Loving wives - WTF, or is it me or them?

[LetsMisBehave]

Let me ask you a question ...were you happy with either?

I am very happy with both sets of stories. The delay in continuing is also because I need to widen the POV characters and be reluctant to accept that I can no longer have the two stories interlining quite as much as they have been—describing the same events from different perspectives was fun.
It also felt like a healthy story in that there is at the heart of it a good relationship between father, daughter and grandson where the daughter honestly wants to help her elder brother and his new, much younger wife be happy together as well as giving her ageing father reasons for living longer. Her son feels like a PG Wodehouse character having to deal with an aunt and a rakish old man simultaneously as he tries to help his grandfather have one last bout of sex with a willing and fun-loving 18-year-old waitress and help his mother persuade the new wife that she has a sexual side without actually doing anything with her.
The other problem is persuading even the LW readers who enjoy Losing Inhibitions to try Grampa's Last Hurrah

 

[Tomh1966]

Thank you all for the comments.
NoTalentHack, I have read and enjoyed your essay on Loving Wives, and it does explain some of the hypersensitivity.
I agree with Lovecraft68, and I believe you, that anyone who writes stories in that category has to have a thick skin. Some of the comments are hilarious, mind you.
snip

When I first started I got the insults and was like 'How dare they' Recently, I got a downright viscous one and I was like 'LOL good one!'

Another dynamic many non-author readers seem to miss is that I don't write every story with the same goal. I wrote Cherry Trees as an homage to the Harddaysknight tale and while different from the original, did not want to turn it into a BTB burn fest because the original was not BTB. I got hit for the reconciliation (which happened in the original by HDK) but the score was not too awful.

Four Minutes Thirty Seconds was BTB (Mostly the bastard) with an entirely different goal. The goals were entirely different than one series I did vs the goal in another series. I wrote I Call Dibbs with yet a different goal. People lumped them together even though they take place in entirely different universes and I wrote them for different reasons.

Some of the lowest scores in LW there are simply because of simply awful writing and read like, 'My wife was walking down the street and fell on a dick then she tied me to a chair to watch her fuck a train of black guys with six-foot-long cocks who laughed at me and made me clean them up after.'

There are some very well-written hotwife stories though I generally hate those stories. IE the quality of the writing is quite high even if I hate the topic. I skip them then don't tell the author they are a pile of shit in the comments. I've seen some poorly written stories in LW get good scores because the burn on the cheating wife was quite high.

 

[Lifestyle66]

When I first started I got the insults and was like 'How dare they' Recently, I got a downright viscous one and I was like 'LOL good one!'

Another dynamic many non-author readers seem to miss is that I don't write every story with the same goal. I wrote Cherry Trees as an homage to the Harddaysknight tale and while different from the original, did not want to turn it into a BTB burn fest because the original was not BTB. I got hit for the reconciliation (which happened in the original by HDK) but the score was not too awful.

Four Minutes Thirty Seconds was BTB (Mostly the bastard) with an entirely different goal. The goals were entirely different than one series I did vs the goal in another series. I wrote I Call Dibbs with yet a different goal. People lumped them together even though they take place in entirely different universes and I wrote them for different reasons.

Some of the lowest scores in LW there are simply because of simply awful writing and read like, 'My wife was walking down the street and fell on a dick then she tied me to a chair to watch her fuck a train of black guys with six-foot-long cocks who laughed at me and made me clean them up after.'

There are some very well-written hotwife stories though I generally hate those stories. IE the quality of the writing is quite high even if I hate the topic. I skip them then don't tell the author they are a pile of shit in the comments. I've seen some poorly written stories in LW get good scores because the burn on the cheating wife was quite high.

I tend to write those "fun, sharing" stories you don't like. But I've come to appreciate some of the hateful comments. I see them as if I actually engaged a few of their unused brain cells when they come up with a good one like:
"Please, for the love of God, don’t snort meth and coke before writing again."
(Posted to my story "Pavlov's Dog - 750 Words.")

 

[Tomh1966]

I tend to write those "fun, sharing" stories you don't like. But I've come to appreciate some of the hateful comments. I see them as if I actually engaged a few of their unused brain cells when they come up with a good one like:
"Please, for the love of God, don’t snort meth and coke before writing again."
(Posted to my story "Pavlov's Dog - 750 Words.")

