"Vanilla Wife Syndrome"

[lustatopia]

I've always been totally gay. I had sex with guys but always knew I was a lesbian. I've never been bisexual. Get over it.

I never said you weren't a lesbian.

But, by definition, you have led a sexual life that has had a bisexual range of experience. Of course, you don't have a bisexual identity, you do have bisexual life experience. To deny this is a very curious thing indeed, because it signals that you are clinging to an identity which is based upon the repudiation of another, rather than being self-affirming in and of itself.

Imagine someone saying. "I had sex with guys but always knew I was a straight male. I've never been bisexual...." You'd laugh them out of the room.

Yet you are blind to the cognitive dissonance in your own position.

Why is that?

 

[Stella_Omega]

This part made me


"I suspect that some people who have invested tragically in a sexual identity that they were culturally channelled into by forces that are now in decline will react to our new boundless sexual freedom of this century with frustration. The old boundary walls that safely pigeonholed people into their cages are no longer there. It must be a confusing place, this new world. "

Are you going to sing now?

It's quite true. I'm right on the last edge of that very generation-- I was just lucky that I knew more about myself than a lot of women my age did. Even so, I made choices that I regret now.

And, at the age of fifty-five, I wonder if I will ever have the chance to live my life for myself.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Yup. I guess you are right she is being judgmental. You know what? That's okay too because she's using her judgment to determine that anyone who would accuse her of being a fundie, bigoted, hate-monger like Jerry F. just because she disagrees with his "because I have a fetish for a piece of flesh that makes me bi" propaganda.

no actually, what made her sound like Jerry Falwell was her complaining that people are calling her judgmental just because she is.

I guess that also makes me judgmental as well because I believe that being attracted/turned on by a "thing" or an "object" vs. a person is the textbook definition of a fetish.

yeah I agree. But the question in the first post is about identity. And I agree with lustatopia that your reaction, and hers-- are what turned this into a thread about identity-- thereby making it GLBT material,even if it wasn't intended that way. Sometimes the line is a little fuzzy. Sometimes, we give the benefit of the doubt.

P.S. That doesn't mean there is anything wrong with fetishes. (I've personally got a bunch). It just means you don't get to redefine terms to fit you personal biases.

Heh, the new fetish forum already has posts asking why there are threads about cocksucking there, why aren't those threads in GLBT? The first thread I started there is entitled "Leave your homophobia at the door thank you" and people just... don't get it.

And of course-- the cocksuckers are getting a little antsy. One guy PM'd me to say that his thread went so much better when it was in the GLBT forum.

Not like they can... yanno, fight for their rights. Or stand their ground.

 

[vrosej10]

Sexuality is a spectrum which can be expressed two ways graphically:
http://is3.okcupid.com/users/938/870/9388702245733391674/mt1130056446.jpg

http://is2.okcupid.com/users/182/838/18283806126179384909/mt1116983114.gif

There are people who are definitively gay and straight and everyone else is somewhere between the two. The only person qualified to define your sexuality is you and if you choose not to, that is up to you. I am dead in the middle bisexual personally. i have been forever.

 

[Safe_Bet]

Imagine someone saying. "I had sex with guys but always knew I was a straight male. I've never been bisexual...." You'd laugh them out of the room.

Yet you are blind to the cognitive dissonance in your own position.

Why is that?

She doesn't have imagine that because there have been numerous examples of dudes saying exactly that! Of course to realize that you'd have to actually read and try to understand what she is trying to say rather than ignoring her meaning so as to expound (at GREAT length) about your personal pet theories.

BTW, why do you need to add all of the personal insults and snarky attacks in your posts? Are you that afraid of women you can't dominate or what? (I'm seriously curious as to why you feel the need to demean those of us that disagree with you. )

 

[girlsmiley]

I've always been totally gay. I had sex with guys but always knew I was a lesbian. I've never been bisexual. Get over it.

I never said you weren't a lesbian.

But, by definition, you have led a sexual life that has had a bisexual range of experience. Of course, you don't have a bisexual identity, you do have bisexual life experience. To deny this is a very curious thing indeed, because it signals that you are clinging to an identity which is based upon the repudiation of another, rather than being self-affirming in and of itself.

