Delving the Psyche of Sadists

[Homburg]

It would probably be a good idea for other sadists to weigh in. Maybe they'll say, eh, no biggie, everyone does that and grows out of it.

By 7 or 8 you should have enough impulse control and socialization, and empathy to know that crunching a friend's hand in the door isn't right. The lacking empathy thing is troubling, as inability to empathize is one of the traits of a psychopath, if I recall correctly. Otherwise I'd guess you were modeling what you learned as a child. So, as they say, tell me about your childhood...

Sociopath, ie Antisocial Personality Disorder. Pretty frikken disturbing stuff, really, and lack of empathy is a big signifier.

I did not have that problem as a kid. I had the urge to hurt, but always kept it in check. The only times it came out were when a hand was raised against me. If someone laid hands on me, I no longer had a problem with that whole restraint issue. Luckily I was a genial kid, and a fast talker, so I avoided most fights.

 

[ataxia.girl]

Have to say online never worked for me in terms of receiving pain...I couldn't jump that gap to make myself fantasise it was real and he was there, nor could I ever have achieved the pain level someone else could deliver in RL simply because of the physical impossibility of it.

Catalina

i have done online pain and it's pretty frustrating. i have had moments where i have been able to disassociate the part of me delivering the pain to the part of me receiving it so that the delivery becomes almost robotic and i am able to just focus on receiving but its not easy to do and i am not always able to make that happen. The best kinds of pain though which for me are whipping and beating are not possible so you have to get creative. Scrubbing the sensitive areas with a scrub brush or cello pad, needles and other pokey things, clamps, figging, ben gay, etc.

i doubt it is nearly as fulfilling to the sadist online as well. You aren't there to taste the blood or feel the welts. If you are on phone or a PC voice call you can at least hear and cam is better than nothing but its definitely not like being in person.

It can be done though and i have definitely pushed some of my own pain boundaries without face to face contact.

i would also add that it takes a pretty incredible Dominant on the other end of the keyboard\cam\phone or whatever to facilitate making that kind of pain happen. i have not and would not care to engage in this sort of play with someone who did not have RT experience with pain play. The aftercare situation online can also be less than fulfilling without actual human contact but it can work if online is your only option.

 

[FuckMeEyes]

I'd have to say my own desires stem from past anger and pent up aggression. I believe I have an enormous amount of self-restraint and if any of you met me, you'd never believe the thoughts I still have. I don't have those thoughts towards friends, usually just random subjects. Either way, I know better than to just initiate myself into Fight Club. I'm a nice guy and would rather not inflict pain on someone else without their consent or without asking for it in other ways.

I think the OP hit a good spot by commenting about getting others to understand. I fantasize about hurting women that I like, sometimes, and I would agree that it is an... interesting way to attempt to get them to understand me. I feel that I can find my way closer to someone, emotionally, by understanding them. So, it seems natural to want her to understand me.

Yet, I feel like I'm some sort of sado-masochistic duality. A lot of my sexual fantasies involve forced sex. I'm aroused with feeling that much passion towards someone that I want her so badly that I "need" her. Yet, at the same time, I crave that struggle. Not to simply force myself upon her, but to feel her fighting back. To feel her trying to prevent me from getting what I want. Short of gouging my eyes out, ripping off an ear, or kicking me in the jimmy, I feel like anything is fair game. I like the barbaric feel of it.

To get even deeper, I suspect that my ancestry has a lot to do with it my instinctual desires to inflict pain and suffering and to feel it. On my father's side, there is a lot of military participation and he's Danish. I'm sure there's some Viking somewhere in my blood. On my mother's side, the same, fighting men from the Philippines. Between guerrilla war against the Japanese and occupation by the Spanish, I also can't forget that Magellan never made it around the world. Last stop, Philippine Islands, before his men escape to complete the voyage.

I also know my upbringing had an influence. I wonder if my fantasies are an attempt to relive more chaotic times in a more controlled and wanted environment. *shrug* I'm happy being me, but it's fun to think about where I am and where I've come from.

 

[YourCaptor]

It would probably be a good idea for other sadists to weigh in. Maybe they'll say, eh, no biggie, everyone does that and grows out of it.

By 7 or 8 you should have enough impulse control and socialization, and empathy to know that crunching a friend's hand in the door isn't right. The lacking empathy thing is troubling, as inability to empathize is one of the traits of a psychopath, if I recall correctly. Otherwise I'd guess you were modeling what you learned as a child. So, as they say, tell me about your childhood...