And the cool thing is: I don't hate you. I hope you have a great day. I hope you enjoy writing. And seeing a story I don't like causes the following reaction: Next!

Odd thing is I don't mind swap stories with due notification, consent with no coercion, NO HUMILIATION, and hubby gets as much as the wife does. I guess we all have our point of view.

 

[Lifestyle66]

And the cool thing is: I don't hate you. I hope you have a great day. I hope you enjoy writing. And seeing a story I don't like causes the following reaction: Next!

Odd thing is I don't mind swap stories with due notification, consent with no coercion, NO HUMILIATION, and hubby gets as much as the wife does. I guess we all have our point of view.

Try reading "His Vixen", where I deliberately did all of that.

 

[FidelityBoss]

Loving Wives seems to be a magnet for strong opinions. Do you think the intense reactions are due to the themes of infidelity, or is it more about the way the stories are written?

 

[RetroFan]

Frequent comments on LW stories are about what one 'cannot' post to the category.

Some come up all the time, for example that cuckold stories belong in Fetish, that any kinks even something vanilla like a foot fetish also belong in Fetish, that mixed race cheating belongs in IR, cheating in-law stories belong in IT orgies in Group Sex, affairs with other women in Lesbian Sex, cheating girlfriends or de facto spouses in Erotic Couplings, and if any stories involving gay male sex end up in LW the condemnation is loud that it should be in Gay Male.

However, sometimes you get someone saying something more unusual, for example one comment on one of my stories set in the past was that it was a work of historical fiction, and that historical fiction has no place in Loving Wives. I'd never heard of that before, but there you go.

 

[Lifestyle66]

Loving Wives seems to be a magnet for strong opinions. Do you think the intense reactions are due to the themes of infidelity, or is it more about the way the stories are written?

I think it's about the situations of a cheating spouse which triggers some reactions from those who have experienced it in real life. And there are probably those who feel "lucky" to have their own spouse and can't even think about sharing their spouse for fear of losing them.

BUT when you count those who leave nasty comments and 1-star ratings, they amount to less than 1 percent of the audience (views) in Loving Wives! They are just a VERY emotional, extremely small minority when triggered!

This is why I find the animosity toward LW to be unfairly judgmental. That audience is over 99% neutral to every story, not even bothering to rate them!

A handful of judgmental bigots here malign a handful of judgmental bigots there! LOL. If you can ignore the judgmental bigots, you can find solace in MORE people reading your stories.

 

[FidelityBoss]

I think it's about the situations of a cheating spouse which triggers some reactions from those who have experienced it in real life. And there are probably those who feel "lucky" to have their own spouse and can't even think about sharing their spouse for fear of losing them.

BUT when you count those who leave nasty comments and 1-star ratings, they amount to less than 1 percent of the audience (views) in Loving Wives! They are just a VERY emotional, extremely small minority when triggered!

This is why I find the animosity toward LW to be unfairly judgmental. That audience is over 99% neutral to every story, not even bothering to rate them!

A handful of judgmental bigots here malign a handful of judgmental bigots there! LOL. If you can ignore the judgmental bigots, you can find solace in MORE people reading your stories.

I get what you're saying about the reactions to cheating stories. It's interesting how personal experiences can shape our responses to fiction. The fact that such a small percentage of readers leave negative comments or ratings does highlight how vocal a minority can be. Do you think there's a way to address this imbalance, or is it just part of the territory when writing in the Loving Wives category?

 

[LetsMisBehave]

No

Loving Wives seems to be a magnet for strong opinions. Do you think the intense reactions are due to the themes of infidelity, or is it more about the way the stories are written?

NoTalentedHack's essay is probably the best place to start on a nuanced answer. Obviously, the theme of infidelity triggers people—many people have either betrayed or been betrayed in real life (or believe they have been—some relationships were just a bad idea, or people married too early - don't even get me started on incels of either sex). My own belief is that if someone gives uninsulting trigger warnings in the introduction, "that here be dragons," then people should accept that the category is a broad church and that it would be a funny old world if we were all the same.
The problem is that the extreme responses to stories that investigate grey areas mean that authors are tempted to tweak the tails of easily annoyed readers, especially when this seems to happen without meaning to.
I was about to post before Lifestyle66's post came in. I agree that more people read LW stories, and most do not rate or review them. However, those who like ambivalent stories are prepared to either favourite your story or become followers. I have seen that people are more likely to investigate my other works if I put a stick in the hornet's nest. Any other comments would be welcomed.

