Where does BDSM fall in the PC spectrum?

[AngelicAssassin]

... I guess I am classified as 'vanilla'; be it with an insatiable curiosity ... My vanilla view is: if it is something you enjoy, whatever your label, as long as it is between like minded adults - go for it ... Lak of understanding is a fault in many people and not just as it is related to BDSM.

Welcome to the deep end.

Enjoy your swim.

A favour - don't eat me for being a lurking vanilla!!

Sorry, we've already broken out the chocolate sprinkles and dull spoons.

If you like, i can substitute fresh strawberries, fresh ground pepper, and a healthy dash of Pernod.

It might hurt like hell, but damn won't it taste good.

 

[Netzach]

Well, I live in Canada. Regurgitation of PC Mantra's because people can't be bothered to think for themselves is epidemic here. If the BBC is anything to go by it's an even bigger problem in the UK. With the exception of Fox News, the US TV, movies and musicians (more so than their actual music, go figure) we get flooded with up here is full of it as well. Just not yet as brazen in it's intolerance and suppression of dissent. There it seems to be mostly still in the indoctrination stage . Their 1st ammendment does seem to be having some dampening effect, though the problem in the US, while smaller, is still growing anyway.

If Fox is your idea of a bastion of free speech and Truth then we are indeed living on 2 separate planets.

Don't confuse my statement that a Dominatrix is viewed less unfavourably then a straight male Dom, as doms, for being doms, with whether women in general have a harder time then men. That's a different matter that would be out of context here but lets just say the sum of the two may mean you personally get a harder time than the male doms you know on a day to day basis. I don't know what kind of rude or obnoxious behaviour you may be on the receiving end of. I can only wonder if perhaps you put too much stock in what others think of you? If you don't think a straight male dom into S&M isn't much more likely to have their life completely destroyed because the wrong person found out about it, leading to an unwaranted criminal investigation (regardless of charges being laid or not the damage would be done), than a femal dom is, then you're delusional.

I wasn't going off into left field, I'm talking about being dominant, not about garden variety sexism.

I may not be as likely to be hauled off to jail for abusing my partner (though it behooves us all to remember the woman who was caught beating the other woman with a wooden spoon in Attleboro NH) however I don't see how you think it's easier and less work has to be overcome on the "we don't hit each other, we are kind to each other always" front.

 

[SonOfAGhost]

If Fox is your idea of a bastion of free speech and Truth then we are indeed living on 2 separate planets.

I appreciate that you disagree with me but there's no need to twist my words. I commented merely on the preponderance of political correctness in mainstream media and entertainment. Surely you're not suggesting Fox is politically correct? If you want truth and free speech, leave the TV off entirely.

I wasn't going off into left field, I'm talking about being dominant, not about garden variety sexism.

I may not be as likely to be hauled off to jail for abusing my partner (though it behooves us all to remember the woman who was caught beating the other woman with a wooden spoon in Attleboro NH) however I don't see how you think it's easier and less work has to be overcome on the "we don't hit each other, we are kind to each other always" front.

You don't have to overcome what you don't care about. It's your life, if someone disapproves, why do you let that make you so angry? Fuck'em, who cares what they think. You have friends who are OK with who you are, whether they share your interests or not. You have partner(s) you share your lifestlye with. You live somewhere that allows you the personal freedom to pursue life in the manner you choose, think and say what you like about it. That you're on the net suggests you've got the essentials of food, shelter and clothing well in hand. What more do you need? It's a big world out there, full of people, whomever has you so agitated, you don't need them in your life.

 

[AngelicAssassin]

You don't have to overcome what you don't care about. It's your life, if someone disapproves, why do you let that make you so angry?

Oh, i don't know, maybe because some of those idiots have the power to incarcerate you.

Fuck'em, who cares what they think.

i'll pass right by the first portion, i believe that's the last option i'd have in mind, but will agree on the second, with one stipulation. Until any government on this planet exists that doesn't want its nose in our collective bedrooms versus what goes on between consenting adults of whatever number you choose is his/her/their business, you better care what "they" think.

What more do you need? It's a big world out there, full of people, whomever has you so agitated, you don't need them in your life.