I knew it wasn't something I would do to just anyone. This girl in question was the target of most of my “affection” at the time.

Hmm, the childhood thing may have a part. Its hard to tell, a lot happened.

Their was a lot of pain though, and all in the name of it leading to a greater good.

A quick example, a nurse drawing blood in the middle of the night, a nurse who at the time was more of mother figures to me then my mother was.

Anyway, I am not a sociopath, I can fit in perfectly when I try.

 

[Homburg]

Sociopaths tend to fit in perfectly when they try. Then again, there are other reasons why such emotional conditions can arise.

 

[intothewoods]

I knew it wasn't something I would do to just anyone. This girl in question was the target of most of my “affection” at the time.

Hmm, the childhood thing may have a part. Its hard to tell, a lot happened.

Their was a lot of pain though, and all in the name of it leading to a greater good.

A quick example, a nurse drawing blood in the middle of the night, a nurse who at the time was more of mother figures to me then my mother was.

Anyway, I am not a sociopath, I can fit in perfectly when I try.

It's hard to make an assessment with tidbits of information, obviously! If you didn't progress to killing cats, and you haven't killed any people, I guess you're fine.

Presumably every sadist here isn't a psychopath, so what is going on? Dangerous psychopaths have overwhelming urges that they can't control. I guess Doms/Tops who are "sadists" in the bdsm scene have some urges on the range of normal, but it's coupled with a desire for control. I guess.

 

[intothewoods]

Sociopaths tend to fit in perfectly when they try. Then again, there are other reasons why such emotional conditions can arise.

I assumed he was being tongue-in-cheek.

 

[YourCaptor]

This has given me some stuff to think about.

And I swear I’m a nice guy, never killed a cat, nor a human.

Thanks, I may be back though.

 

[Netzach]

Out of curiosity,

when you sadists where little did you ever find yourself in that scenario where somebody is crying, an adult is yelling, and all you can say is, “it was an accident”, because you really didn’t think it was wrong, but somehow it ended up being so?

I just had a back flash and realized much of my early childhood is littered with these kind of events until it got hammered into my head that it’s wrong. So I am curious, is this something that other sadists have experience or is it just me?

No, because I didn't really deal with other people very well. I drew and ripped up a lot of drawings of incredibly bloody battles, though, the Bauyeux tapestry had nothing on me. I think the dichotomy of "pretend" and "real" was always pretty strong in my mind, and the implications of acting out on schoolmates versus just thinking were pretty clear. While other kids were playing princess though, I was playing Tyrranosaur, so I'm pretty sure my relationship to power is dialed in a certain way.

 

[Homburg]

I assumed he was being tongue-in-cheek.

Eh, I was trying to point out that other conditions could cause it. I legitimately do not think that YC is a sociopath. I don't have the sort of info to make that call (nor am I qualified ). I was thinking along the lines of aspergers or a number of other conditions that have emotional distance as a symptom.

 

[intothewoods]

Eh, I was trying to point out that other conditions could cause it. I legitimately do not think that YC is a sociopath. I don't have the sort of info to make that call. I was thinking along the lines of aspergers or a number of other conditions that have emotional distance as a symptom.

Ah, okay. I was thinking aspergers too. There are definitely plenty of explanations, and I don't have enough here to make a good guess.

 

[Netzach]

Eh, I was trying to point out that other conditions could cause it. I legitimately do not think that YC is a sociopath. I don't have the sort of info to make that call (nor am I qualified ). I was thinking along the lines of aspergers or a number of other conditions that have emotional distance as a symptom.

Good ol' depression will do that - and that's fairly rampant.

 

[YourCaptor]

I don't lack empathy, nor am I emotionally distant. However my brain does seem to be wired differently. When I was little my mother would sometimes get autism scares with me, and not my siblings. I use to also go into sort of trans like states when toying with simple mechanisms, I don't do that much anymore. Along with dyslexia, and my over all deviance from the general consensus of how to react to certain things, I would say I am not exactly "normal". But you know, who is?

 

[intothewoods]

Speaking very very broadly, I think the essential question with any sort of mental health issue is does it interfere with your life. Whatever it is - depression, anxiety, asperger's - if it interferes with your life, then it's worth addressing it in some way (therapy, medication, treatment, etc.).