 

[Lifestyle66]

I get what you're saying about the reactions to cheating stories. It's interesting how personal experiences can shape our responses to fiction. The fact that such a small percentage of readers leave negative comments or ratings does highlight how vocal a minority can be. Do you think there's a way to address this imbalance, or is it just part of the territory when writing in the Loving Wives category?

It goes with the territory.

Some authors are striving for the Red-H believing it indicates their story is great and will draw more views.

But in LW, my story may rate on average 1.0 lower than in EC, mature, or elsewhere. But I'm getting the more views in LW, without that Red-H!

Edit: I'm an admittedly shitty, amateur writer. But my stories in all categories average over 15k views since I started. If I extract those early stories in other categories, the average for my LW stories rises to about 18k each.

 

[FidelityBoss]

No

NoTalentedHack's essay is probably the best place to start on a nuanced answer. Obviously, the theme of infidelity triggers people—many people have either betrayed or been betrayed in real life (or believe they have been—some relationships were just a bad idea, or people married too early - don't even get me started on incels of either sex). My own belief is that if someone gives uninsulting trigger warnings in the introduction, "that here be dragons," then people should accept that the category is a broad church and that it would be a funny old world if we were all the same.
The problem is that the extreme responses to stories that investigate grey areas mean that authors are tempted to tweak the tails of easily annoyed readers, especially when this seems to happen without meaning to.
I was about to post before Lifestyle66's post came in. I agree that more people read LW stories, and most do not rate or review them. However, those who like ambivalent stories are prepared to either favourite your story or become followers. I have seen that people are more likely to investigate my other works if I put a stick in the hornet's nest. Any other comments would be welcomed.

I completely agree with you. NoTalentedHack's essay really dives deep into the nuances of the topic. Infidelity is such a sensitive subject, and it's no surprise that it triggers strong reactions. I think your point about trigger warnings is spot on—giving readers a heads-up can help manage expectations and reduce some of the backlash.

It's interesting how the extreme responses can sometimes push authors to provoke reactions, even unintentionally. And you're right, the majority of readers are neutral and don't leave ratings or reviews. It's the vocal minority that often stands out.

 

[jezzaz]

One thing I always try to do is read each piece on it's merits ...recently a author who is considered one of the best here (Jezazz) posted a third and final installment of one of his most revered stories (the Game series)after nearly a decade.... I thought it was well written but it didn't connect (the characters were completely different people in their behaviors and personalities) with his first two installments. I wasn't alone in thinking this and he got a lot of negative critical feedback in the comments ....what was interesting is that the usual LW suspects picked up on this too (the first two installments werea semi BTB classics loved by the 1 bomber crowd ) and gave it a bit (but restrained for them because of Jezzaz's obvious status) of the old treatment which hilariously resulted in Jezzaz calling them transphobic, homophobic, swill (seriously he did....I don't think he noticed Woke is on the nose these days..lol!) and promptly annoucing he was leaving Literotica (he's since deleted his origional diatribe listing his reasons for leaving and posted a more general less embarressing explanation) ...when I pointed out to him that perhaps he shouldn't complain about others lack of tolerence when he wasn't displaying the tolerence for others opinions himself he went silent..... this is the kind of crazy stuff thaty happens when people get entrenched into "camps" ..... I encourage people to read everything and try and encourage new authors as much as possible. Many new authors can creat great tales but are simply terrible at writing ...point it out ...make suggestions ....try to help as much as you can. And don't worry about scores ....

So yeah, was informed my name was being used here, so thought I'd pop in and actually correct some of this.

Firstly, lets talk about the comments. The reason people think I am 'over reacting' is because I did delete a bunch of comments, mainly because they were just vitriol. Where they came from, I have no idea. I only realized they were even there because Dan (DTIverson) pinged me and said "Don't take them to heart" - I was like, what are you talking about? and he said "Go look at the comments". The stuff there was just vile. Nothing constructive - I can take "I don't like this because..." because then you've actually got something to work with, something to talk about. "I hope you die" or "This is all just shit, you cuck" though... yeah, there's not a lot of places to go with that. I removed those because... why would I leave them there? What's the point? So Anon's can pat themselves on the back and say "We really took that lib down, hard!"?? I mean, Manu and Laural give us the means to remove comments, and it strikes me that it's exactly for this situation.

