incredibly Bad Election Predictions

 

[ThorkelGriersen]

The Best laid plans................

BOSTON GLOBE
Mitt Romney had planned to celebrate his election as the nation’s 45th president with an eight-minute fireworks display over Boston Harbor.

The same company that does some of the illuminations for Boston’s Fourth of July celebration was poised to ignite fireworks within view of Romney’s party at the Boston Convention & Exhibition Center to celebrate a win over President Obama.

http://www.boston.com/politicalinte...ection-loss/qmgtVKPq4zNnDyb9FbLWeJ/story.html

 

[ThorkelGriersen]

A roundup of stupid:

Incredibly Bad Election Predictions

Funny!

Someone did a fake Craig's list ad offering custom White House Drapes for sale cheap. Call Ann Romney @ XXX-XXX-XXXX.

 

[Netzach]

And it goes on and on and on and on.

For real fun. The Miami ballot. Most other ballots were similar. As our almost felon [I plead Nolo Contendere and paid a $2 BILLION fine, but wasn't judged guilty] Governor* said: << If we can't stop 'em froim voting, we can baffel them with bullshit>>

MIAMI-DADE BALLOT:http://www.miamidade.gov/elections/s_ballots/11-6-12_sb.pdf

*He spent $70 million of his own money and paid campaign workers with $100 American Express Gift Cards to avoid paying withholding taxes, workers comp, etc etc. Illegal, actually, but never prosecuted. White collar crime is so much fun.

WTF florida constitution. They need to make that crap harder to amend or something or limit the number of amendments per election. Does the state constitution really deal with tax breaks for injured vets? That seems so "state legislature" a thing. Insane.

 

[Stella_Omega]

And also (I know I'm posting a lot of graphics, but a picture is worth etc and I'm so fucking tired of writing the words);

 

[Sir_Winston54]

WTF florida constitution. They need to make that crap harder to amend or something or limit the number of amendments per election. Does the state constitution really deal with tax breaks for injured vets? That seems so "state legislature" a thing. Insane.

Yeah, taxes in Florida are a (state) constitutional issue, so substantive changes in taxation have to be made via amendment. PITA.

 

[Netzach]

Yeah, taxes in Florida are a (state) constitutional issue, so substantive changes in taxation have to be made via amendment. PITA.

Craziness, I'm learning more and more. So what's the point of having reps? I know a lot of people are probably wondering, ha!

 

[ThorkelGriersen]

Craziness, I'm learning more and more. So what's the point of having reps? I know a lot of people are probably wondering, ha!

Actually, these amendments were just a smoke screen to throw a monkey wrench into the election. Of course, many were in full pander to nut groups. The "religious freedom" amendment would have allowed the state to use taxes to support churches.

After the election, a local TV station aired did a report from before the election where they went to a food court and gave copies of the ballot to people to see how long it took them to vote. The average was over 30 minutes just to mark the ballot.

When the polls were supposed to close at 7PM there were 800 people in line at a Brickell Ave polling station. Some had already been on line for 5-7 hours.

Each voter has to show his picture ID, which is scanned [2 scanners per poll] into the computer, a receipt is issued and the voter proceeds to the printer [2] where his ballot is printed out. She then goes to a "Marking station" and marks the ballot (front and back pages). He then proceeds to a ballot scanner [1]. She is given a sticker to show that she voted. Actually, I left out the bits about the additional receipts that are printed on preforations on the ballot.

So the voters on Brickell Ave didn't finish until between 1 and 2 AM. In case anyone doesn't know Miami, it is the southern version of Park Ave. When Madonna moved to London, she sold her Brickell digs for $26 million. Imagine what it was like in the 'hood.