Do you ever say 'No'?

[Recidiva]

Ok, what my Mistress is saying is that she knows knows that she pushes my buttons and in that comes the test of my submission within myself. I feel very free to communicate my feelings and often do. I just do it in a respectful manner. I mean, what does being rude or calling names do but communicate one is not happy. Fine, one is not happy, but why?

Isn't it much better to say, "i really need ..... right now?" Or, "my feelings are hurt over ....." could be the feeling that you are not caring for me, i am not being appreciated, whatever it is conveys more information and opens up communication much better than "fuck off".

Up to this point, I have never felt she is a bitch, thus I have never thought it nor said it. I too believe in not talking behind someone back. I also know my Mistress would never tolerate that kind of disprespect. Everytime I have gotten disciplined, I deserved it. I am a big girl and can take my punishments. I have learned a lot about myself from them, as well as grown in my appreciation and devotion for my Mistress.

That's cool. My husband actually has to be hit with a bat to be made to pay attention at times. Might depend on other people's threshold of urgency of things. For him, the time to pay the electricity bill is when the lights go out. I'm a little more conservative and would rather avoid total calamity whenever possible, he kinda likes to surf disaster.

Never fails I say something politely five times and it's not until I completely lose my temper that he gets it. Then has the gall to say "Why didn't you TELL me this before?!"

He's a retard. He'll admit it. After I take a bat to him.

 

[Recidiva]

We will both be beautiful gay men in head to toe leathers. Learn the hanky codes now, after all the boy scout motto is "be prepared."

I am SO fucking there!

 

[graceanne]

That's cool. My husband actually has to be hit with a bat to be made to pay attention at times. Might depend on other people's threshold of urgency of things. For him, the time to pay the electricity bill is when the lights go out. I'm a little more conservative and would rather avoid total calamity whenever possible, he kinda likes to surf disaster.

Never fails I say something politely five times and it's not until I completely lose my temper that he gets it. Then has the gall to say "Why didn't you TELL me this before?!"

He's a retard. He'll admit it. After I take a bat to him.

Oh, K's like that. Drives me crazy. It's not till I'm so mad that I'm screaming that he hears me. And he, also says, "Well, honey. Why didn't you just say something?"

We've actually worked out a code type thing. First of all, if I'm about to get so mad that I'm screaming (and it takes a lot to do that) I stand in front of the TV while I talk to him. And second I'll say "I'm reaching my 'sreaming mad' place. Please pay attention!" Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. But it's better than before when NOTHING worked.

 

[Netzach]

That's cool. My husband actually has to be hit with a bat to be made to pay attention at times. Might depend on other people's threshold of urgency of things. For him, the time to pay the electricity bill is when the lights go out. I'm a little more conservative and would rather avoid total calamity whenever possible, he kinda likes to surf disaster.

Never fails I say something politely five times and it's not until I completely lose my temper that he gets it. Then has the gall to say "Why didn't you TELL me this before?!"

He's a retard. He'll admit it. After I take a bat to him.

My boy is the organizational powerhouse. I'm the more emotionally equipped of us but not so hot at the mundane stuff. I wonder if this is why I encourage the honest if not always pretty response and I don't really care how it gets done as long as it gets done.

 

[Recidiva]

Oh, K's like that. Drives me crazy. It's not till I'm so mad that I'm screaming that he hears me. And he, also says, "Well, honey. Why didn't you just say something?"

We've actually worked out a code type thing. First of all, if I'm about to get so mad that I'm screaming (and it takes a lot to do that) I stand in front of the TV while I talk to him. And second I'll say "I'm reaching my 'sreaming mad' place. Please pay attention!" Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. But it's better than before when NOTHING worked.

I haven't worked out a code yet. The only thing I know is to just be myself. I used to be tough and stoic, but that really isn't helpful. I'd be a martyr and he'd be clueless. I have to just be myself, be genuinely hurt or just go handle it myself.

He is, however, the only person I know who can take my brand of acerbic frustration and just sorta smile and say "Okay. Yeah. You're right. I can see that. I'm sorry."

