What is a fake Dominant?

[Betticus]

Lunar Kitten: Fake tops just don't care what you like. They only care about what they really like to do, and that they are going to get off on it in the end, regardless of if you do or not.

you are defining a 'sensitive guy' (by implication that is: you're directly defining an 'insensitive guy'). are you perhaps writing a book called 'real tops cuddle a lot'?

---
i hear ya, marquis!

Hey! I love to cuddle!

 

[Ebonyfire]

so very true.
i think that the ones out there that are wanting a slave to go out and bust their ass all day, and come home on payday, only to hand the "so called mistress" their money... those to me need to get a life. they are too lazy to get out and get a job, so they have someone else bring home the money so they can spend it.

That is an assumption that may or may not be true. After all, in the good old days they used to call that woman a "housewife". LOL

 

[pink]

It seems that almost as soon as you hear about the existence of Dominant's you hear about the existence of their supposed doppelgangers.

From the self appointed watchdogs of Internet messageboards like this one to books like John Warren's The Loving Dominant, newbie subs are warned of the dangers of succumbing to the false Dominant.

It's been used to explain why female subs on sites like collarme get a few hundred messages a day and male Dominants are lucky to receive any messages at all. It's been used to explain the plethora of hurt, broken and abused subs and it's been used to elevate a select few (often fraternal groups) Dominants to god-like status.

But what power does a Dom have other than that which is surrendered to him?

Doesn't a "fake" Dom automatically become a "real" Dom when he has a submissive at his feet?

No, having a sub at your feet does not make you a 'real' Dom. There are so many wannabes out there.

To me, the definition of a real Dom is a Dom who makes the welfare and happiness of his sub his top priority. The decisions he makes are in the absolute best interest of his sub, not himself.

 

[Betticus]

i hear you amre. but i don't play of that issue to the extent of 'sub benefits' (self assessed) for i don't think a dom-- or even a husband, for heavens sake--needs to serve as a therapist.

--
i hear you hks. but i wouldn't put that fellow's acts into a frame of psychotherapeutic malpractice or negligence. he was not the professional, and you the client.

he was an adult, as were you; if you're mistreated (in your view), it's up to you to leave. although i think 'made me feel like trash' sometimes has something to it, a deeper look often shows that the person felt that way to begin with, and the bad guy, more exactly, capitalized on it. i don't mean to say i lack sympathy with you for what happened.

You are killing me today.

 

[Betticus]

No, having a sub at your feet does not make you a 'real' Dom. There are so many wannabes out there.

To me, the definition of a real Dom is a Dom who makes the welfare and happiness of his sub his top priority. The decisions he makes are in the absolute best interest of his sub, not himself.

Now you are killing me inside too!

 

[Betticus]

That is an assumption that may or may not be true. After all, in the good old days they used to call that woman a "housewife". LOL

I think that today that man is called a "pimp".

 

[Ebonyfire]

I think that today that man is called a "pimp".

I was thinking more along the lines that back in the day, housewives were thought not to do much, but watch soap operas and eat bon bons all day.

Eb

 

[Betticus]

I was thinking more along the lines that back in the day, housewives were thought not to do much, but watch soap operas and eat bon bons all day.

Eb

And I thought that they were very busy running the home, budgeting, shopping, cleaning, cooking, doing the laundry, raising the children, gardening and catering to the social needs of their peer group. Then on top of that being a wife.

 

[Ebonyfire]

And I thought that they were very busy running the home, budgeting, shopping, cleaning, cooking, doing the laundry, raising the children, gardening and catering to the social needs of their peer group. Then on top of that being a wife.

That was only until they filed for divorce, lol. I would say that an old time husband was the epitome of "fake" Dom.

Eb

 

[Betticus]

That was only until they filed for divorce, lol. I would say that an old time husband was the epitome of "fake" Dom.