Unfortunately, most of us can't get "them" out of our lives, you know,

• them folks with badges,
• the jury of our "peers",
• the political hack with a law degree, district attorney for a job title, humming the theme song from "The Jeffersons",
• and that person you have to keep calling "your honor".

 

[Netzach]

I think you are grossly inflating my sense of agitation.

I'm actually rather amused that you sense great anger and hostility where I've a) disagreed strongly with your viewpoint but fundamentally don't know you from adam and b) expressed frustration with people in the past who have looked down on my orientation, which is not different from anyone else's stance in this thread.

We're also social animals. If truly not caring what anyone thinks of you is prerequisite for being a Dom I've never met one.

 

[brioche]

I appreciate that you disagree with me but there's no need to twist my words. I commented merely on the preponderance of political correctness in mainstream media and entertainment. Surely you're not suggesting Fox is politically correct? If you want truth and free speech, leave the TV off entirely.



You don't have to overcome what you don't care about. It's your life, if someone disapproves, why do you let that make you so angry? Fuck'em, who cares what they think. You have friends who are OK with who you are, whether they share your interests or not. You have partner(s) you share your lifestlye with. You live somewhere that allows you the personal freedom to pursue life in the manner you choose, think and say what you like about it. That you're on the net suggests you've got the essentials of food, shelter and clothing well in hand. What more do you need? It's a big world out there, full of people, whomever has you so agitated, you don't need them in your life.

If i wasn't sick (literally) and very tired from a particularly stressful day teaching little munchkins, i would take you on. Something tells me that you've got your head too far up your ass for it to be any use anyway. But then, being Canadian and all, i suppose my views are just regurgitated ones.

You also insulted Netzach, who i really like, and only paid lip service to the fact that women have it harder than men.

However, given my state, i will just boil it down to two succinct statements.

Fuck off. i don't like you.

Feel free to ignore the first, since you have the dubious honour of being the first person to piss me off enough to be put on ignore (look at my join date and that should tell you something). And it ain't 'cause you're spouting the truth, dude.

 

[SonOfAGhost]

piss me off enough to be put on ignore

Wow, that has to be the most emotional response to an academic discussion I've ever seen. Oh well. It didn't insult anyone and I don't think Netzach misunderstood me to the point of thinking I did. As for difficulties of men vs women that's off-topic for the thread so I saw no reason to expand on it. If anyone else feels the need to debate my points or flame me might I suggest doing so in a PM or a new thread. That way Marquis is more likely to get addtional posts closer to what he asked and we all originally replied with.

 

[Freagra]

Welcome to the deep end.

Enjoy your swim.Sorry, we've already broken out the chocolate sprinkles and dull spoons.

If you like, i can substitute fresh strawberries, fresh ground pepper, and a healthy dash of Pernod.

It might hurt like hell, but damn won't it taste good.

Damn, it would taste good.
--------
A question, apart from the theoretical status of where BDSM falls in the political spectrum, why would anyone with a BDSM lifestyle worry about what a vanilla thought about their lifestyle any more than I would worry about what someone with an alternate lifestyle thought of vanilla sex?

Is it just an question of not being able to publically express the personal relationships between BDSM participants or have I missed something integral to the issue?

 

[BarnabySchmidt]

Marquis,

Let's be honest here. The law is a conservative profession. Even among its least conservative members, there is a streak of- call it- professionalism that leads to a certain hegemony in dress and manner.

And, you are in law school. Most people in law school are not 'different.' It's anything but a motley crew. Most people dress alike and do like things outside of class. Studying 24/7, obsessing about grades, worrying about finals before the semester begins, trying to make law review and mock trial and moot court teams, then drinking in a shitty bar with to forget abotu it. . . this is what the average law student concerns himself with.

Seriously, how many of your fellows are openly different? Think about it? How many have out-of-the-mainstream politics, dress, or sexuality? Not many, I'd reckon.

This is not a thread to bash law students who aren't "different", it's just to point out that you may feel more 'outside' than you actually are. Chances are, when you are sitting in class reading about the UCC or the Restatements of Conflicts, there are some people in that room who share many of your kinks. And I'd be willing to bet in your classes on Criminal Procedure and Admiralty law classes, there are a few souls who can't wait to get home so they can tie up or be tied up by their partner. You just don't see it, that's all.

