Kim's poly/kink thread reinvented ...

[KimGordon67]

I believe it's actually a reference to chaos theory, a branch of mathematics. Here's a quote from Wikipedia:

Chaos theory is an interdisciplinary theory stating that, within the apparent randomness of chaotic complex systems, there are underlying patterns, interconnectedness, constant feedback loops, repetition, self-similarity, fractals, and self-organization.

I assume the songwriter was thinking more about Life rather than about physical forces and systems, though.

Maybe. She's quite well read. It wouldn't surprise me if she knew about chaos theory in the physical sense. But I think that summary is apt.

 

[ouchfeelsgood]

It's actually a song lyric from a local band, probably 15-20 years old ... but definitely a transferable concept. To be honest, I don't even know if I could say what it 'means' with any degree of certainty ... that there's consistency in the chaos? That the chaos is consistent? Something else? I think that's one of the things I like about it.

Ok. That makes sense in a very chaotic way. Any other philosophically-oriented tattoos on elsewhere on your body?

 

[KimGordon67]

Ok. That makes sense in a very chaotic way. Any other philosophically-oriented tattoos on elsewhere on your body?

No - my only other one is an entirely predictable Celtic-based armband. I'm thinking of getting the lyrics that are currently in my signature on my other forearm though. And some bands around my wrists.

 

[numeniusa]

No - my only other one is an entirely predictable Celtic-based armband. I'm thinking of getting the lyrics that are currently in my signature on my other forearm though. And some bands around my wrists.

"My profile is hopelessly out of date"

 

[KimGordon67]

"My profile is hopelessly out of date"

I can totally see that working.

 

[KimGordon67]

.....

 

[HotBrand]

Damn it.

I've only just discovered your thread and I might be too late for contributing.

Rather than spilling my life story, I just wanted to say that this thread was a fantastic idea, and I hope some like-minded individuals will help keep this going.

There have been some lovely opinions and ideas in here!

 

[AnnieLit]

I hope some like-minded individuals will help keep this going.

There have been some lovely opinions and ideas in here!

This is, to a big degree, Kim's personal playground. When she feels like talking, she comes back and the place lights up for a while. And when she is not here it's a desert.

 

[AngelicaS1780]

This is, to a big degree, Kim's personal playground. When she feels like talking, she comes back and the place lights up for a while. And when she is not here it's a desert.

I'm hoping that she hasn't been around because she's been busy enjoying her December visitor.

 

[Moochienanu]

I'm hoping that she hasn't been around because she's been busy enjoying her December visitor.

I was thinking the same thing.

 

[HotBrand]

This is, to a big degree, Kim's personal playground. When she feels like talking, she comes back and the place lights up for a while. And when she is not here it's a desert.

I hope she returns soon then. It's a great thread and I'm curious to find out if my opinions and lifestyle choices are vastly different to others.

I'm hoping that she hasn't been around because she's been busy enjoying her December visitor.

Oh? Lucky, lucky her. I hope so too.

 

[AnnieLit]

I'm hoping that she hasn't been around because she's been busy enjoying her December visitor.

I hope this is the case!

 

[HotBrand]

Impatiently waiting for Kim to light up this place.

To quote the words of Albert Einstein*: "let's have a wonderful conversation about the concept of polyamorous relationships and non-monogamy."

* may not have been said by Albert Einstein.

 

[KimGordon67]

Oh dear ... now I feel a little remiss for not having checked on this thread for a while.

Unfortunately the December shenanigans did not happen. Everything just got a bit intense, and then he had some health scare (which I never found out of the particulars of, but apparently wasn't life threatening), and it all ground to a fairly sudden halt. I was really quite sad about that for a while, but luckily December was pretty full of celebrations (two 50th birthday parties on consecutive weekends), which took my mind off things. Or destroyed the brain cells that were being sad. Or something.