Eb

Yeah, Ward Cleaver didn't even know what was going on most of the time. His kids were whiny brats with no common sense. The boy was delusional.

And Dammit, I do therapy too! That's been bugging me and I have to get it off my chest. Just bear with me for a moment or two here. If you are in a relationship with someone (at least for me), I'm in a relationship with someone even before that relationship begins I'm already analyzing her. Figuring her out. Gaining her trust. In time I will know her probably better than I know myself. I know her history, her thoughts, her dreams, the events that shaped her personality. Then I get inside her head and start to change things around, partially for her own good but also for my own satisfaction and enjoyment. So it's not traditional "therapy", it's a lot closer.

I could go on and on with all the nuances of it and how it all ties into the physical parts of the relationship but I think you get the point.

 

[pellso27]

Fake DOM

I am a "Fake DOM" and I love it!

 

[catalina_francisco]

Hmm, I get nervous when people begin to play therapist with nothing as far as experience and training to back up what they see as rearranging who a person is and feeling it is better. Even with training and experience, it is not an easy thing to pull off, and certainly is not coming from a place where the therapist decides they know the person better than themselves or that person does. Of course, if you read the sites, a lot promote this idea that a good Dom/me knows their submissive to that extent and is better than any therapist...unfortunately, it is not something which is usually based on fact as much as ego boosting.

Catalina

 

[pink]

Now you are killing me inside too!

AWWWWWW i'm sorry i killed you.

 

[Anopheles]

This is a good question, and there have been a lot of good information shared. My take:


A "fake" Dom is predatory in nature. A sure sign that a Dom is either very,very inexperienced and doesn't need the responsibility of taking on a submissive yet, or just a HNG (horny net geek) looking for some cheap thrills are the ones that are those that demand complete respect and obedience of someone else that they don't even know, and also typically don't do much in the way of asking the SUBMISSIVE what they are looking for. A real Dom knows that in the early goings of the a power exchange relationship, what happens is driven as much or more by the submissive's needs and desires than the Dominants. A real Dom respects and understands this. A fake one doesn't even get it.

How can you know if you even want that person as your submissive after 15 seconds on Yahoo Messenger?

Note: I am talking more specifically about online domination, or at least online BDSM matchmaking, because in real life, any reputable BDSM organization shuns or will not allow people that try this type of behavior at a mixer, event, or function. This sort of behavior is rampant on all of the major BDSM related sites though.

Responsible life-style Dominants do not approach and deal with people in this nature.

There is a significant exception that should be mentioned. If someone is looking for a pure, for-pay, professional BDSM experience, then these rules need not apply. There are no emotions attached to this affair anyway, just an exchange of money for services, hopefully with no hidden strings attached. Those that call being Dominant a life-style, or a personality trait, sometimes label Dom/Dommes that do this "fake" or "pro", but not in a bad way, they are accepted as the characters that they portray to clients.

Hope this adds something to the discussion
--Anopheles

 

[Betticus]

Hmm, I get nervous when people begin to play therapist with nothing as far as experience and training to back up what they see as rearranging who a person is and feeling it is better. Even with training and experience, it is not an easy thing to pull off, and certainly is not coming from a place where the therapist decides they know the person better than themselves or that person does. Of course, if you read the sites, a lot promote this idea that a good Dom/me knows their submissive to that extent and is better than any therapist...unfortunately, it is not something which is usually based on fact as much as ego boosting.

Catalina

Before you pin me as evil and twisted I mean something more along the lines of helping her get over things like feeling guilty for past abuse, finding the reasons for destructive habits and seeing them for what they are and having her see me as a bit of stability that she can rely on.

I get the feeling that you are pissed off at me about something and have been for a few weeks.

 

[catalina_francisco]

Before you pin me as evil and twisted I mean something more along the lines of helping her get over things like feeling guilty for past abuse, finding the reasons for destructive habits and seeing them for what they are and having her see me as a bit of stability that she can rely on.