As for being really into S&M as a lawyer, you gotta face the reality. As a lawyer, your reputation is all you have. There will always be some people who prefer lawyers whose personalities are not in the mainstream (FYI, Lambda Legal keeps up a list of practitioners for LGBT persons who are looking for lawyers in ordinary legal matters who are sensitive to their orientation. If you do private practice and have the autonomy to take on your own clients, sign up for it.)

But, most clients want a lawyer who fits their mental expectations of what a lawyer is and how a lawyers looks and acts. This means, you wear a suit to your office, you keep your office clean, your manners are appropriate, etc.

If you're active in your local BSDM scene, you can't expect this not to interfere. The effect may be marginal, but it will be there. If you live in a bigger city, it will be less of an effect. If you work in government, you may have more leeway (as it won't keep you from obtaining new clients) or less. If you work in private practice, just go with a firm that seems cool. And, if you work at a non-profit, do something that's on the liberal side, something hippy-dippy, and you'll be super safe (though not making much money.)

On a final note, don't go opening Lit at school. Law school is like high school in terms of how people gossip, and unless you are comfortable with everybody knowing what you're up to, try to insulate it from law school.

And one more thing. MidtermS? Did I read that right, a plural? As in, more than one midterm. That. . . well, SUCKS. In my opinion, one midterm is one exam too many. One final exam is the way to go.

 

[gingermango]

Marquis,

Let's be honest here. The law is a conservative profession. Even among its least conservative members, there is a streak of- call it- professionalism that leads to a certain hegemony in dress and manner.

And, you are in law school. Most people in law school are not 'different.' It's anything but a motley crew. Most people dress alike and do like things outside of class. Studying 24/7, obsessing about grades, worrying about finals before the semester begins, trying to make law review and mock trial and moot court teams, then drinking in a shitty bar with to forget abotu it. . . this is what the average law student concerns himself with.

Seriously, how many of your fellows are openly different? Think about it? How many have out-of-the-mainstream politics, dress, or sexuality? Not many, I'd reckon.

This is not a thread to bash law students who aren't "different", it's just to point out that you may feel more 'outside' than you actually are. Chances are, when you are sitting in class reading about the UCC or the Restatements of Conflicts, there are some people in that room who share many of your kinks. And I'd be willing to bet in your classes on Criminal Procedure and Admiralty law classes, there are a few souls who can't wait to get home so they can tie up or be tied up by their partner. You just don't see it, that's all.

As for being really into S&M as a lawyer, you gotta face the reality. As a lawyer, your reputation is all you have. There will always be some people who prefer lawyers whose personalities are not in the mainstream (FYI, Lambda Legal keeps up a list of practitioners for LGBT persons who are looking for lawyers in ordinary legal matters who are sensitive to their orientation. If you do private practice and have the autonomy to take on your own clients, sign up for it.)

But, most clients want a lawyer who fits their mental expectations of what a lawyer is and how a lawyers looks and acts. This means, you wear a suit to your office, you keep your office clean, your manners are appropriate, etc.

If you're active in your local BSDM scene, you can't expect this not to interfere. The effect may be marginal, but it will be there. If you live in a bigger city, it will be less of an effect. If you work in government, you may have more leeway (as it won't keep you from obtaining new clients) or less. If you work in private practice, just go with a firm that seems cool. And, if you work at a non-profit, do something that's on the liberal side, something hippy-dippy, and you'll be super safe (though not making much money.)

On a final note, don't go opening Lit at school. Law school is like high school in terms of how people gossip, and unless you are comfortable with everybody knowing what you're up to, try to insulate it from law school.

And one more thing. MidtermS? Did I read that right, a plural? As in, more than one midterm. That. . . well, SUCKS. In my opinion, one midterm is one exam too many. One final exam is the way to go.

Barnaby's right - as a former law student myself (a decade or so ago at an expensive, exclusive, private Top 20 school in a mid-sized, mid-south city with an acorn in it's crest, if that gives you any clues . . . ), every single thing he's posted is dead-on.

