Projection v/s Reality

[Netzach]

I don't think I'm a bitch. Other people have begged to differ.

A lot of it is cultural though, being where I'm from. We tell the people we love most what we think of them without pulling punches, to the people we don't care about you do "nice."

One thing I find interesting and sometimes worrying is that I know I tend to test people I love most. Little weird barometers I just can't help myself from using, lest they abandon me, which of course, drive sane people away.

When I'm with a submissive partner who submits according to my needs - I find that I use these barometers much less and any "testing" in fact serves to bond us. So for me, it's a positive kind of compensation and explains the way that D/s or S/m keeps me on track and balanced-feeling.

 

[JMohegan]

I know certain things about myself. I am not a bully. But I'll tell a rube to fuck off here and in real life. I have little patience for foolishness and I'll say so if it's put in my face

I don't think I'm a bitch. Other people have begged to differ.

The difference between a bully/bitch on the one hand, and strong/admirably outspoken person on the other, is not defined by behavior itself - but rather by the observer's sense of whether the behavior is justified.

What's foolish to one person appears reasonable, or at least understandable, to another. It's not the telling off itself that ultimately matters in making the bitch distinction. Instead, it is the observer's perception of the one being told off or attacked.

 

[Primalex]

Anyway, I never truly know what someone else thinks of me. Everyone is so nice. They say such nice things but hell that's polite in this society.

I do know some people around here take on the mantle of disliked person or bitch when really they are just insecure. I know I am too. Maybe we all are?

Ahhh, the affectation of the human mind so very well displayed. Either conform to the norm or have a mental problem.

 

[A Desert Rose]

Since it's not always clear to a reader why a certain word is used or how it's defined by the writer, often the judgements by the reader are inaccureate.

I choose the word foolish for a reason. It was less offensive than other choices like rude, mean, unkind, cruel, belittleing of others, crude, condescending, patronizing. I was attempting not to offend or single out any ONE person, but to use a word that was as neutral and less offensive as I could find.

 

[A Desert Rose]

Interesting contrast, Netz. I think what he's saying is it's complimentary to be a bitch (you) but I'm the bully.

LOL

 

[RJMasters]

Interesting contrast, Netz. I think what he's saying is it's complimentary to be a bitch (you) but I'm the bully.

LOL

hmmm I didn't read it that way.

I think both your quotes were not a comparison to each other, but were more like each of them had some relevance to the point he was making, speaking more to your quote, in that its the attackee rather than the attacker which ultimately decides if a person should wear the title bitch or not, though I could be wrong. I am sure he will clarify though.

 

[JMohegan]

Since it's not always clear to a reader why a certain word is used or how it's defined by the writer, often the judgements by the reader are inaccureate.

I choose the word foolish for a reason. It was less offensive than other choices like rude, mean, unkind, cruel, belittleing of others, crude, condescending, patronizing. I was attempting not to offend or single out any ONE person, but to use a word that was as neutral and less offensive as I could find.

Your first sentence here contains the essence of my point.

What you read, hear, or see as rude, mean, unkind, cruel, belittleing of others, crude, condescending, or patronizing, etc. may be viewed in an entirely different way by someone else. So if you verbally slam one whom you view as unnecessarily rude, etc., your behavior will be viewed one way by those who view the subject of your attack the same way, and another way by those who view the subject differently.

That was general "you". Not specifically A Desert Rose.

 

[Netzach]

I read it the way RJ did, actually.

When being called a bitch or anything else, I consider the source. Also repetition of the message sometimes means there's a point in stepping back and considering it may be true.

Ever notice how some people are SO poorly socialized 9000 people could tell them they're an asshole and they don't see it? It's not being a maverick, it's being a schmuck.

 

[JMohegan]

hmmm I didn't read it that way.

I think both your quotes were not a comparison to each other, but were more like each of them had some relevance to the point he was making, speaking more to your quote, in that its the attackee rather than the attacker which ultimately decides if a person should wear the title bitch or not, though I could be wrong. I am sure he will clarify though.

Exactly. Thank you, RJ.

I tried to make this clear by writing:

"bitch/bully on the one hand"

"and strong/admirably outspoken person on the other"


Bully (Desert Rose's word) and Bitch (Netzach's) were deliberately lumped together. But the most important point here is that I was not writing commentary on either of you as individuals. Instead, I was just making an observation of perceptions overall.

 

[A Desert Rose]

I guess my reading comprehension sucks and I apologize for not understanding the message. I have a tendency to be paranoid (as opposed to insecure) about a lot of things, lately. Thank you for clarifying it for me.