I get the feeling that you are pissed off at me about something and have been for a few weeks.

No, though I am getting the feel you are pissed at someone here. I have expressed this same view before here because as a therapist myself it does make me nervous. It is not about seeing you as evil, and what you say you do can be good and productive, but unless the sub can independently adopt this view of their experience, and that usually comes from them doing the necessary work to reach that point themselves, the outcome will only be surface and lasting as long as you are around and part of their life. Once you remove that prop, the old feelings resurface, along with a few new ones developed from your removal from their life and their inability to accept that or understand it or cope with it because they relised on you for their new outlook. You speak of her seeing you as stability she can count on...this is what I mean. You are not altering her thought patterns in relation to past abuse, or giving her strength, you are substituting it with dependency on you and crippling her...she needs to feel good about herself independent of you or anyone else, and her stability has to come from within her, not a dependency on you or anyone or anything else to provide it.

Catalina

 

[JMohegan]

But what power does a Dom have other than that which is surrendered to him?

Within the bounds of consent, none.

Doesn't a "fake" Dom automatically become a "real" Dom when he has a submissive at his feet?

Yes. Which is why I believe the focus on real vs. fake Dom/mes, though perhaps well-intentioned, is not only semantically inappropriate but also misplaced.

If the goal is to protect the vulnerable, a far more useful discussion centers around the wants and needs of submissives, appropriate ways to communicate these needs upfront, and ways to predict the likelihood of these being met in a D/s relationship with a particular Dom/me.

Please note that I am not suggesting we flip the dynamic here. I am talking about needs and wants being met in the overall relationship, not in the moment.

Call me needy but i want a little something too, a guy tried to be my Dom once and he was all about the "oral servitde" which would have been fine had there been a simple kiss, a nice stroke or some form of acknowlagement or thanks, but he barely ever touched me and slowly that was driving me nuts in a not good way. I got out of that for mental health reasons. Sort of the diference between being a sub and being gullible, i guess.

He wants oral servitude and is uninterested in providing affection. You want to receive affection as part of your service.

These facts do not mean that he is a fake Dom or that you are a fake sub. Taken together, they mean one thing and one thing only. As you discovered, the two of you are poorly matched.

 

[Ebonyfire]

Of course, if you read the sites, a lot promote this idea that a good Dom/me knows their submissive to that extent and is better than any therapist...unfortunately, it is not something which is usually based on fact as much as ego boosting.

Catalina

Quite frankly I do not want a submissive who needs counselling or a therapist. I am not in the therapy business.

Eb

 

[Marquis]

Quite frankly I do not want a submissive who needs counselling or a therapist. I am not in the therapy business.

Eb

I don't mind a submissive who needs a therapist, as long as she sees one.

 

[Thrall_67]

Forgive me young apprentice.... I couldn't resist...

ah, Marquis, you adorable little Narcissist.

i have a question.......

Does a "fake" stud become a "real" stud because he has a picture of a pretty girl in his avatar?????

 

[Marquis]

ah, Marquis, you adorable little Narcissist.

i have a question.......

Does a "fake" stud become a "real" stud because he has a picture of a pretty girl in his avatar?????

No. But pictures like this help.

 

[MechaBlade]

A dom(me) only has to 1. Command a sub and 2. Enjoy dominating. And the first one isn't really necessary.

The only way to be a "fake" dom is to not enjoy domination when a sub is under your command.

All of you guys are just referring to asshole doms, unsafe doms and selfish doms.

No. But pictures like this help.

Son of a bitch, Marquis.

That's so hot.

 

[Thrall_67]

Perception..........

Cutey.......
A picture conveys a thousand words.......
IMO - a "real" Dom does not ever have to shout from the rooftops that He(or She) is a "real" Dom (or post 80 pics of Himself in a manly/domly pose, pics of having sex with various females, or pictures of subs holding signs to prove that He is a Dom). His presence alone conveys this either, such as in this on-line forum with His writing, or in r/l with the very manner in which He conducts Himself.