And oh yeah, underneath some of those boring-to-tears exteriors are some wonderfully sexy, kinky people. My first kinky girlfriend, the one who showed me a part of myself that I never dared admit, was in my class. But for all intents and purposes, kinky stuff stays in the bedrooms with spouses and very carefully-selected friends for lawyers who want to use the law to make a career, actually help people and make a difference. Too many people who don't understand kink are out there and they WILL judge you, to the tremendous detriment of you personally and professionally. And sadly, the reputation you have among your peers matters a great deal in the actual practice of law, because part of your peer group are the judges and administrative professionals in the court system whom you must rely upon to be fair and unfailingly impartial.

 

[brioche]

So, i've been giving some thought to Marquis' original question of how the average vanilla person views BDSM. i personally think that almost everybody is kinked to some extent, but for the sake of argument lets say for a sec that we're talking true nilla, meat and potatoes, missionary style sex for the purpose of procreation types.
That person would be horrified by any form of BDSM, but then also by doggie style sex, etc.
We're talking about the average person here, and i'm having trouble defining that term. i remember talking about handcuffs, bondage, sexual teasing, and other such subjects with more than one of my friends in high school, just as another topic, not something scandalous. Stamina was also freely discussed among the boy-types.
Is this unusual? i don't know. But the BD area is more widely accepted than the SM one. Isn't it also more popular? i always assumed so...

 

[catalina_francisco]

Unfortunately, attitudes and practices rarely change without people who push to make it happen, even if it is risky to themselves in the interests of making it safer for others....there are multitudes who want and declare change should happen, but few who are willing to do anything about making it happen. I am one who did and though it cost me in some ways, it rewarded me much more in ways that counted IMHO....I get the sense Marquis is also one who gets that and is not quite ready to join the conservatives wholeheartedly for the sake of a dollar. Truth is, if there are so many kinky people out there (and I have no doubt there are), many of those people would respect and hire a lawyer who they saw standing up for his and their rights before one they felt would stand in judgement of them and their kink, and maybe not fight so hard for them on a legal front.

Catalina

 

[BarnabySchmidt]

....I get the sense Marquis is also one who . . .is not quite ready to join the conservatives wholeheartedly for the sake of a dollar. Truth is, if there are so many kinky people out there (and I have no doubt there are), many of those people would respect and hire a lawyer who they saw standing up for his and their rights before one they felt would stand in judgement of them and their kink, and maybe not fight so hard for them on a legal front.

Catalina

Fighting for rights is all well and good, but Marquis chose the law and now he has to face its reality. 95% of legal services in this country are consumed by 5% of the population. Those 5% are not out to have their rights defended, they are out to have their interests defended. There is a big difference. What it means is that a substantial amount of legal services are consumed for the "sake of the dollar." And that means most consumers of the services are not going to give a damn about Marquis being true to himself and standing up for his own rights. Not pretty, but that's the reality.

If I were working at your run-of-the-mill small firm, I would seriously consider not hiring somebody who walked around in public full latex. After all, your partners and associates are going to contribute to building up or tearing down your reputation as a legal professional. Maybe I am part of the problem- perhaps the worse part, because I have similar kinks but would hide them for the sake of my professional reputation, and would expect those who labored with me at the same firm to hide theirs, and doing this with the understanding that Marquis is as normal as Charlie Churchgoer.

But then I think of that olde-saying, "Choose your battles wisely." And should this be a battle I fight??? I could stand to lose my livelihood and my means of supporting myself and my loved ones. There may be other people in the firm who could lose their livelihoods. How many people would go unserved, who we could have helped? How many prospective pro-bono clients would we have to turn away? There are other considerations. And what would be gained by Marquis' noble battle? Sadly, I think very, very little.

Marquis chose the law, it did not choose him. He has to work this out on his own now. He will, I am sure. But he needs to keep in mind that sacrifices may be required. This possibility increases if Marquis intends to take the normal law student route and say "I accept" to the biggest first-year salary he is offered.

Marquis, I am sure you have learned all about "balancing tests" and now it is time to devise one of your own for your unique issue. BDSM v. Career. You can have both, but some tradeoffs are likely to be necessary.

Keep in mind, there are other options besides the world of corporate law. Many practice in politically progressive areas of the law- employment discrimination, criminal defense, labor law, as plaintiff's lawyers (personal injury, etc.). . . not to mention working for non-profits or ACLU-type outfits. You are more likely to have to compromise your own self less with such people, but don't expect things to be smooth all the time. Your lifestyle is bound to create friction, even if it is only within yourself as you struggle whether to dress up and go out one night or not.