Imagine someone saying. "I had sex with guys but always knew I was a straight male. I've never been bisexual...." You'd laugh them out of the room.

Yet you are blind to the cognitive dissonance in your own position.

Why is that?

You might have all the answers (haha)

but you don't have all the questions

which makes me believe you belong on the General Board

Not in GLBT

 

[lustatopia]

You might have all the answers (haha)

but you don't have all the questions

which makes me believe you belong on the General Board

Not in GLBT

Very good point.

The answers are not nearly as important as getting the questions right. For what is a good answer if it is to a useless question and we have seen so many of those in this thread.

My question to you is how would you define bisexuality, so that we bisexuals can rightfully take our place in the GLBT community as equals with lesbians, gays and transsexuals?

What is bisexuality really about?

This is a serious question.

Thanks in advance for your thoughtful replies.

 

[LeatherChaps]

Haha!
You're going to have to do a lot better than that, chapstick.

We're not all bisexual.

I'm a lesbian.

I don't believe that if I fucked a man that I would be a bisexual because deep down I would just be using his body. I would still be a lesbian. I'm not attracted to men. Hypothetically speaking, the man (cock) in that relationship would be as noteworthy to me as a dildo. Almost zero significance.

Just like Pirate Guy who has no love and is not attracted to men. He would just be using his cock, which makes me believe his is not bisexual and it's just a fetish.

I MYSELF will not wave a bisexual flag because I don't fall under that category and I never will, even though I have fucked men in the past.

Capiche?

Guess what... we could care less if you are asexual, bisexual, cosexual, desexual, e-sexual, fresexual, monosexual, omnisexual, polysexual, phosexual, postsexual...

What we can do without is your narrow-minded and self righteous judgementalism.

Capiche?

 

[Safe_Bet]

My, my, my..... Somebody seems like they have as bad chapping as their name would imply.

You might try some Desitin Ointment, dude.

 

[Wolfman1982]

LeatherChaps: you fucking rock

 

[Safe_Bet]

LeatherChaps: you fucking rock

Boy... Now there's one of your great references!

 

[Wolfman1982]

Boy... Now there's one of your great references!

Jeg takker mange gange for dine roser. men diner roser bliver smidt i skraldespanden ligesom dig , fordi jeg kan ikke se forskel mellem møgsækken og Dem. Og hvis De ikke har noget klogt at skrive, så lad venligst være med at svare på mine bemærkninger. Når De derimod ikke har noget spændende at sige i den her tråd. Så hold Deres mund lukket, fordi jeg vil fra nu af. hver evig eneste gang, et svar De kommer med som er forpestende i en tråd. Så vil jeg begynde at skrive på det smukke sprog som er det danske sprog. Fordi så har De lidt ekstra arbejde med at få de oversat på den korrekte måde, hvis ikke De har et menneske som forstår det danske sprog ved din side. Så nu beder jeg Dem, for en sidste gang om at tie stille, hvis din personlighed kan klare at man går over i De formen. Fordi som jeg ser på sagerne, så ender De med at gå ned med flaget når det kommer til Deres følelsesmæssige liv. Men inden da, forudser jeg at De vil forsøge at ødelægge så mange tråde med dit overmådelige utroligt dårlige humør. Så god fornøjelse med at for hele min postering oversat på den rigtige måde som jeg tvivler stærkt på at et program kan gøre.

 

[CJontherocks]

Jeg takker mange gange for dine roser...

Here's what I got:

Thanks for the roses. Now shut up.

What's a "møgsækken"?

 

[girlsmiley]

Very good point.

My question to you is how would you define bisexuality, so that we bisexuals can rightfully take our place in the GLBT community as equals with lesbians, gays and transsexuals?What is bisexuality really about?

This is a serious question.

Wrong question.

Continuing on...

You say we go through a transition. So when you yourself went through your transition, what label did you give yourself?

All of the people I know who were figuring stuff out during their young lives never had a label. But there you are shit staining all of them as bisexual. The label: "figuring stuff out" isn't good enough for you?

You have no fucken right to tar everyone with the bisexual brush.

You are an unworthy troll who is trying to insinuate that I'm saying "we aren't all equal."

Poor form.

Go back to the GB.