I thought I might branch out from the swingers site, in part because I'm trying to work out how to meet someone who brings the kink ... so I joined up with FetLife. Not sure how I'm feeling about that. The people are generally lovely, but it does come with the small problem of any connection being *based* in kink, and I'm not really sure that works for me.
Then I created yet another Tinder profile, and ended up matching with a local guy who, in all honesty, I only swiped right on because he was 8 km away. (His profile consists of a photo of him surfing, and another of him drinking beer, and no words.) We matched just before Christmas, and I was at a friends on Christmas day and nattering about Tinder and stuff with the people who were there and mentioned that I'd matched with someone local who obviously surfed, and the young guy sitting next to me said 'Oh - I wonder if I know him', so I showed him the two photos, and of course he did know him - not even through surfing, they work in the same general area. Anyway, it was good to get verification that he was OK, and we met up for a drink a couple of days after Christmas. Meeting people from Tinder is so weird - you really can't just launch straight into asking them about their specific sexual preferences, so we spent a lot of time talking about real estate. He's definitely keen though - has been messaging very consistently since then. I didn't really have any spare space to see him again until now, so he's coming over for dinner tonight ... will be interesting to see how that works out. He's in the pretty classic 'man alone' mould - lives in a decommissioned church out of town that he's renovating ... and has been renovating for the last seven years. Apparently moving the shower inside has not been a priority, although given that he surfs this probably makes sense. Nice thing about surfers - even at our advanced age, they're still pretty fit and healthy.

And had an interesting experience a few days ago finally meeting up with someone who I met on a local dating site literally years ago. We get on really well, know a few of the same people, but he lives a fair distance away, and we just never worked out getting together. But he was on holiday with his now-girlfriend, and they spent a couple of days staying in town, so I showed them around, we drank some wine together, and just generally had a nice time. He actually introduced me to the swingers site, so there was so potential there for something .... 'interesting' ... but I had my teenager in the house, and he's always my priority when he's here. Pity, because I definitely fancied this guy, and we all got on really well.

So, we'll see how thing go tonight ...

 

[Paul_Chance]

Happy New Year

Glad to see you peeking your head back in and keeping us up on your adventures in Polyland.

 

[HotBrand]

I adored the update of what is going on, Kim ... even if there were downs as well as ups!

So, we'll see how thing go tonight ...

How did things go? I've been assuming your silence is a very, very positive thing!

 

[KimGordon67]

I adored the update of what is going on, Kim ... even if there were downs as well as ups!



How did things go? I've been assuming your silence is a very, very positive thing!

LOL ... maybe. Things seem to be going well, although not with great speed (which is fine with me). There was a rousing afternoon bout of oral, and some saucy messaging since then. I think I'm seeing him sometime later this week ... He's a very good kisser, and smells nice. These are important things.

 

[KimGordon67]

And all is going well. We've had a few afternoons meetings that have been a heap of fun. Things that are good ...
- he doesn't cum immediately (actually, tbh, he hasn't cum at all the times we've been together, but this is something I'm not unfamiliar with).
- he makes me laugh, and doesn't take himself too seriously (e.g. after a shower the other, came back into the bedroom wearing my knickers - sheer, black, I have to say they looked very fetching on him).
- talk during sex. I love that.
- lots of eye contact during sex. I love that too. Having someone look you in the eyes while you're cumming is one of the hottest things there is.

Something that has made me go 'hmmm' ... he definitely only wants to get together for a couple of hours of fun when it suits the both of us. No staying over, no doing other stuff out of the house, no 'dating' type of things. I really didn't think I was wanting that ... the random hook up thing has always felt a bit soulless to me ... and I was on the verge of saying 'this isn't going to work for me'. But it kind of IS working. It doesn't feel soulless, and I don't feel like I could be just anyone. When he's here, he's totally into me. So while it's not ideal, maybe I need to not have such tight boundaries around 'what I want', and just let things be good when they're good.

And the quandry ... if you meet someone on Tinder - i.e. an app that's pretty vanilla - how do you go about working out if they're into the kinky fuckery? I'm really a bit stuck with this. There's little indications he might be, but I can't tell if I'm just over-reading ... maybe twisting your fingers into the roots of someone's hair and pulling their head back while you're fucking is perfectly usual. I know I'll work it out, and one of the good things is that he's pretty open to talking ... like, the whole 'here are the boundaries of this thing' conversation was started by him.

There's definitely been a couple of moments that have made me go a bit weak at the knees, in the good way. So I guess we'll see ...

 

[Paul_Chance]

I am definitely a fan of talk and eye contact during sex.

I've found over the years one of the big advantages (for me at least) of non-monogamous/poly relationships is the ability to craft a satisfying relationship out of the complexities of individual lives.

You can have a meaningful, fun, relationship without having to make all the parts of our lives fit together. You're much more likely to "take the good, leave the bad".