I hope all this helps you as you work this issue out yourself. The best of luck to you.

 

[catalina_francisco]

But then I think of that olde-saying, "Choose your battles wisely." And should this be a battle I fight??? I could stand to lose my livelihood and my means of supporting myself and my loved ones. There may be other people in the firm who could lose their livelihoods. How many people would go unserved, who we could have helped? How many prospective pro-bono clients would we have to turn away? There are other considerations. And what would be gained by Marquis' noble battle? Sadly, I think very, very little.

Interestingly, my career also was one which involved helping people in need, and often very public and closely in league with the law, legal, political and medical systems on a daily basis. It surprised me it was people from these fields who actually applauded what I did, and fed work my way, and to the point of refusing to deal with my superiors and peers in the field who did not think my way was wise and thus thought they would be welcomed to replace me because they 'played the game'...and some even changed their own previous cautious behaviour to also publicly work toward change by not being so conservative and secretive about their own personal choices and areas of interest, and speaking out when oppression and prejudice were levelled at people based on their life choices, not themselves and what they had done.

I often had the 'chose your battles wisely' quoted to me by people who cared about me, but were not ready to risk their own safe position by saying what they really felt and believed, or working in a way which reflected that. I thought about it, and perhaps it would have made things a lot easier on the career ladder, but ultimately I found I could not look myself in the mirror of a morning if I operated that way...I felt like a fake because to be that way was to be a fake, especially when it meant publicly denouncing those I shared similar views with. What I found interesting was that while more cautious co-workers would feel compelled and justified to judge and choose clients based on what it could do for their career and reputation, I and those who shared my feelings on working authentically could and did work on an equal basis with everyone, those who did share our beliefs and those who didn't. More interestingly, at the end of the day I was known as someone who could be trusted by everyone, and have discovered people are still talking about what I did in a positive and admiring way 3 years after I left the paid workforce. Sometimes it is not about money and career, but more so about conscience and authenticity..and can still lead to a similar place without making one feel compromised.

From what people say, most in the US want change, and most in the lifestyle in the US want to have freedom of choice and equal rights, especially in legal areas....that does not happen by breeding more people in a position of working in those areas who roll out the same old predjudicial message and practice to be safe. The gay community and women did not win the rights and freedoms they have now by playing safe and keeping their mouths shut in the hope someone would wave a magic wand for them.

Catalina

 

[Netzach]

Personally I make no effort to be "out" nor do I make an effort not to be "out."

If asked I'll divulge. If not asked, I'll only tell should something really relevant come up or I feel like telling will be well recieved or is in order in some way.

Would I appreciate a lawyer I know is part of my community?

Fuck yes. And there are people who feel the same way. I've never understood why people view alt sexuality community as a liability and not a market. Seems dumb to me.

 

[gingermango]

Would I appreciate a lawyer I know is part of my community?

Fuck yes. And there are people who feel the same way. I've never understood why people view alt sexuality community as a liability and not a market. Seems dumb to me.

The problem (such as it is) is that not everyone feels that way, least of all the rest of one's clients. The percentage who actively disapprove enough to seek alternate representation will vary by region and community - some peoples' clientele (mine, for instance) would in all likelihood be so anti- as to cut caseload by 80% or more. Out of 280 files in the office, we have only one openly-gay couple and even then they did not want to discuss their living arrangements during pre-trial discovery for fear it would be used against them somehow, if for no other way than the inherent bias of the local jury pool. I have maybe half a dozen other clients I can read clearly enough. The rest are completely closeted about their sexuality one way or another. Gay, straight, bi or just kinky, you'd never be able to tell.

Which, when you come right down to it, is just fine since it has nothing whatsoever to do with most legal services.

 

[Netzach]

I'm not sure where you are, but I've lived mainly in NYC and in Minneapolis. Many lawyers advertise to the GLBT community in the GLBT paper. Obviously if this hurt their business they would not do it.

Not to speak for the Marquis, but I can't see him living in a city as small and out of it as MPLS, let alone smaller and more out of it.

 

[gingermango]

I'm not sure where you are, but I've lived mainly in NYC and in Minneapolis. Many lawyers advertise to the GLBT community in the GLBT paper. Obviously if this hurt their business they would not do it.