I know this:
I've been unkind to people and I feel badly about it. I've tried to improve on this. I believe that everyone can change behaviors that are negative. I believe it takes discipline and time out to think of how it would be to stand in their shoes. I try to take a step back when I interact with people and take a bigger view of things. (Partly because I feel paranoid a lot of the time and that has a tendency to cloud the picture.)

I think that there is always room to improve. There are many things about me that I like and that I'm happy with. There are others sides to me that I know I can make better. The test for me is that if it makes me feel bad about myself, then I need to change it. It's most important to me, how I preceive myself, not how others do. I am dissatisfied and ashamed of who I was and I'm not satisfied with who I am now. I can be a better person.

I'm sure that posts could be dug up from 3, 4, 5 years ago that illustrate how unkind I can be. (That's not an invitation, so please don't do that. I'm ashamed enough, thank you.) I hope that I am no longer that person. Or at least, that I'm no longer mostly that person.

I couldn't be satisfied with "I'm a bully, and that's that" or "I'm a bitch, deal with it." I believe there is more to Roxanne than those negative definitions, as is true with everyone else.

I won't settle for those narrow definitions of me (by me). I know that with discipline I can be better than that.

 

[nh23]

BiBunny's post about being painfully shy....when i noticed she tries to project the image of being such a BITCH made me wonder how many other of us overcompensate for our insecurities to the point of it being quite obvious. Like for instance i'm very personable and friendly because it conceals that i'm actually very private and untrusting of others, aloof and wary. Like when i was amazed that so many were "shocked" ~gasp~ that someone was offended by thin remarks when they splash nude images daily of themselves on the internet....ah DUH! i think IMO it's obvious "that's why" they posted images of themselves constantly because "they were" so insecure about their looks.

Everyone feel free to ignore me and pretend this doesn't apply to you...the rest of us have you figured out anyway


pet

You know what..another thing that has been on my mind. Maybe people's perceptions of someone else are what makes someone what they are too. I mean ok..I'm bitchy..Bunny's bitchy. But would making a thread like this make you a bitch? A thread pointing out your feelings on why you think a particular person is bitchy? I mean if Bunny or I had started this thread I'm pretty sure we'd have been called out for it. And yes called bitches. So maybe it has to do with how well the person posting is liked..to a degree. Do you think?

 

[Kajira Callista]

You know what..another thing that has been on my mind. Maybe people's perceptions of someone else are what makes someone what they are too. I mean ok..I'm bitchy..Bunny's bitchy. But would making a thread like this make you a bitch? A thread pointing out your feelings on why you think a particular person is bitchy? I mean if Bunny or I had started this thread I'm pretty sure we'd have been called out for it. And yes called bitches. So maybe it has to do with how well the person posting is liked..to a degree. Do you think?

Why would making this thread make people perceive the person as a bitch? Why would you think you would be called a bitch for starting the thread?

 

[nh23]

Why would making this thread make people perceive the person as a bitch? Why would you think you would be called a bitch for starting the thread?

Well if I started a thread and said..hmm.. for example, I've noticed that X talks themselves up at every moment, and has a grandiose sense of self..and I believe the reason for it is that X is a narcissist. Naming X by name of course..Think I'd be called a bitch? If not I have a lot of threads I'd like to start.

 

[Kajira Callista]

Well if I started a thread and said..hmm.. for example, I've noticed that X talks themselves up at every moment, and has a grandiose sense of self..and I believe the reason for it is that X is a narcissist. Naming X by name of course..Think I'd be called a bitch? If not I have a lot of threads I'd like to start.

You want to start the threads... why?
Because you think that shining a bad light on X makes you look better. Self esteem issues are way way easy to see, no matter how the person tries to cover em or reverse em or whatever.

 

[nh23]

You want to start the threads... why?
Because you think that shining a bad light on X makes you look better. Self esteem issues are way way easy to see, no matter how the person tries to cover em or reverse em or whatever.

Ah, so see? I have a bit of a point, do I not? So the whole reason for this thread? Or pointing Bunny out by name?

 

[Kajira Callista]

Ah, so see? I have a bit of a point, do I not? So the whole reason for this thread? Or pointing Bunny out by name?

I don't think any harm was meant by using something said in another thread to start a thread that would stray off topic number one. What do you think the point of this thread was?

 

[nh23]

I don't think any harm was meant by using something said in another thread to start a thread that would stray off topic number one. What do you think the point of this thread was?