 

[blade_rocknut]

The person who's been accused of trolling ( at least twice) hasn't been the one insulting others, making direct, personal attacks, and furthermore had something to say that was relevant to the thread.

Since when is the label of bisexual a "shit stain"?

 

[girlsmiley]

The person who's been accused of trolling ( at least twice) hasn't been the one insulting others, making direct, personal attacks, and furthermore had something to say that was relevant to the thread.

Since when is the label of bisexual a "shit stain"?

Hahaha!

Try harder.

 

[blade_rocknut]

Hahaha!

Try harder.

I'm......not....trying....to do anything to gain your acceptance / approval / whatever. Merely attempting to direct the thread back toward.....itself. Glad to have been used for your amusement.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Very good point.

The answers are not nearly as important as getting the questions right. For what is a good answer if it is to a useless question and we have seen so many of those in this thread.

My question to you is how would you define bisexuality, so that we bisexuals can rightfully take our place in the GLBT community as equals with lesbians, gays and transsexuals?

What is bisexuality really about?

This is a serious question.

Thanks in advance for your thoughtful replies.

As a bisexual myself, I feel that the "bi" part of my sexuality has very little to do with lesbian concerns. If I'm fucking a man, then I'm functionally hetero-- queer but hetero. When I'm with women, then I am very much a part of lesbian issues, and one reason is most certainly because women like girlsmiley need and deserve to know that I sometimes share my energy with men. But I don't talk about hetero sex here. No need-- there's a bajillion hetero spaces out there.

Same with bisexual men.

My opinion is that the GLBT is a political construct, not a community. Socially, It's a gathering of cultural ghettos outside of the heteronormative. We all look the same to them-- but we are not the same. Lesbians have very different culture than gay men do. Transgendered folk might be gay, lesbian, queer-- or completely accepting of hetero privilege if only they had been born into the proper body. None of us are especially well served by being forced to cohabit the same space.

But them's the breaks, it's a hetero world out there.

 

[lustatopia]

The person who's been accused of trolling ( at least twice) hasn't been the one insulting others, making direct, personal attacks, and furthermore had something to say that was relevant to the thread.

Since when is the label of bisexual a "shit stain"?

Thanks for noticing, Blade.

The fascinating part is that Girlsmiley & She-bet are so lacking in conscious self-awareness. A classic case of denial and projection combined with vividly unexamined personal motives renders just about everything they say cognitively dissonant. A very precarious existence indeed for people posting their confusion online in a public forum as a kind of record of personal tumult.

For instance, when they scream we're not judgmental or intolerant you "scumbag", "fucking moron", "shit-stain" bisexual "cock fetish" "unworthy troll," you really just got to roll your eyes.

I rest my case.

But I have come to see that prejudice against bisexuals isn't really what matters here. We have all made the point that sexual intolerance doesn't fly well on the GLBT board. It's really all about Safe-Bet and Girlsmiley who have personal identity issues which they are projecting outward. On one level they are in the same boat with Pirate Guy, just another couple of people struggling to come to grips with their lives. Maybe that's why they first lashed out at him?

Girlsmiley and Safe-bet obviously feel really strongly about something, but what it is about is hard to know, because they are incapable of effectively expressing themselves, probably because they fear revealing themselves will open themselves up to attack. Who can blame them? Literotica can be a tough hood.

So it is difficult to weed past their irrational defensive mechanisms to find the kernel of their Truth, which ironically they're usually unaware even exists. I suspect it might be related to some trauma they suffered in their formative years, since they keep referring to childhood, but who knows? They're certainly not going to open up to me after this thread. Nevertheless, I feel that the precarious comprehension of their own sexuality they have exhibited on this thread indicates that they deserve our compassion and empathy rather than further ridicule.

No doubt they won't return the favor.

 

[lustatopia]

As a bisexual myself, I feel that the "bi" part of my sexuality has very little to do with lesbian concerns. If I'm fucking a man, then I'm functionally hetero-- queer but hetero. When I'm with women, then I am very much a part of lesbian issues, and one reason is most certainly because women like girlsmiley need and deserve to know that I sometimes share my energy with men. But I don't talk about hetero sex here. No need-- there's a bajillion hetero spaces out there.