Some one posted "Randi told us about how you are racist" - she did? Ok then. I have an idea where that came from - for the record, she kicked me out of the writers group on Facebook because when I started the 750 word project I would NOT restrict who could write for it. You'll notice that all her writing challenges are invite only - I decided I wanted to just open it up, not keep it for the select few. She was incensed that I wouldn't restrict it, so, and I quote "People who've been nasty to me can write for this." I pointed out that it was up to me, if I instigated this challenge, and wasn't going to restrict it because she told me to, and because of that she kicked me out and apparently has been telling other people that I'm a racist. You can judge for yourself if that behavior means someone should be called a racist or not. I'm not really sweating it, but yeah, kind of lovely that one of the self proclaimed queens of Lit is spreading that sort of thing around. That makes me want to stay even more. </sarcasm>

Lets also talk about the 1 bombing. I see someone above complain that authors always complain about this. Well.. yeah. They do. Because. It. Happens. After seeing those comments on part 1 of the story - incidentally Anon, it does say very clearly at the top, "there are 4 parts to this, and I posted them all at the same time", so comments that complain that it didn't end the way you wanted it to, or saying things like "I hope to god this isn't the end of this!" just give away that you can't read and comprehend, *sigh* - I was online for when part 3 was posted, literally at the time it was posted. I noticed that immediately it got a 1 rating - a pure 1. No decimal point. Now, that's almost impossible, unless every vote is 1. And what's more, in the writers dash, you can see how many votes there were, and there were like 11-12. This had been public for all of less than 5 minutes. Yeah, don't tell me 1 bombing is not a thing.

I'm lucky - I get enough votes that over time, all that gets diluted. You can 1 bomb my stuff, but when you've got 1k votes, the amount it gets driven down becomes less and less statistically significant, and when Laural does her 1 bomb removal pass (based, I presume, on posting habits, records of IP's that do a lot of 1's, and stuff like that -some sort of pattern matching), all my stuff goes up to a greater or lessor degree anyway. So I don't really sweat that. Give it time, people will find it and hopefully vote it up because it's relatively well written. That's the hope, anyway.

But the comments. I was shocked. I've never seen anything with that vitriol before, and almost all anon (a few were not - the person above, for example, was not, and I left that comment alone) and I just wasn't going to let that be. My reaction was a little over the top (I don't embarrassing is the word, reactionary might be a better one) and I did replace it, but the reality is that my time to write is limited, and this particular story took years because I didn't honestly want to write it, but kinda felt I had to because I promised it and people showed up in the comments of everything else I wrote constantly asking where it was. So.. yeah, I did it. I wrote it three times, in fact, just to get it to a point where I felt it was acceptable.

All that effort - for free, I should point out, as everyone here is very aware - , and boom, "Go fuck yourself". Lovely.

I mean, I kind of expect it for some of the content - my story Opening Arguments I quite expected to get panned, and I was fine because it was more a writing exercise for me than something I was writing because I thought anyone would want to read it. So critical comments there, yeah, this is Loving Wives. The extremely vocal (and pretty toxic) minority don't want to read about how some couples might arrive at a sharing situation. Unless the men in the stories are Real Men, incredibly brilliant, clever and manage to pull of an upset the like of which you never could in real life, and unless women are shamed, as they clearly should be for having their own desire set, well, it's just shit, isn't it? No Real Man would accept that. <eye roll> On occasion you have to expect it based on the content of your story, and on the fact that Loving Wives is, in fact, fairly misogynistic and intolerant (at least the commenting section is). It just is.

Now, as to the comment "The characters are completely different people in their behaviors and personalities" - I find that quite genuinely amusing. I mean, these people don't exist. They only exist in my head. I created them, I created their personalities and what they do and what they say, and if I say "they do this", then they do that, because I'm the one who created that personality in the first place. There is an awful lot of consistency between the characters because there couldn't not be, since they came from me in the first place. I read the original stories and made very sure that they spoke the same, and I had the same kind of silly asides in the text, since people seem to like those and I know I do, and I'm writing it, so yeah, those happen.