This reminds me of the guys in locker rooms that brag of banging the cheerleading squad all night long in every Kama Sutra postion they have read about on the internet ............... it becomes obvious to anyone that is within earshot of this tale that they actually spent the night with one hand on the keyboard and one hand banging the love stick.........it's the quiet guy in the corner of the locker room that, when asked how His night was, He simply simles that knowing smile.....

There are many "real" Doms on this forum (IMO), some like Evil Geoff, RJMasters, DVS, Adante - to name only a few whose presence shines through in their ideals and writing.

i have met oh, so many "Doms" at play parties, BDSM groups etc that spend alot of time trying to convince me they are "real" Doms...... and i believe.....as a sub..... if They are "real" ..... then i will simply fall to Their feet (with Their permission of course) without the need for convincing ......... it's because i am a sub ........ They will bring out the slave fires in my belly and i will become putty in Their hands ..............

No disrespect intended Marquis ............ but You did ask the question ........

 

[catalina_francisco]

Cutey.......
A picture conveys a thousand words.......
IMO - a "real" Dom does not ever have to shout from the rooftops that He(or She) is a "real" Dom (or post 80 pics of Himself in a manly/domly pose, pics of having sex with various females, or pictures of subs holding signs to prove that He is a Dom). His presence alone conveys this either, such as in this on-line forum with His writing, or in r/l with the very manner in which He conducts Himself.

This reminds me of the guys in locker rooms that brag of banging the cheerleading squad all night long in every Kama Sutra postion they have read about on the internet ............... it becomes obvious to anyone that is within earshot of this tale that they actually spent the night with one hand on the keyboard and one hand banging the love stick.........it's the quiet guy in the corner of the locker room that, when asked how His night was, He simply simles that knowing smile.....

There are many "real" Doms on this forum (IMO), some like Evil Geoff, RJMasters, DVS, Adante - to name only a few whose presence shines through in their ideals and writing.

i have met oh, so many "Doms" at play parties, BDSM groups etc that spend alot of time trying to convince me they are "real" Doms...... and i believe.....as a sub..... if They are "real" ..... then i will simply fall to Their feet (with Their permission of course) without the need for convincing ......... it's because i am a sub ........ They will bring out the slave fires in my belly and i will become putty in Their hands ..............

No disrespect intended Marquis ............ but You did ask the question ........

Hey, you gotta admit what Marquis enjoys in RL far surpasses living through fantasy because you can't find anyone to play with in RL. Not being picky, but that is what your profile says, that you are reduced to fantasy where the imaginary folk you create do as they are told..at least that is how I read what you wrote there:

Thrall_67 Well Hello Fellow Deviants Can't imagine a life without fantasy. Enjoy this lifestyle more and more every day. Fell in love with SM years ago and although difficult to find partners who play, I'm able to convince the "imaginary" people to have sex with me everyday (hey, I like the imaginary people - they do what they're told!!;-). Contact me if it pleases you.................

..and come to think of it, that don't sound slightly submissive IMHO!! Perhaps Marquis will give you a session if you ask nicely, just so you can find out if he can bring that submissive out in you.

Catalina

 

[Thrall_67]

Hey Catalina:
Yes, I fully admit to being a brat with regard to my submissivity (much of the fun for punishment) and imaginary fantasy lives within all of us - especially those who are authors on lit.
Perhaps, picking on Marquis wasn't nice - I do adore him and many of His posts are exactly what He claims - thought provoking - there is no mistaking His intelligence, good looks and yes, charm.
All things relative and put into perspective ............
The beauty of BDSM lies in the opportunity for us all to become our own definition of who we are .....................

(and yes, if Marquis wants to envoke punishment upon me ...... yeah ...... I'd hate that ........... the pics of some of His toys are enough to get any sub excited )