As for moving from the ordinary (I dislike the term vanilla - I happen to think vanilla is a great flavor, especially French Vanilla Ice Cream) to the kink, the approach I've developed is to bring it up early in conversation and see how they react. Often you'll find that two people have complementary kinks, or variations on the theme, but they're both hesitant to bring it up.

Start at a low level and build from there - and focus on the the kinks you want done to you (you can then build up to the kinks you want to do to them). A friend of mine is way more straight forward then I am, and just straight out says "If you're going to be my lover, you need to know that I like bondage. It's my thing." I've used that approach as well - just the straight up, straight in approach.

 

[KimGordon67]

I am definitely a fan of talk and eye contact during sex.

I've found over the years one of the big advantages (for me at least) of non-monogamous/poly relationships is the ability to craft a satisfying relationship out of the complexities of individual lives.

You can have a meaningful, fun, relationship without having to make all the parts of our lives fit together. You're much more likely to "take the good, leave the bad".

As for moving from the ordinary (I dislike the term vanilla - I happen to think vanilla is a great flavor, especially French Vanilla Ice Cream) to the kink, the approach I've developed is to bring it up early in conversation and see how they react. Often you'll find that two people have complementary kinks, or variations on the theme, but they're both hesitant to bring it up.

Start at a low level and build from there - and focus on the the kinks you want done to you (you can then build up to the kinks you want to do to them). A friend of mine is way more straight forward then I am, and just straight out says "If you're going to be my lover, you need to know that I like bondage. It's my thing." I've used that approach as well - just the straight up, straight in approach.

Yes, the obvious answer to the 'I really want someone to 'do' stuff with' is to find someone who likes doing stuff. Although I have to say I'm a bit confused by the whole 'this is only a casual every-now-and-then when-we-have-a-spare-hour thing' statement being followed up by daily messaging, even when he's out of town with work. In fact, my phone's just beeped now with an alert that I'm pretty sure is him, and it's 7.30am. So we'll see. A couple of people I've talked to have a couple of different theories about what's going on there. A point in his favour is that he did instigate the whole 'what are we doing here' conversation, so he obviously does like things to be clear, which I appreciate ... even if his actions seem to suggest something else. But it's not irritating me, so I'll just go with that. And organise to meet up with the other guy I managed to connect with on Tinder, who does seem to be into 'doing stuff'.

The other quandry seems to have been at least partially resolved in the classic Kiwi fashion of making a joke about it. A text conversation a couple of days ago that started with him asking if I wanted to catch up Thursday evening, and me saying that would be good because I'd be tied up with other thing for the weekend (yes, that was a deliberate choice of words on my part) ended with him saying 'I'll bring rope'. If he really DOES bring rope, it's probably a little early in the game for that sort of thing, but at least the topic has been broached, and there's a space to talk about that a bit more. I'm still not entirely sure about the whole kink thing ... for me to really go down that path, I need to trust someone - obviously - but in my case, that means not just knowing that they'll stop if I say 'Stop' (which is my terribly original safe word), but that they care enough to be paying attention, including during the time after I say 'stop'. I'm not sure if that aligns with the level of casualness he SAYS he wants.
But I also need to stop fucking over-thinking things so much.
It also does mean that starting slow is a definite. Also, I just prefer that because it gives you time to discover things about each other (and yourself). If you're suspended from the ceiling and being flogged with a bull whip on the second date, it kind of takes the fun surprises out of the whole process.

I'm OK with 'vanilla' - I just see it as descriptive, rather than a necessarily negative term. And there's such a wide range of vanilla flavours, from the cheap generic supermarket vanilla, to the really delicious creamy ice cream with actual vanilla beans in it. Also, you can add toppings, so it becomes vanilla+

It was him messaging. Sending smut. We're at the exchanging-smut point, while he's out of town working. I like that. Keeps things interesting.

 

[Paul_Chance]

Like any negotiation, the initial stages of a relationship usually involve some sort of "back and forth" where it's not unusual for people to reveal "partial motivations" and "partial intentions". It's a rare person who can and will lay it all on the line. So, personally, I always approach that phase of a relationship with a degree of human understanding. The dichotomy between "let's be super casual" but "I'll text or call semi-obsessively" isn't that uncommon as you both are searching for the boundaries of the relationship. Early relationships are relatively unformed - it's take time to form and firm up. I wouldn't read too much into any observations early on (except deal-breakers of course).