Not to speak for the Marquis, but I can't see him living in a city as small and out of it as MPLS, let alone smaller and more out of it.

I can't speak for Marquis, but I will say that as we approach our 40's, we often don't end up living where we think we will when we're in our 20's. If he's in a socially-progressive metropolitan area, great. Good for him. If he's a socially-regressive metropolitan area or small city/town, not so good for him. Where he wants to live and work while in law school may not be where he ends up living and working. As John Lennon said, life is what happens while you're busy making other plans.

 

[catalina_francisco]

I'm not sure where you are, but I've lived mainly in NYC and in Minneapolis. Many lawyers advertise to the GLBT community in the GLBT paper. Obviously if this hurt their business they would not do it.

.

That was what I also found when I was in practice. There was a list of professionals...lawyers, doctors, counsellors, physios etc.....who advertised their services for the gay community, and not all of them were gay themselves but had strong feelings about the discrimination toward those who were. Of all the ones I knew personally, they did not suffer in their finances or business, quite the opposite. A few of them were also part of the D/s lifestyle and open about it also, and even some of my straight, conservative clients (obviously ones who had open minds and were also aginst discrimination) became clients of theirs and found the service to be better than they had experienced from the more mainstream professionals they had used in the past. One of the lawyers in particular was so well known for his professional ethics and success, he was often called on to fly interstate to represent clients there....and still is..and he is in his 40's now.

Catalina

 

[Private_Label]

Damn, it would taste good.
--------
A question, apart from the theoretical status of where BDSM falls in the political spectrum, why would anyone with a BDSM lifestyle worry about what a vanilla thought about their lifestyle any more than I would worry about what someone with an alternate lifestyle thought of vanilla sex?

Is it just an question of not being able to publically express the personal relationships between BDSM participants or have I missed something integral to the issue?

Rejection and Legal issues. You don't get rejected by family, friends, co-workers, by having vanilla sex. You don't lose your job from having vanilla sex. You don't have your kids taken away from you by the state, for having vanilla sex.

The fact that there is sometimes a NEED to hide the lifestyle in order to prevent "bad things" from happening to the rest of our lives.

Think of your own predjudices... for example - which lawyer would you want defending you? One who dresses in the extreme mode of the Punk culture including extreme hairstyle, or one who wears a suit and tie and is impeccably groomed. Which do you think a jury and judge would respond better to? Even if the one dressed in Punk fashion is a better Lawyer, the one in the suit is going to get the better attention and be seen more favorably.

Everyone judges books by the cover; only some few are willing to read past that.

 

[FurryFury]

Rejection and Legal issues. You don't get rejected by family, friends, co-workers, by having vanilla sex. You don't lose your job from having vanilla sex. You don't have your kids taken away from you by the state, for having vanilla sex.

The fact that there is sometimes a NEED to hide the lifestyle in order to prevent "bad things" from happening to the rest of our lives.

Think of your own predjudices... for example - which lawyer would you want defending you? One who dresses in the extreme mode of the Punk culture including extreme hairstyle, or one who wears a suit and tie and is impeccably groomed. Which do you think a jury and judge would respond better to? Even if the one dressed in Punk fashion is a better Lawyer, the one in the suit is going to get the better attention and be seen more favorably.

Everyone judges books by the cover; only some few are willing to read past that.

Which is why I dress for the role I am in at work and keep my private stuff private.

Fury

 

[babiesmiles]

As I am a lawyer myself I'd like to add a couple of things .

No matter where you are ( e.g. Europe vs. US of A / metropolitan area vs. small towns ) law is still one of most conservative professional areas .

Now if by one hand I truly appreciate someone who manage to combine well one's own inner self with such an environment , on the other hand I must say , for my own experience I have seen really good professionals being discriminated for much less than showing their sexual preferences in bedroom .

It is sad I know , we all would like an ideal world where the others are able to distingush one's professional skills from their sexual orientations or preferences (whatever they are ), but it doesn't work that way , not yet at least , and not here.

Judgemental people are everywhere and they can do much more than bother you , they can literally destroy one's professional life even exploiting such aspects of others' lives for various ( surely not commendable ) aims .