Same with bisexual men.

My opinion is that the GLBT is a political construct, not a community. Socially, It's a gathering of cultural ghettos outside of the heteronormative. We all look the same to them-- but we are not the same. Lesbians have very different culture than gay men do. Transgendered folk might be gay, lesbian, queer-- or completely accepting of hetero privilege if only they had been born into the proper body. None of us are especially well served by being forced to cohabit the same space.

But them's the breaks, it's a hetero world out there.

That might be the most intelligent comment on this thread. It certainly has given me a new insight into the GLBT community that I suppose I always knew was there, but chose to ignore in favor of political solidarity against the mainstream het world. But maybe political solidarity isn't so necessary now that we are rarely under siege anymore?

"A gathering of cultural ghettos outside the heteronormative." Yes, when you look at it that way there are going to be tensions. And I suppose now that these cultural ghettos are more free to come out than ever before, we might expect a certain elevated level of jostling between ghetto cultures that see themselves in competition on some level.

Truth is that I have spent most of my life experience on that bisexual interface between the straight and gay world, rather than exploring the intricacies of the deep cultural ghettos within the GLBT community. So I am more sensitive to the difficulties of the bisexual ghetto which has had to pitch its tent on the edge of the GLBT polis. Maybe I'm too touchy when a few thugs turn up to throw stones at us and tell us we don't belong. There are always going to be a few bullies in any ghetto.

Thanks for that, Stella. It's always nice to come away from a thread feeling like I've learned something new.

 

[girlsmiley]

She doesn't have imagine that because there have been numerous examples of dudes saying exactly that! Of course to realize that you'd have to actually read and try to understand what she is trying to say rather than ignoring her meaning so as to expound (at GREAT length) about your personal pet theories.

BTW, why do you need to add all of the personal insults and snarky attacks in your posts? Are you that afraid of women you can't dominate or what? (I'm seriously curious as to why you feel the need to demean those of us that disagree with you. )

Didn't you know? You look "heaps cool" and "way smart" by talking shit.
Talking shit like this:

"Bisexuality ruins the cultural pureness of the gay scene"

Haha!

I could point out some of his issues but he'd talk his way around it. The guy could talk the pants off his grandmother.

I hope he doesn't reply again. I'm trying to chea... I mean win a game of scrabble

Woman's trying to put me off by telling me how hot Robert Pattinson is!

Fucking bitch!

 

[Safe_Bet]

Didn't you know? You look "heaps cool" and "way smart" by talking shit.
Talking shit like this:

"Bisexuality ruins the cultural pureness of the gay scene"

Haha!

I could point out some of his issues but he'd talk his way around it. The guy could talk the pants off his grandmother.

I hope he doesn't reply again. I'm trying to chea... I mean win a game of scrabble

Woman's trying to put me off by telling me how hot Robert Pattinson is!

Fucking bitch!

Yeah, shame on us for not showing the proper respect for his man-ness and for not sitting humbly at his feet while he shares his profound wisdom.

We are just women after all and deserve no more respect than any other sex object put on this world to please him. We should be thanking him for telling who and what we REALLY are because his is obviously all knowing and freaking physic and shit.

[/sarcasm]


I guess that's also why he and his buddies can cast all kinds of insults and say all kinds or condescending, derogatory things and the can run and hide behind each other by saying stupid crap about us attacking bi people when we call them on their individual shit.

 

[Wolfman1982]

Here's what I got:

Thanks for the roses. Now shut up.

I did not write shut up, that is possible the most crude and extremely simple round up of that long post, and second of all. The Danish language has a LOT of double meanings and what not. It takes at least three years (if you are not a linguist of all things) to learn the Danish language. It takes a life time to master it, and even then . You are not done learning the Danish language, hell it is just like English. Which I possible think and feel that I master to a certain degree and extend, but even to this day and moment I learn new ways and words to write and understand in the beautiful English language. Shut up in Danish is written in different way. I think I have said my piece about that for now.

I have sadly only met a few transmen over the years here on literotica. And only one in real life, who became my first girlfriend. But of the transmen I have met here, there has been one , or maybe two if I stretch it. Who I could get along with. And why is that ? I actually have no bloody clue, so my conclusion would not be very satisfactory. When it comes to why I could not get along with the rest. But then again not all people can get along just fine with each other.