When you're arranging your next rendevous simply open with "Saturday. Bring Rope. Red." Then, see if he does. (I would )

 

[KimGordon67]

Like any negotiation, the initial stages of a relationship usually involve some sort of "back and forth" where it's not unusual for people to reveal "partial motivations" and "partial intentions". It's a rare person who can and will lay it all on the line. So, personally, I always approach that phase of a relationship with a degree of human understanding. The dichotomy between "let's be super casual" but "I'll text or call semi-obsessively" isn't that uncommon as you both are searching for the boundaries of the relationship. Early relationships are relatively unformed - it's take time to form and firm up. I wouldn't read too much into any observations early on (except deal-breakers of course).

When you're arranging your next rendevous simply open with "Saturday. Bring Rope. Red." Then, see if he does. (I would )

I somehow only just saw this ... and yes, I know what you mean. I guess this is the first time I've been in a situation where things are explicated in black & white - usually I just see what happens, but that can be super-confusing ... unlike this, which is also super-confusing, but I sort of feel clearer because there's some sort of baseline that was established. Or something. Fuck, I don't know ... I just really like fucking him, and enjoy the hanging out bits before and after as well.

The other stuff ... I also don't know. He definitely wants to know what pushes my buttons, and has been pretty good at responding to low-level suggestions. And actually does seem to be paying attention and have some concern for not doing the 'bad' hurting. But I feel like it would be good establish where the boundaries are, at least for now (given that we all know how susceptible boundaries are to shifting ), for everyone. So then we can just focus on enjoying playing within those boundaries ... brilliant! That makes so much sense to me now that I've actually said it out loud. I've bolded the important bit for my own future reference.

 

[Paul_Chance]

I somehow only just saw this ... and yes, I know what you mean. I guess this is the first time I've been in a situation where things are explicated in black & white - usually I just see what happens, but that can be super-confusing ... unlike this, which is also super-confusing, but I sort of feel clearer because there's some sort of baseline that was established. Or something. Fuck, I don't know ... I just really like fucking him, and enjoy the hanging out bits before and after as well.

The other stuff ... I also don't know. He definitely wants to know what pushes my buttons, and has been pretty good at responding to low-level suggestions. And actually does seem to be paying attention and have some concern for not doing the 'bad' hurting. But I feel like it would be good establish where the boundaries are, at least for now (given that we all know how susceptible boundaries are to shifting ), for everyone. So then we can just focus on enjoying playing within those boundaries ... brilliant! That makes so much sense to me now that I've actually said it out loud. I've bolded the important bit for my own future reference.

I think one of the advantages of a poly relationship is the ability to just like the fucking and hanging out, without piling all the other stuff of life on top of it, trying to attain some degree of perfection. Humans are messy. Poly/non-monogamous allows you to celebrate the messiness without it breaking the relationship.

I'm an advocate of a sexually open conversation relatively early in a relationship. Establish the "no, not gonna do it" things, the "yes, I'm in" and the "conditional exploration" areas. A simple statement like "I enjoy bondage" has a lot wrapped in it - including "no, yes, maybe" variations. Make a game of it, like "never have I ever".

 

[KimGordon67]

Ha ha - we were messaging last night to arrange seeing each other this evening, and I suggested we might have a chat about 'other things we might like' ... he seemed pretty amenable to that (actually, he said 'send me a wish list'), so there's no going back now.

I'm utterly perplexed that I'm finding this so difficult.

 

[Paul_Chance]

Ha ha - we were messaging last night to arrange seeing each other this evening, and I suggested we might have a chat about 'other things we might like' ... he seemed pretty amenable to that (actually, he said 'send me a wish list'), so there's no going back now.

I'm utterly perplexed that I'm finding this so difficult.

Send the wish list! (Now me, with my strange sense of humor, the wish list would contain some strange things, just to break the ice. You have to be careful though, because they might point at the strange thing and say "Yes, that!") It's a perfect opportunity to send a few pictures that give you butterflies in a good way.

As for the perplexed part - that's a good chance to still in contemplation and explore why you're perplexed. (That's the Buddhist in me who contemplates all kinds of things to explore them.)

And for no reason the thought of a wish list reminded me of a funny story a friend of mine once told me - about the time she had a three some with a stripper and a guy in a chicken suit.