Now back on the original M's topic, maybe if I would have known myself in a better way when younger , for exemple still in law school , maybe I would have had less qualms to express my true self even through the choice of law fields and a professional path which would have allowed me to be more tuned in what were my inner necessities of clearity and coherence , but , unfortunately my self awareness has arrived late and has joined on an already well - estabilished professional life , which has its settled rules .

I can accept it or not but I can't change the head of a certain kind of people I deal with , nor I am willing to do it , both for a matter of respect towards them and a deep need of privacy

I am a rather private person and , besides sexual orientations, I don't like exhibit myself at all . In my opinion and in my world understatement is an high appreciated value and even if I have not problems with others tastes and preferences , I prefer to keep my life just mine and not know too much about personal lives of people I am dealing with .

It keep all work relations straight on an aseptic professional field without unwelcomed interferences on both sides, that for me is more than a desiderata.

Of course the above is just my personal opinion and I heartily respect people who feel more than me the necessity to not separate so widely their public and their private . b

 

[Recidiva]

Okay, there's vanilla and then there's what only looks like vanilla because it's camouflage. There's a big difference.

You might look at me and look at my husband and think "monogamous, no costumes, vanilla."

However, there is a point at which rules and games and costumes become vaguely silly and seem like Halloween. Why dress up? Why not just be yourself to the greatest extent daily without any rules?

There are people that live along this spectrum and aren't stuck in one point or the other. They also know that by wearing outward clues as to what is inside your mind is disappointing and makes it far too easy to dominate someone or make them submit.

Now, there are people that are afraid of this, and that's the scared vanilla. Then there are people that blew straight past this into living a life with absolutely no rules and no safe words. Winner take all. No limit game.

The average BDSM person can't imagine not having outward clues and bluff and personality on hand as a visual cue.

Some people live a life without any cues or clues, only what we can get our perceptive little hands on and use day to day. No holds barred, no safe word.

BDSM can be about declaring what point on the spectrum you want to represent. Like calling out teams for volleyball or creating a character in a game and sticking with it.

I prefer being the spectrum rather than traveling along it and playing Marco Polo so someone can find you somewhere defined.

Almost every game or symbol or costume has a reality behind it that's hiding even just a little behind a structure. Rip the structure off and you get the real deal, unmasked and raw.

 

[FurryFury]

Okay, there's vanilla and then there's what only looks like vanilla because it's camouflage. There's a big difference.

You might look at me and look at my husband and think "monogamous, no costumes, vanilla."

However, there is a point at which rules and games and costumes become vaguely silly and seem like Halloween. Why dress up? Why not just be yourself to the greatest extent daily without any rules?

There are people that live along this spectrum and aren't stuck in one point or the other. They also know that by wearing outward clues as to what is inside your mind is disappointing and makes it far too easy to dominate someone or make them submit.

Now, there are people that are afraid of this, and that's the scared vanilla. Then there are people that blew straight past this into living a life with absolutely no rules and no safe words. Winner take all. No limit game.

The average BDSM person can't imagine not having outward clues and bluff and personality on hand as a visual cue.

Some people live a life without any cues or clues, only what we can get our perceptive little hands on and use day to day. No holds barred, no safe word.

BDSM can be about declaring what point on the spectrum you want to represent. Like calling out teams for volleyball or creating a character in a game and sticking with it.

I prefer being the spectrum rather than traveling along it and playing Marco Polo so someone can find you somewhere defined.

Almost every game or symbol or costume has a reality behind it that's hiding even just a little behind a structure. Rip the structure off and you get the real deal, unmasked and raw.

Interesting thoughts. I'm going to have to contemplate your words for a while. I will say this, since I've been on this journey the definitions, boundaries and who and what I am or want, keep changing, always changing.

Fury

 

[Recidiva]

Interesting thoughts. I'm going to have to contemplate your words for a while. I will say this, since I've been on this journey the definitions, boundaries and who and what I am or want, keep changing, always changing.

Fury

Yes, and it's so nice to be able to honestly say "I'm tired of this, I'm going to do something new, you're coming with me" instead of running off to find someone in the same tired costume to walk the same tired ground you've marched through for a lifetime because it's where you are the most comfortable. What is a fetish but a rut you dug yourself and can't escape? So many people just tickle their fetishes enough to keep them reasonably happy, they don't really want to break through them, see them for what they are and get to something new. That's scary.