There's a really interesting phenomenon I have noticed that really seems to infect the USA where people project their own wishful personalities on people in stories, and then get quite upset when that person doesn't do the things they think they, the reader, would, put in that situation. Or more to the point, what the reader wishes they would do, even though all evidence is really to the contrary. I find that most of the time when people say "They wouldn't have done that" - arguing with me, the author, about what my characters would do - what they really mean is "The person I wish I was wouldn't have done that, and I relate to this character somewhat, so I want them to do what I think I would want to do". I think this is why people vote quite clearly against their own best interests - everyone is a temporarily embarrassed millionaire, and should behave as though they are, because that millionaire, he isn't any better than I am. He's the same, so I should do what's good for him, because he's really me. Or would be, if I had a million dollars. Which I don't, and never really will have.

Sorry, rambling on a tangent there.

tl;dr. Loving Wives is a place where constructive criticism takes a back seat to just being knee jerk vile. So when/if it comes, it comes hard and is really repulsive. Just be aware.

I should also point out that there are poeple in this forum who honestly cannot stand to see any other writer than themselves succeed, and will attempt to pop their balloon and take them down regardless, just to make themselves feel better (not suggesting you are, DrPope, just there are others who definitely are.) I would posit that people who post here a lot have their own list of who these people might be, and I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if lots of those entries overlapped.

 

[jezzaz]

because of his bullshit woke ideals ...so he fucked his whole story (and by extension the series) ...what was truly hilarious is his former BTB fanboi's turned on him and he literally had a very public temper tantrum worthy of a kindergarten playground and left ....

You know what? Thanks so much for making my point.

You can't deal with a story because "the authors woke politics is something I can't agree with"? - ok then. So really it's not about my story, but about your reaction to it, because you can't abide 'woke politics', yes? Allllllllrighty then.

I mean, look at this statement "his former BTB fanboi's turned on him" - I wasn't aware I was writing for "BTB Fanbois" - thanks for letting me know! It's always good when other people know more about your stories and what prompts them than the author does

 

[mirafrida]

One bit of anecdata, after taking my second self-flagellatory dip in the LW pool.

At a personal level, rude, content-free comments don't really bother me (it seems self-evident that they say more about the commenter than me or my story). Still, the first time I posted in LW, the vitriol-to-signal ratio was bad enough that I sort of wondered whether the body of comments received, as a whole, was actually worth it. It becomes tedious at a certain point.

This time, however, having had my expectations set low, I have to say the comments are quite decent. The large majority are either thoughtfully complementary, or else constructive critiques that did engage with the piece to some degree.

I can't say what's different, obviously. The stories share broad similarities, but have some meaningful differences as well. This time I did tag it for containing reconciliation, so maybe that helped. Or maybe just lucky.

I should probably also add that I haven't observed much other benefit to posting in LW. The view numbers seem in line with other categories, and the score is ~1.2-1.4 worse. But in this case the comments are somewhat redemptive, as I would not have gotten this many in a different category.

FWIW

 

[M_K_Babalon]

One day, it’s “What the heck is wrong with LW?” The next, “Why am I getting bombed?” Then, “Can I continue a forgotten work?” After that, “Why don’t I get comments?” And so the cycle drags on with the same tired arguments. This must be purgatory...

You sure you've only been here a year? That's veteran talk.

 

[M_K_Babalon]

I was going to make a comment. But after getting caught up with all the text on this page, I can't even remember what I was going to say. Talking about repetitive, this whole thread is a retread of other threads, but, to its credit, it has stayed right on course and not been derailed. Not that the rails we are running down are that lovely a journey!

 

[DrPope]

You know what? Thanks so much for making my point.

You can't deal with a story because "the authors woke politics is something I can't agree with"? - ok then. So really it's not about my story, but about your reaction to it, because you can't abide 'woke politics', yes? Allllllllrighty then.