 

[graceanne]

I don't lack empathy, nor am I emotionally distant. However my brain does seem to be wired differently. When I was little my mother would sometimes get autism scares with me, and not my siblings. I use to also go into sort of trans like states when toying with simple mechanisms, I don't do that much anymore. Along with dyslexia, and my over all deviance from the general consensus of how to react to certain things, I would say I am not exactly "normal". But you know, who is?

Sounds like 'hyper focusing' which is an ADHD thing. K does it, and so does D (my son). Where they're so focused on . . . whatever that you literally have to YELL to get there attention.

Also, was there something else going on in your life? My sisters boyfriend commit suicide last year, and my niece, who's normally very nice, has been being very mean and un-empathetic recently. I'm about to refuse to drive her around, cause she goes out of her way to make my daughter cry, then just smirks. I know she's responding to what's going on, but that doesn't make it ok for the shit to roll downhill to my door. My sister is dealing with it, but it boils down to my sister made a stupid ass decision that we all told her NOT to, now her kids are paying and in turn MINE are.

Sorry, went off on a rant. My point was that sometimes kids aren't empathetic for other reasons than mental problems.

 

[intothewoods]

Sounds like 'hyper focusing' which is an ADHD thing. K does it, and so does D (my son). Where they're so focused on . . . whatever that you literally have to YELL to get there attention.

Also, was there something else going on in your life? My sisters boyfriend commit suicide last year, and my niece, who's normally very nice, has been being very mean and un-empathetic recently. I'm about to refuse to drive her around, cause she goes out of her way to make my daughter cry, then just smirks. I know she's responding to what's going on, but that doesn't make it ok for the shit to roll downhill to my door. My sister is dealing with it, but it boils down to my sister made a stupid ass decision that we all told her NOT to, now her kids are paying and in turn MINE are.

Sorry, went off on a rant. My point was that sometimes kids aren't empathetic for other reasons than mental problems.

Oh yeah. Absolutely. Frankly, if I see a kid acting out in some way, my first thought is what's going on at home. I wouldn't think there is some sort of disorder unless there were other clues.

 

[Domwoolf]

governing your inner sadist

(How does that feel to dominants? To know you must constantly police yourself and that your self control and judgement are often the only safety valves available during a scene. Do you always feel like you've never truly let go, always held something back? Does it give you a nagging sense of unfulfillment or constraint? All PC consent issues aside, have you ever had the urge to just use someone like that, to really hurt them and treat them with total disregard? How do you govern that part of yourself? Is it always there, daring you, mocking your SSC persona?)

Control constant unending control 24/7/365. I am a dominant/sadist. I enjoy inflicting pain, humiliation and total control on my subbies/slaves. That why I only play with true masochists, ones that enjoy the pain I inflect and always want more. The problem is, I must even then remain in control because to inflict the pain I would really like too, well that would be more than another should endure. So I set limits and keep to them. I take out my real feelings in writing stories, most of which I can't publish here because of the reactions of people that can't seem to tell the difference between fiction and reality. (See some of the comments I have gotten on my published story Billion Dollar Slaves)

Dom Woolf
American by birth, Rebel by choice, Kinky by nature, Atheist by god!

 

[CutieMouse]

Bump... just 'cause I miss RJ.

 

[castagnus]

I





So to summarize the above:


I used pain as a means to induce deeper love, loyalty and fear in order to draw the person of my desire closer to me. What I get out of it is control, devotion and respectful obedience, which is "why" I find and take pleasure in inflicting pain upon another

.

What a fascinating thread !

It has led me to consider the dynamics of my own view towards pleasue from inflicting pain and my concept of "loving pain". Pain that is welcomed by the recipient is tremendously erotic - and if the two of us are caught up in it there is the incredible feeling of total power even to the extent of inflicting serious injury, which my partner would gladly endure and agree to in the heat of the moment. But this sense of total abandon by my partner and my insistence that there is no "safe word" is only possible bercause of her comfort in trusting me that I would never go there, even though I might whisper some horrendous words in her ear as I administer severe pain.

On the other side, if I sense my partner is in distress and I have exceeded the pleasure/pain threshold, all the eroticism is gone and it is time to end the scene.

 

[Caitlynne]

Bump... just 'cause I miss RJ.

And AA too!

 

[greeneyed_Lady]

ITW, I think you and I are a lot alike in this respect, so I'm going to ramble about myself for a minute, if you don't mind.