Haha.. I feel like we're in the question thread. Maybe no harm was meant. But it's all a matter of perspective isn't it? Wouldn't it have been more polite to have started it using X as an example instead of naming someone in particular? Maybe Bunny is sensitive about her shyness etc..and someone pointing it out and starting a thread using her as an example might be hurtful. Not that I know..we've not discussed it..just saying. Is it ok because she's percieved as a bitch?

 

[BiBunny]

Haha.. I feel like we're in the question thread. Maybe no harm was meant. But it's all a matter of perspective isn't it? Wouldn't it have been more polite to have started it using X as an example instead of naming someone in particular? Maybe Bunny is sensitive about her shyness etc..and someone pointing it out and starting a thread using her as an example might be hurtful. Not that I know..we've not discussed it..just saying. Is it ok because she's percieved as a bitch?

Bunny's not sensitive. Bitches have no feelings. 'Member?

*Files nails and looks on boredly*

 

[A Desert Rose]

If someone wants to start a thread about how self absorbed and what an attention whore I am or KC is, go for it. And name names, it's ok.

I think that might be enlightening, educational and entertaining for many, including KC and me.

In regard to this thread: I don't know this OP and have never had an exchange with her. But I've found this to be a very good thread for me. It's given me a lot to think about in regard to my own behaviors, how I can improve myself and how I might be viewed by others.

I appreciate that she started this thread (whatever her reasons were) because it's caused me to do a lot of soul searching.

 

[nh23]

You want to start the threads... why?
Because you think that shining a bad light on X makes you look better. Self esteem issues are way way easy to see, no matter how the person tries to cover em or reverse em or whatever.

Oh, I'm sorry I never answered the rest of your question. I was being sarcastic when I said there were a lot of threads I'd like to start. I tend to be that way. I don't think I have low self esteem..not from my vantage point anyway. If I did start them though..it would probably be because I was growing weary of someone's bullshit. I mean face it if I started one would it make me look better? Not likely..it would make me look like a bitch.

 

[nh23]

If someone wants to start a thread about how self absorbed and what an attention whore I am or KC is, go for it. And name names, it's ok.

I think that might be enlightening, educational and entertaining for many, including KC and me.

In regard to this thread: I don't know this OP and have never had an exchange with her. But I've found this to be a very good thread for me. It's given me a lot to think about in regard to my own behaviors, how I can improve myself and how I might be viewed by others.

I appreciate that she started this thread (whatever her reasons were) because it's caused me to do a lot of soul searching.

*nods* The thread doesn't upset me at all. If I conveyed that I'm sorry. What I was trying to point out is the way we perceive things..I have a hard time with articulation sometimes..

 

[BiBunny]

If someone wants to start a thread about how self absorbed and what an attention whore I am or KC is, go for it. And name names, it's ok.

I think that might be enlightening, educational and entertaining for many, including KC and me.

In regard to this thread: I don't know this OP and have never had an exchange with her. But I've found this to be a very good thread for me. It's given me a lot to think about in regard to my own behaviors, how I can improve myself and how I might be viewed by others.

I appreciate that she started this thread (whatever her reasons were) because it's caused me to do a lot of soul searching.

ADR & KC =/= Attention whores. ADR & KC = Smart women whose posts I .

But I have considered making a thread called "Bunny Is Such A Fucking Bitch." It kicks ass that somebody else has already beaten me to it!

*Continues filing nails*

 

[Kajira Callista]

ADR & KC =/= Attention whores. ADR & KC = Smart women whose posts I .

But I have considered making a thread called "Bunny Is Such A Fucking Bitch." It kicks ass that somebody else has already beaten me to it!

*Continues filing nails*

*pets the bunny*

 

[Kajira Callista]

Haha.. I feel like we're in the question thread. Maybe no harm was meant. But it's all a matter of perspective isn't it? Wouldn't it have been more polite to have started it using X as an example instead of naming someone in particular? Maybe Bunny is sensitive about her shyness etc..and someone pointing it out and starting a thread using her as an example might be hurtful. Not that I know..we've not discussed it..just saying. Is it ok because she's percieved as a bitch?

No, I don't think it would be better. Why would she not use Bunny's name if she was quoting her post from another thread?
I really don't get the point you are/were trying to make, and when I am trying to understand something I ask questions.

 

[JamieB]

In regard to this thread: I don't know this OP and have never had an exchange with her. But I've found this to be a very good thread for me. It's given me a lot to think about in regard to my own behaviors, how I can improve myself and how I might be viewed by others.

I appreciate that she started this thread (whatever her reasons were) because it's caused me to do a lot of soul searching.

Agreed. This used to be an interesting thread.

J