I mean, look at this statement "his former BTB fanboi's turned on him" - I wasn't aware I was writing for "BTB Fanbois" - thanks for letting me know! It's always good when other people know more about your stories and what prompts them than the author does

Arrrghhh...but your woke politics were not exposed until AFTER the comments when you had your little "tantrum" on your authors page ..... so that doesn't fly and frankly who care about politics ? The only person who brought them into the equation was ummm ...you. It was so interesting how worked up you got over essentially just everyday LW comments .. perhaps you need to offer others the tolerance for their own opinions you desire yourself.

If you are not comprehending that the main following you have on here was the BTB brigade (despite ....your obvious lack of really any true BTB stories) then by all means go on .... I always regard votes and comments and other peoples opinions as frankly none of my business ...you say you don't write for anyone but yourself? then accept your own assessments and ignore everyone else's.

ow, as to the comment "The characters are completely different people in their behaviors and personalities" - I find that quite genuinely amusing. I mean, these people don't exist. They only exist in my head. I created them, I created their personalities and what they do and what they say, and if I say "they do this", then they do that, because I'm the one who created that personality in the first place. There is an awful lot of consistency between the characters because there couldn't not be, since they came from me in the first place. I read the original stories and made very sure that they spoke the same, and I had the same kind of silly asides in the text, since people seem to like those and I know I do, and I'm writing it, so yeah, those happen.

You worried way too much about the asides and you completely lost your main character. They might exist in your head but they are NOT the same as you first wrote a dozen years ago. This isn't the same Ryan who displayed a reasonable level of general life competence in Live or Long and by far that was the main thrust of all the comments. Generally readers were like "Who the fuck is this Ryan?" ...you can claim as much ownership as you like but the fact is you fucked it up according to many readers. You might not like the fact that people think you fucked it up but it doesn't change the fact that they do. You tried to explain that he was ground down over time however it frankly needed the full Olivia story to develop the change in him and that didn't happen. I suspect that because you didn't want to write it at all that subconsciously you tried not to and in fact succeeded.

I understand that when you have been previously (correctly) lauded for crafting such fine tales it's hard when you get criticized for the actual writing as opposed to the content (such as Opening Arguments which was perfectly fine BTW) but the basis of many of the comments was simply disappointment that the Ryan they wanted wasn't there. As you are aware this is LW and balanced nuanced critique is not a favorite of the anon's.

I know you consider that you wrote this correctly and I know that it must be disappointing to hear so many people think you didn't after you put in so much work but this is the risk we take after a 10 year gap.

 

[DrPope]

You know what? Thanks so much for making my point.

You can't deal with a story because "the authors woke politics is something I can't agree with"? - ok then. So really it's not about my story, but about your reaction to it, because you can't abide 'woke politics', yes? Allllllllrighty then.

I mean, look at this statement "his former BTB fanboi's turned on him" - I wasn't aware I was writing for "BTB Fanbois" - thanks for letting me know! It's always good when other people know more about your stories and what prompts them than the author does

But nobody knew you had that agenda until AFTER you finished the series ..... nothing in your body of work had indicated anything of the sort.
The only reason anyone knew was you posted it all ....hence you dragged something into it that wasn't there and frankly people were bound to draw the obvious conclusions from that when examining the differences between purportedly the same character in the three tales.
So the question is does your post story (since deleted) political statements cast doubt on the actual character development in your story ....why yes they do. I'm not saying I believe they played a part ...not really except perhaps subconsciously but they do create a line of inquiry so to speak that casts doubt.

I suspect the main thing that happened here was simply time .... in 10 years you change ...you can't write the same things with meaning that you once did because you have changed as a person and as a writer.

It's quite likely that you set yourself an impossible task to begin with probably because you didn't want to do it in the first place (lets face it ...it only had once place to go and it went there) and therefore you kept putting it off until welll ...until this.

 

[Actingup]

I published a story earlier today called The Break-up in Loving Wives. I knew and accepted the trade-off—more views, more favourites against one bombing. Hell, in twelve hours, it has had more views than 80% of my stories here. I just wasn't expecting this story to be bombed more than any other story I have written.
Although it may err on the morally ambivalent side, I think it is a good story. I think it is clear that the cheating girlfriend is self-destructing and antagonising her friends. I would be grateful for feedback on (a) what in the story wound up readers and (b) where would have been a better place to put it. Or indeed (c), is it just crap.
Alternatively, is it just that Loving Wives has more self-appointed gatekeepers about what is acceptable than it did a year ago?
By the way, two of my best-rated and worst-rated stories are liked stories in mature and loving wives (Grampa's Last Hurrah and Losing Inhibitions). Perhaps unsurprisingly, the worst-rated and most-read two are in Loving Wives and the best-rated and least-read in Mature. I have written two-thirds of the next stories in both series, but I have to resist the temptation to wind up those who expect the young and honourable wife to betray the older husband.
I must add that I am not complaining because I knew that here be dragons, but I am honestly puzzled.