I identify as a switch because it's the easiest label I've found for myself where I don't have to launch into a thirty-minute explanation. In truth, I'm probably more sadomasochist than anything. I enjoy inflicting and receiving pain pretty much equally. I am much more dominant than submissive in my relationships, and I have absolutely zero desire to dominate or submit to someone I don't have deep feelings for. At the moment, I pretty much have no desire to submit, period, and some desire to dominate, were I to meet the right person.

The problem that I find is what RJ talked about in his post. People equate bottom/masochist with submissive and Top/sadist with Dominant. It ain't necessarily so. I'd love to indulge my masochistic side right now, but 99% of folks labor under the delusion that just because I cum harder if I get my ass beaten and my breasts abused beforehand that I should grovel at their feet and call them "Master" or "Mistress." Nope, 'fraid not. I suppose that when I want my painslut itch scratched, I'm more of a masochistic Top than anything else. I want to enjoy the sensation and remain in control of the situation at the same time. For some reason, this blows people's minds.

I think it's possible to be a sadistic bottom, too. I find that, particularly when playing with other switches, I like to do the playful fighting thing. (*Smack* "Fuck you!" *Smack* "No, fuck you!") Even when I know I'm going to end up on the bottom, I like being able to get a few licks in, so to speak.

I'm pretty sure that didn't even come close to touching on what you're thinking about. Maybe I just wanted to ramble.

Wow. This is the closest thing I've ever seen online to describing how I feel. The only slight disparity for me is the fact that I do not seek to feel pain or inflict pain, but seek sensations ranging from light to hard.. just *this* side of pain. There is a thin line there I think, and if I'm pushed across the line all the feel good feelings disappear instantly and they are hard to get back for me.

For me sadism isn't necessarily about pain, but sensation and reaction. I have always done things to elicit a reaction from others. It's the reaction of my partner that arouses me, and I'm learning that the reaction comes from many things. Kissing them and feeling their fingers digging into my hip pulling me closer into their body. Grasping a fistful of their hair and pulling backwards and that sudden sharp intake of breath as their head is yanked backwards. Running a tongue over their nipples just before biting lightly. Rubbing the pad of my thumb over their frenum slick with precum or my own saliva. Call me a sensual sadist if you will... but there have been a few who have totally brought out the desire to inflict more. It wasn't the desire to inflict the pain, but their reaction to the pain being inflicted that drew me in. The glow in their eyes. The blush of their cheeks. The head down submission as collar and cuffs were locked into place and they were restrained. The gasps and moans and grunts as the whips and canes have found untouched skin and turned it bright pink. The squirming as fingernails were dragged over the welts. The growls of frustration at not being able to get away. I've soaked my panties more then once at their reactions, and I've been high on the endorphins I've felt, and I have fucked them hard with no regard to what it must feel like to have their hot, welted flesh ground into the surface of the bed below them as I've ridden them until I've cum. I've growled denial at the request for them to be allowed to cum.

I learned last Christmas that I can't play with someone I'm not in a relationship with. I need that connection in order to be able to play effectively. I need to know what makes my partner tick and what triggers them and how to work that trigger to my satisfaction. Once I know, I try and learn more about how to work that to my best advantage.. from a simple tease to running a suede gloved hand over the neck of someone who has a texture/leather fetish. The more they react, the more I push it.

I can't remember who brought it up, some someone mentioned about their PYL saving and using the pent up frustrations and anger from Their day on them. I've been told several times I could do this and my answer has always been twofold. First off, the one offering their hide for me to use is not the one my anger/frustration is aimed at. I have always felt it was unfair to use them, despite their offering, in order to release that frustration. Second, and this was something mentioned as well, is about control or more specifically losing control. I've had moments where I've been so angry at situations that I have had to walk away in order to keep from exploding and hurting someone. That scares the shit out of me. Perhaps that is the point tho. Pushing past the point where I feel comfortable and into a new place. I'm a bit of a control freak, and I don't like not being in control of myself at all times. I'm afraid of what will happen if I do let go completely.

There are many times that I feel like such an imposter.. a faker... especially when confronted by those with much more time and experience in this lifestyle. I'm new, I admit it. I do a lot of reading and I talk to a lot of people about their experiences and I do question them about things I don't know about. I have no goal in mind. I have no idea where I'm going to end up. I just want to enjoy the journey and not seriously harm anyone along the way. I will err on the side of caution until I get to know how far I can go. Recently had a play session with my boy (who is a definite sadist) where I was using the whips and canes on him.. and I probably shouldn't have. I've been dealing with some physical issues the last 4 mo and I really wasn't in condition to be beating on him... and I rushed things... too hard, too fast, and it kind of spoiled it for us both. He wasn't hurt, just didn't enjoy the moment like he had previously. I was obviously not on top of things that day.