He does have a particular expression that when I hit it, I stand up and walk away. I accuse him of having "Jim Face" and that means no matter what I say, I'm only going to be sniped at from a distance. War has been declared and I'm the only one behaving like a diplomat. Conversation is over.

So I used to try to be tough and strong and I'm all that, sure. Turns out that me being in actual pain, though, is the thing he really gets and will do something about.

 

[Recidiva]

My boy is the organizational powerhouse. I'm the more emotionally equipped of us but not so hot at the mundane stuff. I wonder if this is why I encourage the honest if not always pretty response and I don't really care how it gets done as long as it gets done.

I usually have to ferret out every thought he has and when he's behaving stupid, have to figure out what it is and then get him to admit it.

He, however, is the guy that when the house falls apart, he knows exactly how to fix it and I'd only get in the way if I tried to touch anything.

He did manage to teach me many things, stillness, silence, forbearance, and not having to leap like a puppy for reassurance and attention. If he's here, he loves me, he'll always be here. He didn't "teach" me this, he just showed it to me and tried to explain when I asked girl questions.

I need words, so he gives them to me, but mostly he lives where there aren't so many words, things aren't so easily defined, and talk doesn't count for much, only actions.

I'm just glad to be a part of it. Gives my brain a rest.

 

[tempsbrat]

This seems to have to do with the fact that you find a certain phrase disrespectful and disobedient which I don't. Luckily he's my problem not yours.

Yes, I do find that kind of behavior disrespectful and out of line for my relationships and I too will not tolerate being talked to in a rude manner. I am not speaking of "scene play" etc, but day to day communication. I also was not saying what is correct for anyone else's relationship. I really don't understand the apparent hostility to what I view as civilized mature communication between two people who are supposed to love one another.

Yes, it is amazing that we give people we don't really care about much more respect than we do to those closest to us as it is a comfort thing and we don't expect to lose them over it, and we don't like confrontations with strangers typically.

Maybe being a Domme for so long makes me a more obedient or respectful pyl. To each their own.

 

[graceanne]

Yes, I do find that kind of behavior disrespectful and out of line for my relationships and I too will not tolerate being talked to in a rude manner. I am not speaking of "scene play" etc, but day to day communication. I also was not saying what is correct for anyone else's relationship. I really don't understand the apparent hostility to what I view as civilized mature communication between two people who are supposed to love one another.

Yes, it is amazing that we give people we don't really care about much more respect than we do to those closest to us as it is a comfort thing and we don't expect to lose them over it, and we don't like confrontations with strangers typically.

Maybe being a Domme for so long makes me a more obedient or respectful pyl. To each their own.

And how long do you think she's been a domme?

 

[tempsbrat]

That's a good question. She has had Domme aspects for many many years, played off and on real time, and been online a long time. Real life D/s though is newer to her. She has her expectations, and what she will tolerate. As I said in an earlier post, I think things do change once people get into 24/7 D/s. In that (change) I refer to dealing with mundane issues that one does not deal with when one is long distance. How one communicates does not need to change.

I know from my other relationships, both D/s and Vanilla, that I do not cuss at people when I am disagreeing with them, I don't bring up their mothers, their family, their ex's, or any other of a plethora of non-related issues to the disagreement. Mistress and I have had our disagreements, but never have we been disrespectful to one another. I much prefer to stick to the issue, take a time out, and work through it in a caring and loving manner.

 

[graceanne]

That's a good question. She has had Domme aspects for many many years, played off and on real time, and been online a long time. Real life D/s though is newer to her. She has her expectations, and what she will tolerate. As I said in an earlier post, I think things do change once people get into 24/7 D/s. In that (change) I refer to dealing with mundane issues that one does not deal with when one is long distance. How one communicates does not need to change.

I know from my other relationships, both D/s and Vanilla, that I do not cuss at people when I am disagreeing with them, I don't bring up their mothers, their family, their ex's, or any other of a plethora of non-related issues to the disagreement. Mistress and I have had our disagreements, but never have we been disrespectful to one another. I much prefer to stick to the issue, take a time out, and work through it in a caring and loving manner.