Well, this has been a fascinating discussion to read. Reflectiing back on the comments that I've received on my handful of Loving Wives entries, they tend to be either a) warmly supportive (the great majority), b) constructively critical, even if occasionally harsh (a reasonable minority), c) uncritically negative (a smaller minority), or d) abusive towards me or other readers. I delete the last type, but there really weren't many of them.

Have many people read and appreciated the stories? Yes, and far more than they would have elsewhere.
Have I improved my writing skills during the process? Yes, absolutely, even though there's more room for improvement.
Has it been fun? Bloody oath it has.
Will we achieve world peace in LW? Nope! But we're not expected to. And some of us clearly do find the stories helpful in working through real life situations.

Most of my stories seem to be going into Romance at the moment where of course they get higher ratings, but I may well stray again into the dark side....

 

[FidelityBoss]

It goes with the territory.

Some authors are striving for the Red-H believing it indicates their story is great and will draw more views.

But in LW, my story may rate on average 1.0 lower than in EC, mature, or elsewhere. But I'm getting the more views in LW, without that Red-H!

Edit: I'm an admittedly shitty, amateur writer. But my stories in all categories average over 15k views since I started. If I extract those early stories in other categories, the average for my LW stories rises to about 18k each.

Looks like you've figured out how to handle the Loving Wives category. Even though the ratings are lower, the higher view counts show there's a big audience for these stories. It's great that you're so self-aware and open to reflecting on your writing journey. Keep it up

 

[DrPope]

Well, this has been a fascinating discussion to read. Reflectiing back on the comments that I've received on my handful of Loving Wives entries, they tend to be either a) warmly supportive (the great majority), b) constructively critical, even if occasionally harsh (a reasonable minority), c) uncritically negative (a smaller minority), or d) abusive towards me or other readers. I delete the last type, but there really weren't many of them.

I would have thought you would have been hammered on the Arab thing ..... just goes to show that you can never be sure how they will react and sometimes a good tale can survive them ...

 

[Britva415]

I find the animosity toward LW to be unfairly judgmental

The only thing we can compare it to is all the other categories.

You quoted some figures but the matter isn’t a quantitative one (well, maybe it is - scoring is harsh in LW), the issue is qualitative. If you can show that there are other categories on Lit where there is similar harsh reader reactions and comments, then maybe you can say that LW is being unfairly singled out by the AH.

 

[MillieDynamite]

Just two examples from here and at another site.

First the 'tother site.


Now our site.

Hard to comp air an up or down vote to a 5 star voting system. But both sites Carnal Crimes stands% up about the same. While the Loving Wives Candy's Dandy gets a great 91.7% at the other site and a hopeless 2.76 here. All of the comments at the other site are overwhelming positive and here on the LW entry are not only negative but had a lot of personal attacks that I removed. On mine here in LW they aren't really that many reads or votes. At least on this one entry.

 

[Lifestyle66]

The only thing we can compare it to is all the other categories.

You quoted some figures but the matter isn’t a quantitative one (well, maybe it is - scoring is harsh in LW), the issue is qualitative. If you can show that there are other categories on Lit where there is similar harsh reader reactions and comments, then maybe you can say that LW is being unfairly singled out by the AH.

My point is that in other categories, you probably get fewer views and even fewer comments. But if you get ONE bad comment out of only five total, then that's twenty percent of those comments!

If I get TEN bad comments out of fifty in LW, then it's the same!

I get MORE views, MORE comments, and MORE ratings in LW than I do in other categories. I just easily disregard the bad ones (but I never delete any of them, only the admins do that to those on my stories when others complain.). Someone commented "EAT SHIT AND DIE!" to one of my stories a few years ago, and the Admins deleted it within two days (darn it!)