As I mentioned, the boy is a pretty major sadist. I'm not sure why he choses to keep that portion of himself hidden from me, especially when there have been times I have asked for more from him. His previous relationships have all had him as top/dominant, but with me, I see only his bottom/submissive side. I'd like to give him more, but frankly feel at quite a loss when I've been given carte blanche and have no idea in which direction to go with him. Nothing is offlimits, it's all about what I want. I want more then just a kinky fuck and I feel I am failing him.

 

[castagnus]

Perhaps part of that is due to my own pleasure in receiving pain...

Catalina

That is probably why so many masochistic submissives are so in tune with their partners when they do the inflicting of pain. As a "dominant masochist" I find it wonderfully erotic to engage in "loving pain" play - sometimes swapping roles several times as we celebrate our gift of enjoying these intense sensations of pain/pleasure.

 

[Netzach]

Wow. This is the closest thing I've ever seen online to describing how I feel. The only slight disparity for me is the fact that I do not seek to feel pain or inflict pain, but seek sensations ranging from light to hard.. just *this* side of pain. There is a thin line there I think, and if I'm pushed across the line all the feel good feelings disappear instantly and they are hard to get back for me.

For me sadism isn't necessarily about pain, but sensation and reaction. I have always done things to elicit a reaction from others. It's the reaction of my partner that arouses me, and I'm learning that the reaction comes from many things. Kissing them and feeling their fingers digging into my hip pulling me closer into their body. Grasping a fistful of their hair and pulling backwards and that sudden sharp intake of breath as their head is yanked backwards. Running a tongue over their nipples just before biting lightly. Rubbing the pad of my thumb over their frenum slick with precum or my own saliva. Call me a sensual sadist if you will... but there have been a few who have totally brought out the desire to inflict more. It wasn't the desire to inflict the pain, but their reaction to the pain being inflicted that drew me in. The glow in their eyes. The blush of their cheeks. The head down submission as collar and cuffs were locked into place and they were restrained. The gasps and moans and grunts as the whips and canes have found untouched skin and turned it bright pink. The squirming as fingernails were dragged over the welts. The growls of frustration at not being able to get away. I've soaked my panties more then once at their reactions, and I've been high on the endorphins I've felt, and I have fucked them hard with no regard to what it must feel like to have their hot, welted flesh ground into the surface of the bed below them as I've ridden them until I've cum. I've growled denial at the request for them to be allowed to cum.

Um, yeah that. I also describe my fetish as "the big reaction."

It's not that I do painplay to *please* the other person, but what pleases me about it is what shakes out, what I get from them, what they can't control telling me, physically.

 

[SpectreT]

heh. Back again, don't know for how long, but I noticed a shit-ton of threads from back in the day - some of them almost as old as BDSM Talk itself - started by a lot of people I miss interacting with now. RJ, Marquis, Pure, JMohegan, and I had some pretty good philosohical debates, discussions, and in some cases, outright arguments, and everyone came away knowing a little bit more, even if it was just how much Marquis and I could get on each others' nerves . Good times.

But on-topic, my sadism isn't about pain (well, except for my spanko streak ), it's about control, frustration, and annoyance. Probably why I'm mostly bondage-focused. It's all about having someone at my disposal, a willing - if not necessarily happy - toy to play with.

But that sadism of mine doesn't stay in the bedrom anymore. I've found I genuinely enjoy it when people around me are absolutely at their wits' end with frustration. It's even better when one comment from me can either rip a gutteral scream of anger out of them, or make them see just how ludicrous the whole thing is, and burst out laughing. that moment of power is such a rush. Thank God I haven't sunk so low as to start creating those situations, yet.

 

[CutieMouse]

heh. Back again, don't know for how long, but I noticed a shit-ton of threads from back in the day - some of them almost as old as BDSM Talk itself - started by a lot of people I miss interacting with now. RJ, Marquis, Pure, JMohegan, and I had some pretty good philosohical debates, discussions, and in some cases, outright arguments, and everyone came away knowing a little bit more, even if it was just how much Marquis and I could get on each others' nerves . Good times.

Yay! A SpectreT sighting!!!!!!

You're right, there used to be some great conversations here with a lot of people who've pretty much moved on...