Um, ok. Whatever. Netzach's been a domme for nine years, and she switched for years before that. Just because YOU don't like it, doesn't make it the right way. Some people have a sense of humor. As I said, if I didn't tease K he'd think that I was mad. Teasing is how BOTH of use show affection. He teased me, too, cause that's how WE are. Just because YOU don't like it doesn't make it the wrong way, it makes it the wrong way for YOU.

edited to add: Beyond that, neither me or Netzach was talking about when we disagree or are mad at our hubby's. We're talking about everyday instances. If you think that we were talking about only when we argue, then you need to reread what we said.

 

[tempsbrat]

I also was not saying what is correct for anyone else's relationship. I really don't understand the apparent hostility to what I view as civilized mature communication between two people who are supposed to love one another.

Um, ok. Whatever. Netzach's been a domme for nine years, and she switched for years before that. Just because YOU don't like it, doesn't make it the right way. Some people have a sense of humor. As I said, if I didn't tease K he'd think that I was mad. Teasing is how BOTH of use show affection. He teased me, too, cause that's how WE are. Just because YOU don't like it doesn't make it the wrong way, it makes it the wrong way for YOU.

Jeeze.... I stand by what I said, and still don't get the hostility or apparent pissing contest. I NEVER said any way was the RIGHT way. Let's see, all in all now, I guess I have been in D/s some 15 years, big deal. We each have our own ways. I've been a switch and now I am soley pyl.

You don't know me. I shared my experiences and for whatever reason some took what I said to be saying what they do is wrong, despite my clearly stating that how I live my life is my choice and how you live yours is yours. To each their own and may all be happy.

 

[graceanne]

This seems to have to do with the fact that you find a certain phrase disrespectful and disobedient which I don't. Luckily he's my problem not yours.

Yes, it is amazing that we give people we don't really care about much more respect than we do to those closest to us as it is a comfort thing and we don't expect to lose them over it, and we don't like confrontations with strangers typically.

Maybe being a Domme for so long makes me a more obedient or respectful pyl. To each their own.

Sounds like you were attacking to me. Especially the last line about how you're a a more obedient and respectful pyl. If I'm wrong, I apologize, but I don't think I am.

 

[SweetDommes]

Its a sad fact that we can't live in fantasy, BDSM or D/s world on a 24/7 basis.

Real life creeps in and brings with it the reality of dishes needing washed, cars needing cleaned, tears needing mopped up, family needing our time and efforts.

We all have bad days and sometimes the very worst of times occur in our personal lives, completely seperate to any D/s or BDSM things we may want or need in our lives.

How do people deal with this if they are in a D/s relationship?

For example if your a pyl and your PYL asks you to do something that for whatever reason you do not feel able to perform?
I am not talking about not wanting to but feeling unable to, perhaps due to a reality elsewhere in your life that is taking up all of your mental and or physical ability.
Nor am I necessarily talking about a sexual aspect, it could be as simple as putting the rubbish out or making fresh coffee.

Do you 'perform' the task and hope it works out ok, do you explain how you feel at that point in time and hope they understand or do you end up arguing or disagreeing with them?


In a similiar vein PYL's how do you cope when you have personal issues that hinder your ability to play, plan use or whatever your pyl?
Sometimes reality can take up so much head space it leaves little room to make your pyl feel cared for or wanted.
Do you play 'just because,' do you explain the situation and promise normal service will resume in due course and in the meantime hope your relationship can cope or do you find an alternative way forward.

Please don't give me the answers that say 'good PYL/pyl should know your mood and gauge it all accordingly etc'

We are all only human, even PYLs!

Our boys always have the option of saying 'no' ... as long as there is a good reason (and no, "I don't want to" is not a good reason). Especially after ghosst almost died because of his gall bladder, we are very well aware that day to day life sometimes HAS to supercede the D/s part of our relationship. When our second boy broke his wrist ... he can only do so much one handed - and of course, the wrist he broke was his dominant side. Things happen so that we don't feel like dominating or they don't feel like serving (or we/they aren't capable).
When they say "no" (or any variation of it), there is discussion ... with cuddling, most of the time. We don't get upset unless it's something that we have discussed before and have told them is not an excuse (a hang nail is no excuse for not doing laundry ... that's just an example, not something that they have either one actually said). Most of the time, we can guage how they are feeling and give them instructions accordingly, but hey, everyone makes mistakes - and we allow for that. We are only human and we don't see everything (and ghosst has a history of trying to hide how sick he really is *glares*).