But I feel, Safe_Bet and the follower Stella_Omega has become the wedges in the LGBT board of all things. And Etoile´s inability to react, other than "now now behave yourselves and naughty naughty" and perhaps even "shame on you ! ! !". Because the moderators (here) are NOT allowed to do more than that. Shows, that something is extremely wrong. And every man or woman who does not share the extreme hostile, vile , aggressive and hateful attitude towards men or women who has a kink on their sexuality. Shies away from this board, or they form groups who are even more closed than they already were, because they are afraid of the wrath of the few. But then there are people who takes the fight up against those few, but powerful because they feel it is WRONG, what the few are doing to all others. I am one of those people, who does not take shit easily.
And I feel thanks to the wedges, that the board has split because of them.
And also they are some of the people, that would not make me come out of the closet, because of their hateful , aggressive , vile , and perhaps even vengeful attitude to other people. I am a bisexual man, but I am in the closet, and why is that ? because of people who are so-called part of the LGBT circle , but then again to me the people like those.. can also be a part of the heterosexual circle of all things. But I am actually a bit shocked to finally witness people on the "inside" being just as dangerous as the ones on the "outside".

So to sum it up, in perhaps a very crude manner , probably even simple. After that "concentrated headache" of a long post of mine.

If Etoile, was allowed to react more like a "moderator" on so many other boards across the internet. We as a whole, would not have experienced the full force of the likes as Safe_Bet And Stella_Omega. Whom I feel, has ruined more on this board than ANY of the so MANY great members I have had the pleasure of meeting and greeting on this board.

 

[Safe_Bet]

Wolfman: sorry, but I'm traveling and using my iPhone so I can't copy your whole long diatribe, but I've got a question for you-

I know you don't like me because I call you on your sexist and xenophobic bullshit, but what is with the attack on Stella O?

All Stella has done is expess her opinions. She DOES get to do that even if she is in disagreement with such wonderful "LGBT Defenders" such as yourself.

You don't need to agree with her (I certainly don't 100%), but you thankfully don't get to tell any of us to STFU. That's why "iggy" should be your best friend.

Oh, and yeah I AM going to keep calling you on it when you insult women or start spouting your anti-everybody but the blue eyed Danes racist and xenophobic BS.

 

[Wolfman1982]

Wolfman: sorry, but I'm traveling and using my iPhone so I can't copy your whole long diatribe, but I've got a question for you-

I know you don't like me because I call you on your sexist and xenophobic bullshit, but what is with the attack on Stella O?

All Stella has done is expess her opinions. She DOES get to do that even if she is in disagreement with such wonderful "LGBT Defenders" such as yourself.

You don't need to agree with her (I certainly don't 100%), but you thankfully don't get to tell any of us to STFU. That's why "iggy" should be your best friend.

Oh, and yeah I AM going to keep calling you on it when you insult women or start spouting your anti-everybody but the blue eyed Danes racist and xenophobic BS.

Undskyld, men jeg tror der er et hak i din plade, fordi De gentager dem selv. Og jeg har vist forklaret før, at jeg er ikke racistisk anlagt og min gamle nu slettede titel som jeg brugte er lagt bag mig. men det ser ud til at De som den eneste person stadig hentyder til den. Og jeg går ud fra, at De ser det som en torn i øjet på dig. Men nuvel at undgå personer er til tider jo godt nok, men selv den mest irriterende og dybt agressive person kan til tider have noget godt og klogt at sige, men jeg tvivler en hel del på De er i et særligt godt sted . Når dine udtalelser bunder på ting som ikke hænger sammen med virkeligheden. Og i det du kalder mig en racist med blå øjne, så kan jeg kun sige. Jeg kunne lige så godt have grønne eller brune, eller for den sags grå, eller en blanding af sort og rød, men nå ja du har ret jeg har blå øjne, men jeg stemmer ikke på de partier som jeg anser som racistiske eller xenofobiske, såsom Dansk Folke Parti. Eller det som er værre. Jeg stemmer derimod socialt og ikke borgerligt. Så nej, jeg er ikke racist. Og jeg kan ikke se ideen med at blive anset som en.