I hope that you are feeling better soon, if you aren't already, shy slave.

Miss Karen

 

[SweetDommes]

Sounds like you were attacking to me. Especially the last line about how you're a a more obedient and respectful pyl. If I'm wrong, I apologize, but I don't think I am.

I didn't actually see it as attacking directly ... it seemed more like passive-agressive behavior to me ...

 

[graceanne]

I didn't actually see it as attacking directly ... it seemed more like passive-agressive behavior to me ...

Arg. True enough, but I don't care. She was passively attacking. It's still rude, and frankly passive agressive people just TICK ME OFF.

How are you all doing? You haven't been around for a while.

 

[SweetDommes]

Arg. True enough, but I don't care. She was passively attacking. It's still rude, and frankly passive agressive people just TICK ME OFF.

How are you all doing? You haven't been around for a while.

We have been busy - moving our second boy in and getting used to him, plus dealing with ghosst being sick, and working all the time, and ... and ... and ... you know how things are.

 

[graceanne]

We have been busy - moving our second boy in and getting used to him, plus dealing with ghosst being sick, and working all the time, and ... and ... and ... you know how things are.

You got a new boy? That's awesome! Did you tell everyone and I missed it somehow?

 

[tempsbrat]

Graceanne, I can see your point. For me, telling someone to "fuck off" in a serious way, not some tongue in cheek manner is extremely rude. I definately don't see it as a sign of obedience or respect to speak that way to anyone. Again, if it doesn't bother you fine.

I do know from my experience as a Domme and talking to other PYL's that any sub who spoke that way would be disciplined. Any partner who spoke to me that way would not be my partner for long. Granted they would never get to that stage of "partner" with me either.

 

[tempsbrat]

Hmmm, passive aggressive is not something I am ever used to being called. Maybe it's my matter of fact tone which is just how I am. I do tend to be a very serious individual.... typical scorpio trait.

I do apologize if I offended anyone with my views. I was not intending to attack or be passively aggressive. I say things how I see them, and I guess this issue is a touchy one for me.

Have a good day.

 

[graceanne]

Graceanne, I can see your point. For me, telling someone to "fuck off" in a serious way, not some tongue in cheek manner is extremely rude. I definately don't see it as a sign of obedience or respect to speak that way to anyone. Again, if it doesn't bother you fine.

I do know from my experience as a Domme and talking to other PYL's that any sub who spoke that way would be disciplined. Any partner who spoke to me that way would not be my partner for long. Granted they would never get to that stage of "partner" with me either.

I didn't say I'd say it seriously. I said that it was teasing. I know him well enough to know when I can tease him and when I can't. I've been with him nine years now. And Netzach said that M's very obedient, so I'm going to guess that when he says 'fuck, no', he's joking TOO.

 

[shy slave]

Wow, you have some sleep, visit parents and the thread goes from taking one sentence apart to what constitutes disrespect!

Marquis we may need some of those lawyer style skills in here soon.

Everybodys relationship is different.

Thats what makes them unique.

I tease Andante alot. He ignores it or laughs and sometimes reminds me that I have now earned an interesting payback (see other threads for that one ).

However none of my teasing is disrespectful. I only bother with it if I like you.

It does include swear words, but I swear alot so that does not have any additional emphasis. I have it on good authority from my sons that the time I am really angry is when I stop shouting, don't swear and my voice is quiet.

Andante hasn't driven me to it yet, but it early days lol

Personally I talk alot (don't faint Gracie, its true!), I can't expect him to listen to everything I say, hell even I don't do that!

But on a very low, difficult day if he were to ask something of me, I am aware it could go in either direction depending on the reason for my mood.

If its due to private issues I may simply do as he asked, then sulk about the fact he never noticed I was having a low day.
I may ignore him and pretend I had not heard or I may simply ignore him and walk away, until my mood improves.
If I have no idea how I will react how can he possibly know.

If The mood is due to pressure from my family its highly likely I will yell at him, slam around, then sulk and at one time would have thrown things that make a lovely smashing sound as the hit the floor. Over the years I have discovered I hate cleaning up and it makes me feel foolish so I try to resist that now.

Andante and I have yet to get to this point with a low mood of mine. So far, he has been able to spot them a mile off and its been me offering to do things for him to take my mind of issues, rather than the other way round.

On his stressful days I am not so sure I am adept at noticing, and when I do, I don't always know what to do.

I hate that helpless feeling when someone you love is suffering in some way.

Recidiva mentioned when her husband talked about the bananas needing to go in the bin, rather than actually doing it himself.

Its that kind of thing that in a vanilla relationship you could argue about but in a relationship that is strctly D/s with controlled guidelines may not be dealt with in the same way.

OSG doesn't post often now, which is a pity I like her take on life, but I can imagine she would not take issue with the mundane stuff we all deal with, but would find another way around it.

However tempsbrat chose to put her point across, I admire someone who can be so polite to her Mistress on all occasions. I am not sure I can be that at every given time. More easily on big issues but its the small ones that really annoy me at times.

Thanks for giving the Domme side Miss Karen, wondered where you three had been hiding (comments about playing doctors and nurses spring to mind....)

The Dom/mes in this thread appear fairly united in the belief that 'I don't want to' is not a good reason.
I am guessing if they add into that reasons why they don't want to ~ health, emotional, mental then maybe some Dom/Mes would reconsider.

Another side to it is the idea of pain raising endorphin levels, so if a pyl has a low mood due to mental health reasons a pain session may help to raise the mood. This comes from a vague memory of a thread about Russia using whipping as a cure for depression.

Sometimes other people know what we need more than we realise, we cannot always be rational about ourselves. You gave the example of Ghosst hiding how unwell he was, the other side of that is feeling so low we cannot motivate ourselves or so hyper we cannot stop.

Miss Karen you mention times when you may not feel like dominating, what happens then if one of your boys starts to feel neglected and perhaps insecure. Do you play/scene/whatever to re-dress the balance or do you cuddle and take time out to do other thinsg together.

On a final note, a personal plea, could you edit your post to indicate that a hangnail IS a good reason to say 'No' (just between us, of course)
Thank you

 

[shy slave]

We have been busy - moving our second boy in and getting used to him, plus dealing with ghosst being sick, and working all the time, and ... and ... and ... you know how things are.

NEW BOY!!!

You never said...

Please hijack the thread and tell us about it.

Gracie and I want details LOTS of details!!

Err If thats ok with you Miss Karen

(why is there no bowing and scraping emoticion?? )

 

[graceanne]

NEW BOY!!!

You never said...

Please hijack the thread and tell us about it.

Gracie and I want details LOTS of details!!

Err If thats ok with you Miss Karen

(why is there no bowing and scraping emoticion?? )

Everyone else has one, but since no one can imagien you bowing and scraping they wouldn't let you have one.

 

[shy slave]

Everyone else has one, but since no one can imagien you bowing and scraping they wouldn't let you have one.

LOL

I do that stuff, really I do...

All it takes is a trail of chocolate and I am down on my knees begging, bowing, scraping the whole nine yards.

You make me sound like an unsubmitting slave or a wannabe Domme

Wherever did you get that idea


Miss Karen are you still thinking about that edit request?

Graceanne has cookies, I will make her give you some if you can do such a small, little thing for me

 

[graceanne]

LOL

I do that stuff, really I do...

All it takes is a trail of chocolate and I am down on my knees begging, bowing, scraping the whole nine yards.

You make me sound like an unsubmitting slave or a wannabe Domme

Wherever did you get that idea


Miss Karen are you still thinking about that edit request?

Graceanne has cookies, I will make her give you some if you can do such a small, little thing for me

Make, my foot. Curiousity is killing the cat, and I'll WILINGLY give you some if you tell us!